Coaching Staff Eye on our Coaching (Ratten, Lade, Batchelor, Slater sign on)

[George]

remember how i posed that question and you said it was interesting (i think you agreed with me)

that article explains it better than i ever could

here's the kicker though, when malthouse replaced ratten, he always referred to them having a young captain, still learning how to mentor people and play the game. malthouse exited his job and repeated the claim. the captain, marc murphy. marc was 29!!!!

now i dont for a second believe malthouse didnt know murphy's age, but what i reckon mick had a good sense of was public perception. i reckon he knew most viewed their players as forever being in the draft age. forever immature.

i reckon we have the same perception going on right now and unless we snap out of that, there will be a whole host of problems that arise from it.

Murphy was 25 when he received the captaincy.

 

[StCicatriz]

Yeah lots of players are getting into the early to mid 20s when they should be at their best and starting their peak. Only they aren't. I've been thinking we need to give the board time to implement their plan, now i think we need reviews done immediately and start getting the payouts ready for a whole lot of them.

jack steven = 28
savage, hickey, stevens, roberton = 27
carlisle, weller, bruce = 26
newnes, ross, longer, webster = 25

they're not kids anymore. they're grown ass men, who have been in the system for a long time. they should be viewed in the same light as nick riewoldt in 2009.

they're old enough and with enough experience to be consistently performing. yet the perception is completely different.

to a lesser extent same goes for:
membrey, dunstan, sinclair, billings, acres

 

[StCicatriz]

Murphy was 25 when he received the captaincy.

how old was he when mick left?

25 is old enough. how old was cotchin last year? what about nick riewoldt in 2009?

 

[George]

how old was he when mick left?

25 is old enough. how old was cotchin last year? what about nick riewoldt in 2009?

I may have not understood your initial statement. I was under the impression you were saying Murphy was 29 when he was appointed captain.

Murphy was 28 when Malthouse left.

I don't think any of our players should be viewed in the same light as Riewoldt after 7 years in the system. Riewoldt is a legend of the game and it's unfair to heap that kind of expectation on any of our players. Riewoldt had already won multiple B&F's and performed in a side surrounded by talent.

 

[gringo2011]

I may have not understood your initial statement. I was under the impression you were saying Murphy was 29 when he was appointed captain.

Murphy was 28 when Malthouse left.

I don't think any of our players should be viewed in the same light as Riewoldt after 7 years in the system. Riewoldt is a legend of the game and it's unfair to heap that kind of expectation on any of our players. Riewoldt had already won multiple B&F's and performed in a side surrounded by talent.

Do you think the issues at Sandy and off field generally have been vastly improved George? And is Lethlean doing anything at the club?

 

[George]

Do you think the issues at Sandy and off field generally have been vastly improved George? And is Lethlean doing anything at the club?

Lethlean hasn't been in the role long enough to make a noticeable difference IMO. Sandringham alignment is much much better than it was last year but still some issues that I don't think will ever be resolved unless we get ourselves a standalone side.

 

[triggering bro]

Maybe Lethlean is conducting a review in fact and the public just haven't been notified. Surely he'd be qualified for such a task?

Despite his past indiscretions I think Lethlean will be good for our club. He comes across as a no bull shit alpha dog who’ll make the necessary tough calls.

 

[StCicatriz]

I may have not understood your initial statement. I was under the impression you were saying Murphy was 29 when he was appointed captain.

Murphy was 28 when Malthouse left.

I don't think any of our players should be viewed in the same light as Riewoldt after 7 years in the system. Riewoldt is a legend of the game and it's unfair to heap that kind of expectation on any of our players. Riewoldt had already won multiple B&F's and performed in a side surrounded by talent.

i think you misunderstood my point

 

[StCicatriz]

Despite his past indiscretions I think Lethlean will be good for our club. He comes across as a no bull shit alpha dog who’ll make the necessary tough calls.

i think people are underwhelmed with the teams performance and are therefore looking for the messiah/savior/white knight to come and in and fix it

there seems to be different views on who that is. for some its a free agent, even two free agents. for others its a new coach or CEO or president or even a board. for others its a new recruitment team or assistant coaches. for others its AFL intervention or Lethlean enforcing change.

it doesnt matter who it is though, i think the majority of us are all hoping from someone to come in an rescue the situation. which speaks volumes. i think we are all worried about our situation.

i hope Simon is someone who can start to demand more but given his situation he might not feel like he can potentially isolate himself coming in from the cold, by demanding too much too early on.

