List Mgmt. Contracts, trades, draft - 2021 offseason edition

[Keys]

So the 2021 season is officially done and dusted.

It’s time now to fully turn our attention to the off season and what we can do through the trade period/draft to chase down Melbourne in 2022.

List and personnel changes have already been made and I’ll update this OP as and when any further changes are made.

As it stands these are our official list changes :

Out -
• Venables (R) - retired
• Vardy - retired
• Hutchings (R) - delisted
• Ah Chee (R) - delisted
• Ainsworth - delisted
• Johnson - delisted
• Collins (R) - delisted
• Brander - cluster****
• Cameron - retired/delisted not that it was officially acknowledged by the club
• Sheppard - retired

Inactive listed -
• Cole
• Chesser

In -
• Petrevski-Seton - traded for pick 52
• Chesser - Pick 14
• Hough - Pick 31
• Bazzo - Pick 37
• Williams (Jack) - Pick 57
• Clark - Pick 62
• Dixon - SSP
• Joyce - SSP
• Strnadica - SSP
• Naish - SSP

Players on main list - 37 (Including 2 inactive)
Players on rookie list - 7

Future trade picks :
In - Port Adelaide future 2nd
Out - Future 4th

Assistant Coaches :
• Out - Graham, Hickmott
• In - Schofield (Strategy and Stoppage), Knights (Midfield), Wiley (WAFL coach), Brennan (development)

Link to contract status of all players -

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R) Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Current contract status (Updated 18/10/24) : Total 39 Players -...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[BeornJ]

We’ve got a decent enough crop of guys 28 and under. Looking at guys born 1994 and after:

Cole, Barrass, Rotham
Duggan, Edwards, Witherden
Sheed, Kelly, Edwards
Rioli, Waterman, Petruccelle
Jones, Allen, Ryan
Williams, Sheed, Nelson
Foley, Jamieson, West, Winder
Sub: Langdon

There’s definitely some weaknesses there: chiefly the midfield (note that Yeo just missed the cutoff, Gaff, Shuey and Redden missed by a long way) and ruck where we’re extremely reliant on NicNat. We need to address those areas in the draft.

Sheed Clone already our best player

 

[Into The Black]

Why?

The old one is outdated, been found out and doesn't work.

If we remain predictable and use slow ball movement from defense then what is the point?

Agreed, maintaining the ball at all costs, ie going backwards, sideways etc is as hard to watch as it is to play. Just signing Hurn and JK on sort of seems there will be a bit of the same but with a few tweaks ?

 

[shooshka]

All but confirms that Freo will now have 2 picks ahead of us in the draft. I think they’ll go a mid and a KPF. Interesting to see if they go local or Vic kids after Cerra’s departure.

The more clubs with multiple picks before our first the better it is for us.

Higher likelihood of them drafting for needs rather than best-available.

 

[Into The Black]

Doesn’t bringing in two experienced, big name assistant coaches for the midfield suggest the opposite?

Really hope so. We kinda changed later in the season with Cole becoming the release player from the backline. I think Rotham as others have said should be that player or looking to run from the backline. It has all been said, but we need to be fitter to implement a new game plan. Obviously we addressed a need in the two midfield coaches so a definite positive.

 

[Dark Sharks]

We really need Ash Smith to come on and be that run and carry player we all know he can be.

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

Winder is the one I'm excited about. Caught the last stream he played WAFL and just saw a few glimpses of what he can do that I thought was pretty cool.

Same, reckon he's got real potential. I remember Winder had a sparkling start to last season (kicked 5 in his first game) and then came on as the sub against the Saints. He had a long term injury after that, and came back and had a big bandage on his knee and didn't look like he was moving as freely.

Hoping he's right to go for presason and can break into the side.

 

[KERRPOW]

Adding Hewett and Cerra means there's no chance SPS gets midfield time, so he'll definitely stick with wanting to leave, no matter how they spin it as Voss talking to him and him potentially staying.

Where does carlton find the salary cap for these players.

 

[The_Gambler]

Combination of a bit or wear & tear together with a running action that causes inflammation.
Rest will help along with some surgical intervention. Not hearing its as dire as 1 poster here wants to suggest

arthritis is irreversible, “running action that causes inflammation” is nonsense and likely is weight bearing activities exacerbating degenerating change, surgical intervention for arthritis is placebo at best and does not work outside of a hip replacement, but agree rest I.e. retirement will help his hip. His condition is dire for an elite sportsmen!!

