Fixture Changes v Plastics Round 8

[Dogs_r_barking]

So Lobb will be up against his old mob this week, wonder how he will go.

 

[geoffjennings79]

So Lobb will be up against his old mob this week, wonder how he will go.

First game for Freo against the plastics (at Manuka in 2019) he played ruck,had 22 hitouts - to Mumford's 42.
First game for us v Freo he had his chances, just fluffed his shots.
Wonder if the plastics will try to rough him up like the anchors?

Hopefully he at least lands on Green - hard, with his entire 100kg+ frame - in a tackle, or preferably from a marking contest - greater height, more downward velocity. Or sticks his foot out to 'protect' himself in a mark, and his boot 'caresses' Green's throat/face/both.

 

[Libbaaaa]

No Sam Taylor

15

Sam Taylor

Age

25

Ht

198cm

Wt

95kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.0

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

5.4

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.1

4star

MG

130.5

2star

D

8.0

2star

K

2.5

1star

HB

5.5

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.5

3star

MG

60.8

1star

D

8.6

3star

K

3.0

1star

HB

5.6

4star

M

1.2

2star

T

2.8

5star

MG

110.8

2star

is massive for us.

 

[doggiesin08]

Won’t be this week but where does Darcy get back into the team? If we’ve given up on the 4-headed monster up forward then either his form demands it over Lobb or it’s as a KPD.

I’m curious if he’s playing ruck in the VFL with a view to having him in that role longer term (and insurance if English leaves) or it’s all just about building his fitness.

 

[Golden_6]

No Sam Taylor is massive for us.

They're definitely going to be undersized in defence. Haynes, Buckley & Idon are all 2nd or 3rd tall types. We should have the size advantage in every KPF matchup. They might bring Keeffe in just to take care of the Lobb matchup.

 

[Unorth]

I'd be surprised if Garcia ever gives up 3x 50m penalties in one game again. Or even two.
He would have been told - we love the aggression but don't do any more of that stupid stuff.
It'll be a shame if in true BF fashion he gets labelled as a chronic 50m penalty risk based on that one game. Let's judge him on his next few games, not just that one shocker.

Can't recall West ever giving up 3 in one game - did it happen?

some exaggeration there - just saying that both Garcia and West have natural aggression (good) but both are prone to overdoing it. Which probably plays into why Bev selects certain players over them. A matter of trust, and we know how much Bev hates a lack of discipline.

I think coming in to the side to add pressure and aggression while also being on the fringe and knowing you are at risk of being dropped for making mistakes could explain Garcia and Wests last couple of games to some extent. They seem to overthink or overdo it in an attempt to carve out a role in the side. They also both get played out of position…but so do a few others so I don’t think it’s much of an excuse for them.

 

[stefoid]

Apparently libba passed the concussion tests just fine - how they would tell, Im not sure, but hes playing

 

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

Won’t be this week but where does Darcy get back into the team? If we’ve given up on the 4-headed monster up forward then either his form demands it over Lobb or it’s as a KPD.

I’m curious if he’s playing ruck in the VFL with a view to having him in that role longer term (and insurance if English leaves) or it’s all just about building his fitness.

I think the four tall forward line is less our desired structure and more a, we think we can get away with it if all of them are in good form. So I suspect he's not back in until his form demands it or we cop an injury.

He played ruck because Sweet was injured.

 

[ossie_21]

They're definitely going to be undersized in defence. Haynes, Buckley & Idon are all 2nd or 3rd tall types. We should have the size advantage in every KPF matchup. They might bring Keeffe in just to take care of the Lobb matchup.

 

[goodcop badcop]

Yeah very fair points although I’d argue some of those like Young/Schache were more out of necessity rather than just spinning the magnets for the sake of it.

It is concerning how quick we are to abandon an ‘experiment’ at times, I mean the 4 talls wasn’t great but everyone knew it was going to take more than 2 weeks for something like that to pay off. A lot of these moves last one week or even less, if you’re going to do it at least buy in and give it some sort of chance.