 

[VDS66]

The issue with Sandy and the flow on effects have been done to death on here, so nothing new.

The author refers back to 2012 when Richo was there. We got him from Port Adelaide after that, so they are drawing a long now for any connection... If fact, the blues aren't in a much better position right now as they have had to start again.

Fair point about the list profile.

Different, informative article but nothing Earth shatteringly new.

Plenty of fodder for foil hat brigade...

 

[t_94]

Nuh he is correct

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app

Prime Nick Dal Santo would be pretty bloody handy in this shambles of a team. Bit disrespectful imo not every bloke in a team needs to be Diesel Williams

 

[Saint Watto]

Very very good read

Agree there Significant.......a very interesting read.

It's quite damning.........reminds me of what the poster on here said earlier in the week.....I forget his profile name......when he detailed everything Sandy did prior to the game compared to Rich before the VFL game at Punt Rd.

The preparation between Sandy and the Tiges was chalk and cheese.

Hopefully with Hammer at the helm....it's all getting a damn good shake up.

 

[Saint Watto]

Very very good read

PS......thanks for posting Significant...........very sobering reading.

 

[Saint Watto]

Ummm literally every issue quoted in that with Sandy has been basically rectified with a stronger and more definite alignment, appropriate people either moved on or promoted and if 2 - 0 against strong teams says anything then the players themselves are buying in.

Great to hear Nutsngum.......from memory things were stated on here to be grim with the relationship between Sandy and the Saints late last season.

I'd heard bits and pieces early last year that it was in fact "back on track".....as a successful Sand(in all areas) is crucial to Sandy and the Saints.

 

[gringo2011]

The issue with Sandy and the flow on effects have been done to death on here, so nothing new.

The author refers back to 2012 when Richo was there. We got him from Port Adelaide after that, so they are drawing a long now for any connection... If fact, the blues aren't in a much better position right now as they have had to start again.

Fair point about the list profile.

Different, informative article but nothing Earth shatteringly new.

Plenty of fodder for foil hat brigade...

Not foil hat brigade, the oh **** we still have no idea what we're doing brigade. I just want a tiny bit of success or if we can't even muster that....just glimmers of hope. It's not ground breaking but it's certainly very depressing and hard to argue with.

I can't see what our list management strategy is, I can't see any real planning to fix anything and I can't see any systems.

Our greatest achievement in the last 8 years was getting someone to give us money to move back to our old house because we ****ed the bedsit in Frankston we moved to up. I'm getting tired of holding out.

They are a seriously frustrating club to follow, I feel like the whole place runs on a multitude of people bluffing that they are in control.

 

[gringo2011]

i think people are underwhelmed with the teams performance and are therefore looking for the messiah/savior/white knight to come and in and fix it

there seems to be different views on who that is. for some its a free agent, even two free agents. for others its a new coach or CEO or president or even a board. for others its a new recruitment team or assistant coaches. for others its AFL intervention or Lethlean enforcing change.

it doesnt matter who it is though, i think the majority of us are all hoping from someone to come in an rescue the situation. which speaks volumes. i think we are all worried about our situation.

i hope Simon is someone who can start to demand more but given his situation he might not feel like he can potentially isolate himself coming in from the cold, by demanding too much too early on.

I'm giving up on believing in saviours until we are actually saved.

 

[Saint Watto]

Lol, I get you, but how was it even allowed to become like that in the first place?

I know very little about what goes on at Sandy and how the allignment goes....but like you austinnn......if what was written in that article is true or close to it(given that we're looking in the rear view mirror)....how the hell did it happen in the first place?

 

[VDS66]

The only way the alliance will work is via a merger whereby we control the club.

Otherwise we need a stand alone vfl team.

There is absolutely no way we can develop players with such a dysfunctional relationship.

Sandringham need to understand that going it alone will be the death of a proud club.

Agree there Significant.......a very interesting read.

It's quite damning.........reminds me of what the poster on here said earlier in the week.....I forget his profile name......when he detailed everything Sandy did prior to the game compared to Rich before the VFL game at Punt Rd.

