List Mgmt. Christmas comes early (Nov 28 - 19 sleeps) - Draftee discussion

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Obeanie1 said:
Maybe.

However it would need to be an absolute super dooper draft next year for picks 20 and 28 to be better than pick 7 this year.
Click to expand...
Probably just as much chance to trade up next year. Suns and Maybe even Lions picks might be up for grabs. Crows and Freo are a chance of trading out there future 1sts so there will be opportunities.
Just have to wait and see I guess
 

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Obeanie1 said:
Fair. But that is an indicator that its a reasonable trade another club would seriously consider.

Not landing a top 10 pick without paying a reasonable price.
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I think if this were done in a live trading scenario and north were to pick Cadman at one, 2 and a single future second may even it done for 5 and 7.

They get sheezel almost instantly replacing rankine.
 
Cornelius Roy said:
I think if this were done in a live trading scenario and north were to pick Cadman at one, 2 and a single future second may even it done for 5 and 7.

They get sheezel almost instantly replacing rankine.
Click to expand...
I think sheezel will be much better at the next level too

On SM-G973F using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
PremiershipNo4 said:
Would it be worthwhile trading our 2023 1st Rd pick for 2 1st rounders in order his draft?
Give us 3 in the 1st round, 3 in the 2nd.
Instant midfield.
Click to expand...
Probably better off if next year is a strong draft to keep the 2023 pick and actually bring 2024 pick forward.
 
Keys said:
Is Cadman a toys out of the cot selection or would it be dependant on who we bring in with our other picks?

I’ve long held the view that we should be taking a midfielder with our first pick because it’s the area of greatest need. :whitecheck: :whitecheck: :whitecheck:
Click to expand...

Keys said:
But the impression I’m getting from people who’s opinion I value is that the mids this year aren’t quite projecting at the superstar level of other years :whitecheck: :whitecheck:

With that in mind, a talented KPF we can develop, might not be the worst option. :whitecheck:
Click to expand...

Pretty good assessment of the draft cohort.

Keys this is how I view this draft and some of my issues and thoughts.

IMO there are three bust proof players in this cohort that I rate as sure things: Sheezel, Clark and Busslinger.

I also hold the view that Sheezel is the most talented player in this cohort.
There is a real shortage, of quality KPD in this draft and if you really need one Busslinger is the best of them and is IMO a top 6 pick.
Clark is the best balanced mid in the cohort in terms of consistency and thats why Clubs are attracted to him.

Now of those three bust proof players, I see two of them as being players that other Clubs may consider trading up for and thats Sheezel and Busslinger.

This years draft cohort top end has been hard to rank and assess for a few reasons:

1. Ashcroft's landing spot has already been determined, it's just when the bid comes, so he is not in the conversation.
2. Wardlaw has been like the Scarlet Pimpernel, we all know of him but haven't seen much of him on the park.
3. Tsatas to a lesser extent has had a very injury interrupted year.
4. Busslinger checked out of the Championships early, for shoulder surgery, so we didn't get to see the best of him, or see him as often.


So thats three top five prospects that have had their Championships and/or back end of the seasons compromised.

The pool of midfielders in this years cohort are OK quality without IMO any being the standouts that have generally been available in most other years.
They will be very serviceable but none at this point scream elite .... yet..... but history tells us that one or two will most probably become so, but right at the minute its a guessing game as to who those may be.

Then we overlap both our picks and our needs.

I too agree with you that we desperately need a quality midfielder and an inside or balanced one at that, as its our area of greatest need.

With no projected superstars mids available for pick 2, that throws up a bit of a conundrum for the Pie Man & Co.

What they will have access to that we plebs aren't privy to are the medicals and psychological assessments and of the Interview intel.

Some of my concerns are:

Wardlaw's hamstrings if he hadn't been injured so much 1. I would have a much greater body of work to assess him by and would feel more confident making an assessment as to his quality and 2. the repeat injuries to his hammy's are a worry. Pre his run of hammy injuries I was of the opinion that he is a perfect fit for our draft needs.

Tsatas is an outside running machine and has both the speed and endurance that we need, his kicking I do have a bit of an issue with but that said, he is a viable option for us to add to our list as he ticks several needs boxes.

Busslinger is quality, but he plays in a position thats a need but not the highest priority positional need.

Clark is not a sexy pick and he has a bit of the "very serviceable player" feel that will be a B+ player and probable has a lower ceiling than you would ideally like for pick 2 in the draft.