Honestly it can feel a bit like we’re just flinging s**t at the wall at times and seeing what sticks, with no real direction to what we want to be as a football team. I can handle poor performances if there’s a clear directive with everyone pulling towards an obvious goal but I can’t stomach it when it’s a merry go round of random tactics and crap players.

The last month or so we’ve seemed a lot more settled which has me feeling a lot better about the year even if the results haven’t been amazing (but solid)

And yeah the Hannan love in just makes no sense to me, he’s not even your typical Bevo love child who does the non-negotiables well and is great ‘team’ cog. He’s a pretty selfish player tbh with huge swings between his best and worst, zero consistency - in reality he’s the worst kind of role player/bottom 6 because he can’t even be relied on to at least offer something defensively or stability to the team. Since when has Bevo ever liked guys like this? Yet here we are… it’s a head scratcher

Well, we still had backup options, Beveridge just decided to try something different. Young and Khamis were options down back. We had Sweet as a backup ruck option, but we obviously decided he wasn't up to it. I think from memory we also had Cavarra and Hayes as backup options in 2021 but were hardly used. Crozier too last year was hardly used as a backup defender and instead we tried Hannan and Treloar. It just seems a bit weird to me, that we have these depth players on the list, then choose not to use them. It's just a waste.

As for 4 tall forward experiment, I wouldn't be surprised if we try it again but more into the distant future. I don't think we have good enough pressure and crumbing players for it to work at the moment. Plus playing two young key forwards can lead to very inconsistent results, one young key forward playing is enough unless you're a bottom team.

 

[lachy]

As for 4 tall forward experiment, I wouldn't be surprised if we try it again but more into the distant future. I don't think we have good enough pressure and crumbing players for it to work at the moment. Plus playing two young key forwards can lead to very inconsistent results, one young key forward playing is enough unless your a bottom team.

Whether it is 4, 3 or 2 Tall forwards our issue is not just have the small pressure forwards in there, it is the total lack of separation of our talls inclusive of starting positions and leading patterns, when we actually lead that has our talls and Flea all going for the same ball. Unless we actually create separation through starting positions and movement, not only will our talls be competing for the same ball, they will also be bringing their opponents into the contest nullifying any 1 v 1 opportunities and hit up leads to space

 

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

Whether it is 4, 3 or 2 Tall forwards our issue is not just have the small pressure forwards in there, it is the total lack of separation of our talls inclusive of starting positions and leading patterns, when we actually lead that has our talls and Flea all going for the same ball. Unless we actually create separation through starting positions and movement, not only will our talls be competing for the same ball, they will also be bringing their opponents into the contest nullifying any 1 v 1 opportunities and hit up leads to space

I can't remember the specific details, but there was one forward entry on the weekend where every single one of our players led to the same direction. There was a massive hole of space in front of goal - literally like we were all playing ring around the rosie around the most dangerous part of the ground - and nobody pushed into it. The way our players create and use space is a big, big problem.

 

[The Slitherin' Snake]

Have a look who brought the ball to ground to get the stoppage where Daniel kicked his goal,

If you stop wanting Lobb to fail you'll realise he is playing his role just fine and is a significant upgrade to Cordy and Schache

Agree. I was against us getting Lobb but i think he has played his role ok so far this year and was pretty good on the weekend.

 

[The Slitherin' Snake]

First game for Freo against the plastics (at Manuka in 2019) he played ruck,had 22 hitouts - to Mumford's 42.
First game for us v Freo he had his chances, just fluffed his shots.
Wonder if the plastics will try to rough him up like the anchors?

Hopefully he at least lands on Green - hard, with his entire 100kg+ frame - in a tackle, or preferably from a marking contest - greater height, more downward velocity. Or sticks his foot out to 'protect' himself in a mark, and his boot 'caresses' Green's throat/face/both.

