Rumour Bluemour Discussion XXXV - 'Loopy' Season has begun

[sweethoney]

From memory (according to articles/news I used to see): I thought Burgess was regarded as the best in the business, then went to Liverpool, came back and his reputation wasn’t as good.

Now, he’s back to being the best?

Liverpool and arsenal had a heap of injuries when he was at both clubs. Could be why

 

[tarczonandjane]

Stamos is spot on. Both Buttifant and Russell were considered the best in the business when they came to us. Their reputations declined significantly at Carlton.

What that suggests to me is that the structures and technologies put around anyone coming in (e.g. Burgess) are going to be the main keys. Soapy V’s intel yesterday that Cook is making the area his chief focus is music to my ears.

I’m confident Burgess can achieve if we give him the right support. If not, we’ll be adding him to the list of people whose reputations were shredded while at the CFC.

 

[AndyLucimitis]

Get rid of the injury prone players

Yeh. Like a horse trainer - if I’m training Pride of Jenny or Winks I’m probably going to look like a genius.


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[Bluechip66]

Get rid of the injury prone players

At the rate we are going, that’s half our list!

 

[CFC_#17]

Stamos is spot on. Both Buttifant and Russell were considered the best in the business when they came to us. Their reputations declined significantly at Carlton.

What that suggests to me is that the structures and technologies put around anyone coming in (e.g. Burgess) are going to be the main keys. Soapy V’s intel yesterday that Cook is making the area his chief focus is music to my ears.

I’m confident Burgess can achieve if we give him the right support. If not, we’ll be adding him to the list of people whose reputations were shredded while at the CFC.

Russell was given to much control, got rid of anyone who would question him and replace them with yes men.

 

[ESKIE]

Get rid of the injury prone players

And stop trading in players with injury histories

 

[ESKIE]

Russell was given to much control, got rid of anyone who would question him and replace them with yes men.

Well that’s not good

 

[NewDarkNavyBlues]

Russell is an egotist. Heard this from two former club physios.

 

[Arr0w]

If you think Russell flogs players, Burgess is cut from a similar cloth

 

[Blueyourmyboy!!]

Our midfield doesn't just lack straight line speed, in fact this is the least important speed IMO. What it badly lacks is pace off the mark and agility speed. Cripps, Hewett and Kennedy when asked to move quickly to their right or left or over the first three metres aren't that great. That's our biggest issue.

Those midfields and players mentioned are pretty decent with agility, closing speed and being quick off the first few steps.

If you have the ball against those midfields, you are going to get closed in on and tackled a lot quicker than you would against us. On the flip side, those midfields had a good ability to carry the ball a short distance, two or three metres or more which allows the player to carry the ball out, pinpoint targets and play a possession game.

Cerra is not that flash either.

Lachie Neale or Greg Williams would actually make our midfield quicker in many ways.

Our midfield lacks a genuine goal kicking mid we just don't have one.
Sydney have 2 that's why they sit on top.
Petracca is Melbourne's and why they won it a few years back. If Petracca wants in surely Austin and co know he's the player to fill a glaring hole on our list. I don't know what it would take to get it done...maybe 2 firsts & Cerra or Cerra + Kemp and next years first. Who knows but need to clear some salary space aswell and Cerra is on good coin and kemps due for a pay rise so its an option.

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Stamos is spot on. Both Buttifant and Russell were considered the best in the business when they came to us. Their reputations declined significantly at Carlton.

What that suggests to me is that the structures and technologies put around anyone coming in (e.g. Burgess) are going to be the main keys. Soapy V’s intel yesterday that Cook is making the area his chief focus is music to my ears.

I’m confident Burgess can achieve if we give him the right support. If not, we’ll be adding him to the list of people whose reputations were shredded while at the CFC.

you're drawing a lot of bows there...."

"structures and technologies" - - what does that even mean?

 

[BIuebagger]

Vossy just on SEN, asked about Petracca and just felt like he left the door ajar on our interest.
Also re Doc for finals: seems like he was saying if Doc ticks the boxes, he is very very much in the frame for selection.

 

[swuzzlebubble]

If you think Russell flogs players, Burgess is cut from a similar cloth

It will be interesting how both the club and Burgess approach the situation.

 

[teagueyubeauty]

Burgess doesn’t need to flog the players, they’re hardened bodies with many years in them. We aren’t at the start of the rebuild with a list full of kids

Individual programs, the battle hardened and the under 23’s have very different programs and the ones that need to be managed to build up their strength and conditioning on muscles prone to failure have their own programs.

Would be much harder to manage as head of phys ed but it’s the only way




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[Wickzki]

Wow, looks like JSOS is the only player in Carlton history not to get better while injured!

FFS people, JSOS is 2nd only to Crippa in “want to win”, he was kicking ass before the injury.
People have seemingly forgotten how important it is to have a bloke on the field who is an incredibly smart footballer (something we seriously lack), halves every contest regardless of being out numbered & provides a solid lead up option.

With TDK improving he will 100% further improve the side as his inclusion stops Crippa/Kennedy taking ruck (which is blatantly stupid for Crippa to be doing IMO), it gives us a much more mobile, quick, effective spread & defence from clearance.