Then there is a cluster of players that I have grouped together: Mackenzie, Cadman, Phillipou, Hewett, Jefferson, Humphrey, Hayes, George, Ginbey, Hotton, Hollands, Fletcher, Keeler, Hustwaite, Konstanty, Szybkoski and Lemmey, Davey.... that all come into contention as potential first rounders... the list is not meant to be either exclusive or definitive, more so suggestive only.

I have a White Board of 56 draftable player that, by comparison to other years is a bit light on for numbers, but has a real evenness through picks 15 - 30.


Ok ......... apologies for the lengthy spiel but thats the context in which the following comes.

We have a very good ( our best for a while ) draft hand and that presents us with a real opportunity to get in at least four potentially best 22 players for the future.

In an ideal world I would like a couple of mids and either a KPP or a ruck.



Where does all the chatter about us taking Cadman come from?

Some of those in the know have reported that we have sent scouts to watch several of his games and we have put time into him.
Would a KPF be a bad pick up for any team..... obviously NO, its just when in the draft, being the only difference between Clubs prioritising the position.

We know that the Pie Man & Co do love their tall's and history shows us if they rate them as best available at the pick they don't hesitate to do so, The Pie Man himself has stated that with first round picks he goes best available regardless of needs.


Maybe we rate Cadman best available?
But also just as plausible we are expecting and planning for a pick split.

The chatter is that Hawthorn have a massive hard on for Sheezel and that Essendon like Tsatas and that a couple of KPP are on GWS radar and who can ever predict what silly trades Gold Coast will do.


I am as conflicted this year, as to just who we will take as I have ever been.

Best player available - but not a genuine mid is Sheezel.
Best fits our needs - if he is, hamstring wise OK is Wardlaw.
Best compromise combining talent / durability and needs is Clark.
Best projection of a player with high ceiling and talent is Phiilipou.


I suspect that we will do very little player trade ins, during trade period.
The piece of business getting the best pick in compensation for Rioli will be our main focus, although it wouldn't surprise me if a couple of contracted fringe players ask for a trade.

I am also expecting that leading into Draft Night, we keep pick 2 and that depending who North take.......then a live trade on the night, that would have been previously sounded out with a Club or two will come into play and we will have already planned these contingencies with both specific Clubs and players in mind.


Or all the above is just more crap and musings of a senile old man.
 
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CountryLad said:
Pr

Probably just as much chance to trade up next year. Suns and Maybe even Lions picks might be up for grabs. Crows and Freo are a chance of trading out there future 1sts so there will be opportunities.
Just have to wait and see I guess
Click to expand...

Yep. Next year we can trade into the 1st or 2nd round using future picks.

This is something we need to do more of. Buy now pay later.

Other clubs worked that out years ago, Eagles....not so much.
 
TerryFilk said:
Pick 2 on Ginbey would be one of the most funniest reaches I’ve ever seen, are you serious
Click to expand...

If he ends up the best player in the draft its not reaching.

He is a pick about 8 currently but his end of season was so damn good he could go higher.

Been watching colts footy for a long time and his rate of improvement has been significant since the championships

Have you watched his games since the championships ?
 
Mattman93 said:
Any idea who we're particularly into at this stage (particularly for first pick)?

You had early word on our interest in Hough last year from what I recall.
Click to expand...
I know WCE are into Kaleb Smith.
With our first pick not sure maybe will trade it for two first round picks
 
ArdentEagle said:
I didn't realise Ginbey was that fast. Do you have any draft camp/testing results mate?
If thats the case, I already want him more than Tsatas.
Click to expand...
East Perth defender Reuben Ginbey, Swan Districts pocket rocket Darcy Jones, Perth’s Baxter Phillip and Claremont midfielders Mitch Barron and Lewis Crump were among the best performers in Sunday’s WAFL colts testing day at Gold Netball Centre.

Ginbey, who is shaping up as one of WA’s biggest draft bolters this year after a breakout season at PSA level with Wesley College, blitzed the 20m sprint with a time of 2.855 seconds.

The 17-year-old Dunsborough product has already started training with the Royals’ seniors alongside fellow draft prospect Jedd Busslinger and is one to watch for the upcoming season.


Fremantle captain Nat Fyfe is no certainty to play for the Dockers this weekend.

CAUTIOUS APPROACHFyfe far from firm for pre-season return​

Mitchell Woodcock and Mark Duffield
Swans colts premiership midfielder Jones won the vertical jump with 84cm and posted another top-five finish in the running vertical jump (left) with 99cm.

Barron, who came back from a long-term ankle issue late last season, easily topped the agility testing with 7.875 seconds while he Tigers teammate Crump was among the best in the running vertical jump (left) with 100cm and 20m sprint with 2.901 seconds.


