Autopsy Geelong lose to Richmond by 26 points.. but it really wasnt that close

[Jeff76]

Richmond will probably add Prestia, Edwards, Lambert, Caddy and Astbury to their finals team.

That’s scary, hand em the flag now.

 

[Gee Class Loco]

Danger spent too much of the game up foward. He needs to play these games as a permanent mid. Stop playing atkins, dalhaus and fogarty in there and play danger their permanently. danger as a mid is the reason we were 4 goals up in the prelim last year at half time. Then he went foward.

For me.
At nearly 31 years old he hasn't got a tank for 4 quarters in the middle TBH.
Powerful Burst players vs Endurance athletes i guess.
Cheers Seeds.

 

[ultimate warrior]

Geelong had Jarvis debut tonight. Doesn’t that say something about how serious Geelong were about this game? No Selwood or Stanley either. If this was a do-or-die final do you think those two would be missing if they were at 80 percent? I don’t think they would. It wasn’t a cut throat final.

Anyway I thought the narrative on this board that this match wasn’t that important as West Coast already lost against the Bulldogs. Now after the loss Geelong might not even beat Sydney or won’t show up during the finals? It’s the same old, same old.

Geelong had Atkins, Fogarty even Dahlhaus was playing in the centre sqaure in the last quarter. I’m not sure Geelong would be lining up like that during the finals.

Jarvis did a couple of nice things in both the 2nd and 3rd quarter. I don’t think he will be playing finals though because of his inexperience. Close has shown tonight he isn’t ready for finals footy just yet. Ratugolea throws a bit of a spanner in the works with his form tonight. Does this change the structure a little?

There’s already a few things Geelong can take out of this game.

Richmond to there credit are a great side and when they’re streaming forward in packs and perpetually moving the ball forward by any means necessary it looks hard for teams to stop at times.

Menegola was disappointing in the first quarter and lifted his intensity for the rest of the game. Hopefully him and Guthrie learn from this game and play this years final series the way they have for most of year, which is great football. Which could see them both selected in the 40 man squad for All Australian for the first time in their careers.

The forward half pressure was almost non exsistent tonight, which is usually one of Geelongs strong points. With about 5 or 6 experience players coming in hopefully this will help with that.

Geelong have played some great footy this year and probably surprised a few people of how well they played. For the most part at the start of the year they have been underrated and not seen as a team who could challenge for the premiership. Who would of thought after the first round Geelong would be where they are right now compared to where GWS are.

Hopefully Geelong haven’t shown all their cards tonight. I don’t feel like they have.

Do I feel Geelong will win the premiership? Who knows. If they don’t end up winning it though, I don’t feel it was because of tonight’s loss to be fair.

I remember earlier in the season some posters were upset when Geelong lost to Gold Coast in the first pre season match and saying Geelong are a mediocre side. I would jokingly post after one of Geelong victories how they still lost to Gold Coast in the first pre season game and how much does the victory really mean because of that.

Even in the loss against Carlton some people were posting that Geelong are now a mediocre side and won’t play finals. The reality of it is though, is Geelong are in the top 4 and are into another final series.

Before the game some people were saying this match didn’t matter. Now after the match Geelong don’t have the team or game plan to win a tough final or might even be eliminated in straight sets?? That is if they don’t lose to Sydney and not make it into the top 4.

I’m going to look up the word fickle and see what Oxford dictionary has to say.

I’m just going to wait and see what happens from here. Be proud how Geelong have played this year as I feel not many people expected Geelong to be in the position they are in. Hopefully Chris Scott wasn’t showing he’s full hand. With the players missing tonight, I personally feel that Geelong weren’t going 100 percent tonight. I could be wrong though, just wait and see.

A lot can happen in a month. People thought West Coast would be in the top four if Geelong lost tonight just less than a week ago, how did that play out? Richmond lost against Collingwood in a prelim a couple of years ago when they were favourite to win the flag. Even one of Geelongs most dominant teams ever lost a Grand Final in 2008.

Wait and see, maybe everything’s going to be okay.

Too much common sense for my liking

 

[Seeds]

This is how we should structure up with our talls.


fowards: hawkins, sav, rohan. All permanent.
rucks: stanley with blicavs helping put.
defenders: 3 of hendo/taylor/henry/kolo. Blicavs also helping out when not rucking.

dangerfield does not go foward anymore. Permanent midfielder. This is really probably his last opportunity at his peak. get him in the guts.

 

[Seeds]

For me.
At nearly 31 years old he hasn't got a tank for 4 quarters in the middle TBH.
Powerful Burst players vs Endurance athletes i guess.
Cheers Seeds.

He aint nearly 31. He just turned 30 four months ago. He is only 14 months older then martin. He has had plenty of rest up foward this season. Games are also shorter in a shorter season. Has been playing with no obvious injury concerns this season either which is rare. He should be primed.

 

[Spazz Cat]

fowards only need one good qtr to make a difference. Look at rohan. Hasnt strung more than a 1 qtr game all year and he has been a big contributor nonetheless. Plus even if sav isnt playing well for periods as long as he is down there being a threat then grimes cant intercept the passes to hawkins. It frees hawkins up. Also gives rohan an easier opponent as well. Plus with sav, hawkins and rohan foward we can finally release dangerfield back to being primarily a mid. This also helps release blicavs to spend more time in defence. It just sets tge whole team up much better.