Two rucks will never be seen again (apart from injury) only problem we will face is that Voss wasn’t loving him but there has be growth and adaptation to our game style - JSOS seriously helps that

Look,I love Jack as much as the next lifelong Carlton supporter and appreciate his insight tremendously.

However, I too have significant reservations of how he will come back from injury. His footy brain and IQ has never been questioned. It's always been what has carried him as an AFL player. It has always made up for a lack of athleticism. Compared to most he is on the slower side and doesn't have great leap.

Knee injuries, even with modern medical science developing to the point where players get back to play at very high rates, still can damage a player's athleticism and agility.

Even if he gets back to 100% it often takes until the second season following surgery for it to happen.

Consequently, I believe that it's only natural to be reserved with his place in the best 22. Obviously, we all hope for the best.

 

[RAPPA]

Vossy just on SEN, asked about Petracca and just felt like he left the door ajar on our interest.
Also re Doc for finals: seems like he was saying if Doc ticks the boxes, he is very very much in the frame for selection.

That's good to hear re Doc. Everyone is different with ACL recoveries. Doc unfortunately in a veteran in the recovery department for that injury. People questioning whether he will be fit or not ignore that he will have been put through rigorous training sessions to battle test the knee. I'll take him to war because I know he won't shirk the contest.

 

[Wickzki]

If you think Russell flogs players, Burgess is cut from a similar cloth

This is my concern. Have spoken with a couple of Adelaide boys. They love him but both say they've never worked so hard in their life with one joking he didn't know how hard he could be worked (mid career, seen a lot).

If we want to get away from the work harder then you play philosophy he's taking us in the wrong direction.

That said, if we weren't listing half a dozen guys every year who you know the likelihood is 5 or so games we may be able to better sustain that philosophy.

This is why I'm kinda hoping for a clear out of the injury prone types and replacing them with healthy bodies. A few kids and a couple of deficiency filling ready to play best 22 calibre footy (even if they're not stars). That in itself would make a massive difference. Fill out deficits elsewhere but not necessarily make the superstar acquisition.

 

[El Topo]

Two rucks will never be seen again (apart from injury) only problem we will face is that Voss wasn’t loving him but there has be growth and adaptation to our game style - JSOS seriously helps that

It absolutely will, Voss has his preferred setup irrespective of whether not it makes any sense or whether we like it

 

[El Topo]

Stamos is spot on. Both Buttifant and Russell were considered the best in the business when they came to us. Their reputations declined significantly at Carlton.

What that suggests to me is that the structures and technologies put around anyone coming in (e.g. Burgess) are going to be the main keys. Soapy V’s intel yesterday that Cook is making the area his chief focus is music to my ears.

I’m confident Burgess can achieve if we give him the right support. If not, we’ll be adding him to the list of people whose reputations were shredded while at the CFC.

The current injury crisis has been rolling since we resurfaced PP at the end of 2017 - just a thought

 

[TENACIOUS]

Wow, looks like JSOS is the only player in Carlton history not to get better while injured!

FFS people, JSOS is 2nd only to Crippa in “want to win”, he was kicking ass before the injury.
People have seemingly forgotten how important it is to have a bloke on the field who is an incredibly smart footballer (something we seriously lack), halves every contest regardless of being out numbered & provides a solid lead up option.

With TDK improving he will 100% further improve the side as his inclusion stops Crippa/Kennedy taking ruck (which is blatantly stupid for Crippa to be doing IMO), it gives us a much more mobile, quick, effective spread & defence from clearance.

Two rucks will never be seen again (apart from injury) only problem we will face is that Voss wasn’t loving him but there has be growth and adaptation to our game style - JSOS seriously helps that

Round 1. We have a full list to chose from, who’s spot does Jack take?

 

[myblueroan]

If you think Russell flogs players, Burgess is cut from a similar cloth

Deear God I hope we are really thinking this through.

 

[DangerousD]

Harsh, but fair...
COYS.

View attachment 2096122

Now this isn’t supposed to be a dig at any club, but that’s Tottenham, imagine clubs like Barn Munich and Real Madrid.

 

[DangerousD]

Burgess at Melbourne had them in absolute tip top shape both on and off field. No coincidence since his departure the club has descended into complete chaos. I don't even care if he's the 'best' or not, as long as we can get our injuries to just on par with other teams I'd be happy. For almost a decade we've been consistently the worst or one of the worst for injuries practically non stop. Injury prone players definitely play a part in that but change was needed and Burgess is the top of the ladder in current footballing circles.

Questions still need to be asked and I’m sure they have but a real in depth look at why, a person Russell, who has been successful everywhere else, had a terrible record at our club?

I find it crazy that someone so well regarded and trained, with a fantastic resume comes and performs worse than at anytime in his career.

This is the concern regardless of who we hire.

 

[DangerousD]

Get rid of the injury prone players

Fogarty, Doherty, Silvagni, Motlop, Williams, Cerra, McGovern?

How deep do you think we should go? Our injury prone players dont end with Cunners, Marcxhy and Martin.

 

[Canyouhearthedrums]

Felt like this after Russell tho gotta be honest

Exactly. Same risks of being past it, not up to date etc.