I don't think the tough stuff worries Greene. I'd back Libba to be mouthing off to him at every opportunity though. Get him distracted rather than roughed up

 

[goodcop badcop]

Whether it is 4, 3 or 2 Tall forwards our issue is not just have the small pressure forwards in there, it is the total lack of separation of our talls inclusive of starting positions and leading patterns, when we actually lead that has our talls and Flea all going for the same ball. Unless we actually create separation through starting positions and movement, not only will our talls be competing for the same ball, they will also be bringing their opponents into the contest nullifying any 1 v 1 opportunities and hit up leads to space

Agreed, which is another reason why we can't play 4 talls at the moment. At least the extra small helps our forward pressure and gives us an extra runner.

 

[_Cerberus_]

Who mans up on Greene? He has been their form player this season. Probably the leading AA small forward at this point.

 

[Unorth]

Who mans up on Greene? He has been their form player this season. Probably the leading AA small forward at this point.

Assume Duryea but Bev doesn’t usually worry too much about matchups in that sense. We’ve seen Bailey Dale on Greene at times. He tends to back in the system (our mids) to get the job done and take it out of the hands of 1 v 1 matchups. Greene probably kicks a bag but as long as the rest of the team is kept quiet…

 

[The Slitherin' Snake]

Assume Duryea but Bev doesn’t usually worry too much about matchups in that sense. We’ve seen Bailey Dale on Greene at times. He tends to back in the system (our mids) to get the job done and take it out of the hands of 1 v 1 matchups. Greene probably kicks a bag but as long as the rest of the team is kept quiet…

Agree that is probably what will happen, but i'd love to see someone (Duryea) just given the job and to stick to him like glue.

 

[geoffjennings79]

I don't think the tough stuff worries Greene. I'd back Libba to be mouthing off to him at every opportunity though. Get him distracted rather than roughed up

I wasn't suggesting tough stuff - more outright violence, especially if he's not expecting it!

 

[ossie_21]

Who mans up on Greene? He has been their form player this season. Probably the leading AA small forward at this point.

Duryea first crack, Richards if it’s not working

 

[Martyn_30_]

Assume Duryea but Bev doesn’t usually worry too much about matchups in that sense. We’ve seen Bailey Dale on Greene at times. He tends to back in the system (our mids) to get the job done and take it out of the hands of 1 v 1 matchups. Greene probably kicks a bag but as long as the rest of the team is kept quiet…

Greene never gets a specific match up, which is why his best record against all teams is the bulldogs. He's too smart on transition to have players try to roll over to him when he's nearby.

 

[Libba39]

Greene is a star, he is going to kick some goals. I am more concerned about the midfield. Hopefully it all clicks for us with Libba back and Baz with games under their belt.

 

[doggies ftw]

I’d give Richards the job on Greene for the full game, agree with the thoughts above that you can’t just rely on the ‘system’ on some forwards and Greenes one of those guys, if he’s held they’re are 100% not kicking a winning score - sometimes you have to compromise to not let oppositions match winners do their thing (as we know blooooody too well)

Just like against Geelong in a couple of weeks Gardner needs to come in and glue himself to Cameron, we’re just not winning if we think we can let him do what he wants and the ‘system’ will cover him, nah he’ll kick 10 and we’ll lose by 60. Not like last year when our ‘system taking care of itself’ resulted in our big bulky FB chasing Cameron up the field & our athletic 2nd tall wrestling with Hawkins one out, hard to watch at times.

Red is the only one who could go with Greene both on the ground and aerially, I think he’d relish the task - plus we’re not as reliant on his run with JJ/Dale back there (can roll CD through too if really needed) and not as reliant on his intercepting with TOB going alright & Jones, so it’s a good time to try it

 

[VogonProsthetnic]

Gardiner might be a good option for Greene.

Don’t think we could afford to lose Richards rebounding.

 

[dogwatch]

Gardiner might be a good option for Greene.

Don’t think we could afford to lose Richards rebounding.

Greene would murder* Gardner at ground level.

* I know Toby's got some history but I should clarify that's just a metaphorical statement.