Phillip came third in the vertical jump (80cm) and agility (8.14 seconds), while East Fremantle’s Jayke Scott (21.7) was second behind Perth’s Kalib Dempster-Park (21.8) in the yo-yo test and third in the 20m sprint (2.896 seconds).

Highly rated 2023 Swans draft prospect Riley Hardeman, who played in last year’s colts grand final as a 15-year-old, finished fifth in two different vertical jump categories.

Claremont utility and son of a gun Ed Allan (back), East Fremantle speedster Koen Sanchez (groin) and East Perth/West Coast Next Generation Academy talent Jordyn Baker (knee), all part of the State Talent Academy, didn’t test because of injury but shouldn’t be sidelined for too much longer.

About 270 players tested from the nine WAFL colts teams.


WA Football Commission State talent manager Adam Jones is bullish about this year’s draft crop and believes there will be plenty of top-end talent, led by powerful Swan Districts midfielder Elijah Hewett and Royals key defender Busslinger.

Top-five results​

Vertical jump

84cm: Darcy Jones (Swan Districts)

81cm: Riley Wills (Subiaco)

80cm: Baxter Phillip (Perth), Elijah Hewett (Swan Districts)

79cm: Riley Hardeman (Swan Districts)

Running vertical jump (right)


100cm: Tristen Burgess (Swan Districts)

98cm: Coen Hay (Swan Districts)

97cm: Harrison Creighton (Swan Districts)

93cm: Kody Katauskas (Claremont)

92cm: Riley Hardeman (Swan Districts)

Running vertical jump (left)

105cm: Baxter Phillip (Perth)

103cm: Colin Skeen (Swan Districts)


100cm: Lewis Crump (Claremont), Darcy Miller (East Perth)

99cm: Darcy Jones (Swan Districts)

20m sprint

2.855 seconds: Reuben Ginbey (East Perth)

2.895: Aiden Carroll (South Fremantle)

2.896: Jayke Scott (East Fremantle)

2.9: Aiden Nelson (West Perth)

2.901: Lewis Crump (Claremont)

Agility

7.875 seconds: Mitch Barron (Claremont)

8.013: Patrick Weldon (East Perth)

8.14: Baxter Phillip (Perth)

8.142: Cooper Moore (Perth)

8.156: Jessie Hollins (South West)

Yo-yo

21.8: Kalib Dempster-Park (Perth)

21.7: Jayke Scott (East Fremantle), Taj Wyburd (Peel Thunder), Jessie Hollins (South West), Ethan Donaghy (Peel Thunder)
 

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Monocle said:
Pretty good assessment of the draft cohort.

Keys this is how I view this draft and some of my issues and thoughts.

IMO there are three bust proof players in this cohort that I rate as sure things: Sheezel, Clark and Busslinger.

I also hold the view that Sheezel is the most talented player in this cohort.
There is a real shortage, of quality KPD in this draft and if you really need one Busslinger is the best of them and is IMO a top 6 pick.
Clark is the best balanced mid in the cohort in terms of consistency and thats why Clubs are attracted to him.

Now of those three bust proof players, I see two of them as being players that other Clubs may consider trading up for and thats Sheezel and Busslinger.

This years draft cohort top end has been hard to rank and assess for a few reasons:

1. Ashcroft's landing spot has already been determined, it's just when the bid comes, so he is not in the conversation.
2. Wardlaw has been like the Scarlet Pimpernel, we all know of him but haven't seen much of him on the park.
3. Tsatas to a lesser extent has had a very injury interrupted year.
4. Busslinger checked out of the Championships early, for shoulder surgery, so we didn't get to see the best of him, or see him as often.


So thats three top five prospects that have had their Championships and/or back end of the seasons compromised.

The pool of midfielders in this years cohort are OK quality without IMO any being the standouts that have generally been available in most other years.
They will be very serviceable but none at this point scream elite .... yet..... but history tells us that one or two will most probably become so, but right at the minute its a guessing game as to who those may be.

Then we overlap both our picks and our needs.

I too agree with you that we desperately need a quality midfielder and an inside or balanced one at that, as its our area of greatest need.

With no projected superstars mids available for pick 2, that throws up a bit of a conundrum for the Pie Man & Co.

What they will have access to that we plebs aren't privy to are the medicals and psychological assessments and of the Interview intel.

Some of my concerns are:

Wardlaw's hamstrings if he hadn't been injured so much 1. I would have a much greater body of work to assess him by and would feel more confident making an assessment as to his quality and 2. the repeat injuries to his hammy's are a worry. Pre his run of hammy injuries I was of the opinion that he is a perfect fit for our draft needs.

Tsatas is an outside running machine and has both the speed and endurance that we need, his kicking I do have a bit of an issue with but that said, he is a viable option for us to add to our list as he ticks several needs boxes.