The preparation between Sandy and the Tiges was chalk and cheese.

Hopefully with Hammer at the helm....it's all getting a damn good shake up.

 

[Saint Watto]

Despite his past indiscretions I think Lethlean will be good for our club. He comes across as a no bull shit alpha dog who’ll make the necessary tough calls.

triggering_bro.......I have no doubts he will be a very valuable addition to the club.

And like you said he comes across as a no bullshit alpha guy......can't help but think that will be good for the club.

Very early days.....but how can anyone think the ex No-2 of the AFL with all his inside info/experience....could not be a very big asset to the club.

 

[NarklesHelmet]

Has this been posted?

https://themongrelpunt.com/afl/2018/4/20/something-in-the-water-at-st-kilda

Very very good read

Well written article, thanks for sharing! Even if people say the issues have been rectified now, it shows that the development of our young blokes that came through the system when these issues existed would surely have been curtailed... and this makes sense as so many of us wonder why we aren't getting guys develop at the same rate as other clubs.

Of course, what this bloke writes isn't gospel and it's just an opinion but he puts his case together well. The Richo link between Carlton and the Saints is a bit from left-field... he might be drawing a long bow there but who knows.

 

[NarklesHelmet]

There is absolutely no way we can develop players with such a dysfunctional relationship.

Sandringham need to understand that going it alone will be the death of a proud club.

Yeah, it seems like this is the key really doesn't it? We all know couples that stay together/try it one more time "it'll be different this time" etc. but there is too much baggage for it to ever work. I feel a bit like this with the Sandy/Saints thing.

To actually get it functioning will need more than a good coach (and Sammy has started well - good luck to him). It needs fundamental change on a number of levels.

 

[Impatient Saint]

The only way the alliance will work is via a merger whereby we control the club.

Otherwise we need a stand alone vfl team.

There is absolutely no way we can develop players with such a dysfunctional relationship.

Sandringham need to understand that going it alone will be the death of a proud club.

Totally agree and I think thats why others are frustrated also, as surely the club was aware how dysfunctional the union has been.

We blame the development coaches but our lack of a stand alone has stymied all development of the VFL players.

You only have to look to Lewis Pierce's progress this year at Frankston when he has had the opportunity to play as the No 1 ruckman.

http://m.afl.com.au/news/2018-04-20/forgotten-saint-ready-to-put-his-name-forward

 

[triggering bro]

i think people are underwhelmed with the teams performance and are therefore looking for the messiah/savior/white knight to come and in and fix it

there seems to be different views on who that is. for some its a free agent, even two free agents. for others its a new coach or CEO or president or even a board. for others its a new recruitment team or assistant coaches. for others its AFL intervention or Lethlean enforcing change.

it doesnt matter who it is though, i think the majority of us are all hoping from someone to come in an rescue the situation. which speaks volumes. i think we are all worried about our situation.

i hope Simon is someone who can start to demand more but given his situation he might not feel like he can potentially isolate himself coming in from the cold, by demanding too much too early on.

You are correct, many supporters incl myself are looking for someone to get us out of this bind.

Given Lethlean’s role & influence at the club, he’s a good person to look towards to make change.

Lethlean comes from excellent pedigree & is obviously an experienced player at executive level. Despite his past misdemeanours he looks to be highly professional & a motivated operator.

I suspect Lethlean is a man on a mission to prove those that overlooked him wrong & repay the faith we’ve shown in him.

 

[jwikked]

Does a VFL team make sense financially? Does it force another team out of the league?

I don’t know enough to comment but I would love it if we had a real 2nds squad to follow.

 

[VDS66]

Totally agree and I think thats why others are frustrated also, as surely the club was aware how dysfunctional the union has been.

We blame the development coaches but our lack of a stand alone has stymied all development of the VFL players.

You only have to look to Lewis Pierce's progress this year at Frankston when he has had the opportunity to play as the No 1 ruckman.

http://m.afl.com.au/news/2018-04-20/forgotten-saint-ready-to-put-his-name-forward

Unfortunately we're not flushed with alternative options unless we find another club.

But even then, we would still have the same problems.

Casey is the leftovers of the old Springvale club so it pretty much lost its identity years ago.

No quick fixes here.