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

Anyone know much of:

Richard Farmer:



Arthur Jones:

https://www.espn.com.au/afl/story/_...ap-jason-horne-francis-turns-performance-year

I read in the West this week that Arthur Jones is our NGA, but can't find anything that backs that up. He was awesome in the game on the weekend, lightning quick and used his dash and skill nicely. I was impressed. Would be nice if he made it through to Cat B (if he is our NGA).

Farmer, had a good game too. Seen him a few times now, he's quick and great skills but I worry he's too small and light. Tyrone Thorne was similar from a few years back and didn't get drafted.

Been watching the WAFL prelim (Swan Districts vs East Freo) and our NGA - Lawson Humphries looks seriously good. I cannot work out, how he hasn't got a game for the state side. He's a mid sized defender, takes nice intercept marks and kicking is very good.

 

[shooshka]

Where does carlton find the salary cap for these players.

They balance their list with a heap of spuds. Also take lots and lots of picks each draft - with the triple benefits of them having lower salaries, selling hope to their supporters, and ensuring they are not a contender (actually that 3rd benefit is just what the rest of the league gets out of it!)

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

1) There was a large number of high end players affected by substantial injuries. I accept risk comes with age - but one would hope that both mirror that got cracked & the black cat that got skittled have both been replaced for 22.

2) To suggest there is no improvement in the group because they're too old is simply wrong. Allen, Duggan, Rotham, Foley, Williams, both Edwards, Trew, Winder etc have enormous potential for development based on age and that is a third of a team right there. And I can see many of these as 1st choice players round 1 next year

3) Critical players like Yeo, Ryan, Kelly and Barrass are still young enough to become better and more consistent.

4) Rioli is important and available.

Fine line between glass half full & half empty.

So in a nutshell, your thoughts on our list and club is that it is no time to die!!!


I sensed the club drew a line in the sand in the last month and publicly at a number of levels admitted we had underperformed (and probably for 2 years). I was happy that the problems were being aired and addressed. A problem recognised is a problem on the way to being fixed.

BUT talk by you of black cats and mirrors worries me as it feels like we are back making excuses.

Let me set the scene with the facts on 7 games. We played the top 6 and only doubled up with Dogs. We went 1-6 for those games and lost 6 by an average margin of 50 points. Glad we had a relatively easy draw then with only once playing the top 6 teams twice and the games were split as 3 at home, 3 away and 1 at a neutral venue.


We finished the season with a percentage of 93.2%. Obviously this was significantly impacted by the above 6 games but we never looked ruthless and put teams away.

The 5 teams we played twice finished in positions 2, 10, 11, 15 and 17. That in most cases would be considered an easy draw for a team that finished 5th after H&A the year before.

Post the bye, we finished the season with 2 wins and 7 losses.

I am normally optimistic but when you look at the cold hard facts, the proof of the pudding is in the eating.


I would like to suggest the club have a strong review of some of the following:

1. Match Committee - credits in the bank, bring back senior players not quite right and then blaming the black cats, picking inside mids and playing them as flankers, etc. Clearly it is Simmo not addressing the issues at the selection table.
2. Consequences - players who do not follow team rules are dealt with in selection. Barrass kicking poorly off one step. Sheed calling for the ball in the corridor when standing still. Darling not picking up his direct opponent and chasing him to our backline. Langdon attempting a shot from goal from the 50m arc when he failed to get the distance from 45 10 minutes earlier. etc etc
3. Fitness Levels - we failed in the last 2 years to run out games. Put simply, we look to be a club with a low level of endurance lead by McGovern, Barrass and NicNat.
4. On Field Leadership - assuming Shuey gets the captains hat again, appoint Duggan, Allen and NicNat as his deputies.
5. List Assessment - do we have the list profile to be able to compete against the top 6 of 2021? Not from the details above.

So when I ask myself what should we be doing in list management, it becomes immaterial without dealing with the 4 items ahead of it. No matter what brilliant six 18-19 year olds will fix these issues. We have some great players on our list and it will be viewed in history as a lost opportunity that we dropped so badly from 2018 and need to clearly address the elephant in the room or move on and be prepared to drop down for a couple of years and be ready again to compete at the pointy end in a 2024. Talk of consistency and improvement will be painfully slow without changing the above.

 

[Chris_6678]

Winder is the one I'm excited about. Caught the last stream he played WAFL and just saw a few glimpses of what he can do that I thought was pretty cool.

Even that game he played round 1 where he kicked 4-5 goals!

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

Where does carlton find the salary cap for these players.

Just saying

 

[Cornelius Roy]

Agree on Erasmus but wouldn’t Van Rooyen be a reach at pick 8 (10)?