Busslinger is quality, but he plays in a position thats a need but not the highest priority positional need.

Clark is not a sexy pick and he has a bit of the "very serviceable player" feel that will be a B+ player and probable has a lower ceiling than you would ideally like for pick 2 in the draft.

Then there is a cluster of players that I have grouped together: Mackenzie, Cadman, Phillipou, Hewett, Jefferson, Humphrey, Hayes, George, Ginbey, Hotton, Hollands, Fletcher, Keeler, Hustwaite, Konstanty, Szybkoski and Lemmey, Davey.... that all come into contention as potential first rounders... the list is not meant to be either exclusive or definitive, more so suggestive only.

I have a White Board of 56 draftable player that, by comparison to other years is a bit light on for numbers, but has a real evenness through picks 15 - 30.


Ok ......... apologies for the lengthy spiel but thats the context in which the following comes.

We have a very good ( our best for a while ) draft hand and that presents us with a real opportunity to get in at least four potentially best 22 players for the future.

In an ideal world I would like a couple of mids and either a KPP or a ruck.



Where does all the chatter about us taking Cadman come from?

Some of those in the know have reported that we have sent scouts to watch several of his games and we have put time into him.
Would a KPF be a bad pick up for any team..... obviously NO, its just when in the draft, being the only difference between Clubs prioritising the position.

We know that the Pie Man & Co do love their tall's and history shows us if they rate them as best available at the pick they don't hesitate to do so, The Pie Man himself has stated that with first round picks he goes best available regardless of needs.


Maybe we rate Cadman best available?
But also just as plausible we are expecting and planning for a pick split.

The chatter is that Hawthorn have a massive hard on for Sheezel and that Essendon like Tsatas and that a couple of KPP are on GWS radar and who can ever predict what silly trades Gold Coast will do.


I am as conflicted this year, as to just who we will take as I have ever been.

Best player available - but not a genuine mid is Sheezel.
Best fits our needs - if he is, hamstring wise OK is Wardlaw.
Best compromise combining talent / durability and needs is Clark.
Best projection of a player with high ceiling and talent is Phiilipou.


I suspect that we will do very little player trade ins, during trade period.
The piece of business getting the best pick in compensation for Rioli will be our main focus, although it wouldn't surprise me if a couple of contracted fringe players ask for a trade.

I am also expecting that leading into Draft Night, we keep pick 2 and that depending who North take.......then a live trade on the night, that would have been previously sounded out with a Club or two will come into play and we will have already planned these contingencies with both specific Clubs and players in mind.


Or all the above is just more crap and musings of a senile old man.
Click to expand...
We should take Phillipou (assuming his back is not a degenerative issue), I think he ends up the best player from this draft.
 
I'll be very very happy with Warlord/Shez/Cadman

The fact warlord is still up there as pick 1 without playing a single is seriously amazing. He is that good.

The rest are B+ players who are not generational players and I have no hope of them becoming.
 
EagleEgo said:
Taking about Cadman, historically, WCE had more success with tall key positional players from local WA than from eastern states!
Click to expand...
If we insist on taking Casboult 2.0 I hope we split the pick and take a mid with other one.
He seems like the kind of player who is going to be incredibly frustrating to watch
 
People rag on this draft. But it seems like one of the most balanced drafts?

Bus/Cadman/Shez/Warlord all elite in there lines

Then

You have Scully, Broad, and Lemmy
 
random260 said:
People rag on this draft. But it seems like one of the most balanced drafts?

Bus/Cadman/Shez/Warlord all elite in there lines

Then

You have Scully, Broad, and Lemmy
Click to expand...
First 25 are good solid draftees, after that will still be some great picks but not as strong.

Last year you'll recall Hough and Bazzo we're still there between 25 to 35 and we're plenty of great picks around them. It's just not as strong as that draft.
 
Predicting one of GWS, Essendon, Hawks or Gold Coast will come for pick two.

We still end up with a top 6 pick and get who we want plus we land a low 2nd minimum.

I look at the players from 15 to 20 and really dont see too much difference to playersranked around 21 to 26. Would be nice to land 3 picks in that 21 to 26 range.

Hawks 6, 24 and Brockman for pick 2.

Essendon 4, 22 and future 3rd for 2 and our future 4th.

GWS 3, 19, 21 for 2 and our future 2nd. Or just 3 and 21 for 2. Would love to have first 3 picks in the 2nd round.

Suns 5, 25, 31, 34 for 2 and either our or Ports future 2nd or our 38.

Just need to get these four clubs wanting to jump ahead of each other to land their target. Bingo!
 
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