Do agree it's a reach as there's plenty of seemingly good mids there at that pick but if they're taking a KPF I reckon JVR's stocks are rising and Amiss seems the other alternative at that pick.

If JVR slipped to us at our first pick in the 20s and we could land dittmar/browne/warner later it'd be Christmas.

 

[Elite Pete]

Brander for Constable

SPS for draft pick.

I’d be happy.

Use the top 2 picks to draft best available

 

[larrikin]

Not in another multiverse mate.....keep up!

Haha, yeah realised I missed the bus on that one..

 

[Obeanie1]

Seriously doubt JK would be extended if they thought he would only be able to play every second week.

Think they would be looking at him playing at least 19 games.

The plan shouldn't be play every 2nd week but aim to get him cherry ripe for a block of games and then he gets rested. End of the day lets be honest, a niggle here and there will always pop up and the decision to give JK a break will be taken by the in jury gods.

So see how he's travelling pre season versus others. Aim to play 4-5 and then he misses an interstate trip. Plays another 4-5, an additional week off over the mid season break. Play another 4-5 straight, rest then depending on ladder position aim for the final 3-4 games pre finals.

 

[Obeanie1]

What’s the story with Gov’s hip?

He's been told to not sit down with his wallet in his back pocket again.

Dead set leads to hip problems as your spine gets all out of sorts.

Pretty simple fix really!!!!

 

[Obeanie1]

Where does carlton find the salary cap for these players.

Its Carlton..............THAT's what they do!

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

Here is a trade scenario with North Melbourne

Brander and picks 29 and 49
for
Dumont and pick 20

That would leave Norf with picks 1, 29, 38, 45, 49 and 69
That leaves us with 10, 20, 35, 60

The pick swap is 940 points to 912 in Norf's favour. They drop back 9 spots in the 20's for an additional pick at 49 to help with their rebuild.

We pick up an inside mid which we are short and lose a 3rd tall which we are long

Norf pick up a KPP that can play both ends where they are short (esp given Tarrant moving) and give up an inside mid where they are long.

I believe Brander their is a family connection at Norf.

Dumont is 26 and not likely to be in their next top 8 tilt.

EDIT: I thought Dumont was a restricted free agent but it appears he is unrestricted so probably a no go. I still like the pick swap with Norf.

 

[Get_The_Gaff]

Aside from maybe Mitch Hannan, Melbourne didn’t move on anyone of note last season.

And aside from Ben Brown, they brought in no one of note last trade period.

Their jump from 9th spot to 1st came about largely through internal improvement.

And a rule change which ****ed everyone with a zone defence and helped everyone with a run and carry game

 

[amazingjoshy]

And a rule change which f’ed everyone with a zone defence and helped everyone with a run and carry game

Not mention produced the lowest scoring full gametime season in 50 years, and gave us one of the most lopsided and boring finals series I can remember.

Way to save the game AFL

 

[Dark Sharks]

Here is a trade scenario with North Melbourne

Brander and picks 29 and 49
for
Dumont and pick 20

That would leave Norf with picks 1, 29, 38, 45, 49 and 69
That leaves us with 10, 20, 35, 60

The pick swap is 940 points to 912 in Norf's favour. They drop back 9 spots in the 20's for an additional pick at 49 to help with their rebuild.

We pick up an inside mid which we are short and lose a 3rd tall which we are long

Norf pick up a KPP that can play both ends where they are short (esp given Tarrant moving) and give up an inside mid where they are long.

I believe Brander their is a family connection at Norf.

Dumont is 26 and not likely to be in their next top 8 tilt.

I like the idea, i just think Dumont is shit.

Have you considered Jed Anderson?

He's shit too, but he's ALSO a meme.

 

[Get_The_Gaff]

All but confirms that Freo will now have 2 picks ahead of us in the draft. I think they’ll go a mid and a KPF. Interesting to see if they go local or Vic kids after Cerra’s departure.

Amiss and Erasmus.

 

[ArdentEagle]

Here is a trade scenario with North Melbourne

Brander and picks 29 and 49
for
Dumont and pick 20

That would leave Norf with picks 1, 29, 38, 45, 49 and 69
That leaves us with 10, 20, 35, 60

The pick swap is 940 points to 912 in Norf's favour. They drop back 9 spots in the 20's for an additional pick at 49 to help with their rebuild.

We pick up an inside mid which we are short and lose a 3rd tall which we are long

Norf pick up a KPP that can play both ends where they are short (esp given Tarrant moving) and give up an inside mid where they are long.

I believe Brander their is a family connection at Norf.

Dumont is 26 and not likely to be in their next top 8 tilt.

Would Dumont be any better than Bailey Rogers?