You are right.
Sav actually has turned a couple of matches with 10 minute patches this year.
They seem to be forgotten for whatever reason. Maybe cause of the WC match.
When it's not going our way sometimes and it's a horrible dour slog of a game that's all you need to stop the momentum.
Couple of big marks in a few minutes that ordinarily aren't taken.
He can do that, and has.

 

[MacStradbroke]

I still have no idea what people are seeing with this one.
22 games in and has no outstanding qualities for a small forward/outside midfielder. At least with Miers and Narkle, they can hit the scoreboard or hurt you with pace in the open.

He’s not a small forward/outside midfielder so that’s one reason why you’re not seeing anything. He is an inside mid, an extractor, our team has plenty of them so it will take a while to break into his preferred spot. Constable same issue.

 

[PzBlinky]

Hi all,

Long-time lurker, first-time poster.

Last night's game was a weird one. I made the trek down the Pacific to watch it live kinda-sorta hoping we'd nab this one, but it was clear pretty early on we weren't on.

Usually these sorts of games are major triggers, but there was something different this time...

Glass Half Empty
* The starting forward line was literally Hawkins and a bunch of young-uns (none of which had hit 50 games)... how the hell do you hope to kick a score with a line-up like that?
* Jarvis played like a first gamer, unfortunately... got in the same marking contest with Hawk twice that I saw in the first quarter and his man played with impunity
* On that note, it was obvious the Tiger backs were basically ignoring everyone in our forward 50 except Hawkins. The sad thing was they got away with it over and over. (Miers especially disappointing, considering he's a specialist.)
* Ratugolea is never going to be a forward with his kicking
* Fogarty with two turn-overs from lazy kicks... I've been bullish with him, but definitely had his colours lowered (along with a dozen others)
* Menegola was waaaaay off tonight
* Blicavs played really well... but I'm worried about Hendo and Taylor as our KPD in finals
* It's been great winning without a big game from Danger. Not-so-great that we can also lose without a big game from Danger.
* Stewart was the only one winning his spot down back both defensively and offensively (Merrick did OK as well, I guess)

Glass Half Full
* The starting forward line was literally Hawkins and a bunch of young-uns (none of which had hit 50 games)... 1 or 2 changes and the balance improves
* Jarvis improved as the game got on, including a great contested mark from the Rat "hmmm, two free players in the 50... let's think about this for 5 seconds" kick
* Ratugolea took some strong marks and contributed
* Fog got a bit better as the game went on
* I want to believe Menegola can't play much worse (I know, I know, "goes missing in finals"... we gotta live in hope, right?)
* I'm practically sold on the Blitz in the middle - he's playing confidently and contributing
* You'd like to think Dangerfield can improve on this performance (and yeah, I know he was thrown forward a lot because of our primary school forward line... but hopefully won't be as much of an issue with Rohan and Ablett to come in)
* Stewart is unbelievable - nothing more to say

But the big thing wasn't any individual or incident, it was the game style. In the 3rd quarter, we were under siege...

* GHE: something had to change but we didn't seem to have any inclination to do that. Every time someone got it, they just kept chipping it around our back-line while movement up the field remained stagnant.
* GHF: we're holding something back for finals. The zero urgency and zero change-up until the last quarter felt off, but not in the "we freaking suck" kind of way. (And for anyone poo-pooing this... as per the UFO poster, I WANT TO BELIEVE.)

Finally, it was great to see that QLD Tiger supporters had as much class, grace, and eloquence in victory as their Victorian counter-parts.

 

[Johnny Cattery]

Geelong had Jarvis debut tonight. Doesn’t that say something about how serious Geelong were about this game? No Selwood or Stanley either. If this was a do-or-die final do you think those two would be missing if they were at 80 percent? I don’t think they would. It wasn’t a cut throat final.

Anyway I thought the narrative on this board that this match wasn’t that important as West Coast already lost against the Bulldogs. Now after the loss Geelong might not even beat Sydney or won’t show up during the finals? It’s the same old, same old.

Geelong had Atkins, Fogarty even Dahlhaus was playing in the centre sqaure in the last quarter. I’m not sure Geelong would be lining up like that during the finals.

Jarvis did a couple of nice things in both the 2nd and 3rd quarter. I don’t think he will be playing finals though because of his inexperience. Close has shown tonight he isn’t ready for finals footy just yet. Ratugolea throws a bit of a spanner in the works with his form tonight. Does this change the structure a little?

There’s already a few things Geelong can take out of this game.

Richmond to there credit are a great side and when they’re streaming forward in packs and perpetually moving the ball forward by any means necessary it looks hard for teams to stop at times.

Menegola was disappointing in the first quarter and lifted his intensity for the rest of the game. Hopefully him and Guthrie learn from this game and play this years final series the way they have for most of year, which is great football. Which could see them both selected in the 40 man squad for All Australian for the first time in their careers.

The forward half pressure was almost non exsistent tonight, which is usually one of Geelongs strong points. With about 5 or 6 experience players coming in hopefully this will help with that.

Geelong have played some great footy this year and probably surprised a few people of how well they played. For the most part at the start of the year they have been underrated and not seen as a team who could challenge for the premiership. Who would of thought after the first round Geelong would be where they are right now compared to where GWS are.

Hopefully Geelong haven’t shown all their cards tonight. I don’t feel like they have.

Do I feel Geelong will win the premiership? Who knows. If they don’t end up winning it though, I don’t feel it was because of tonight’s loss to be fair.

I remember earlier in the season some posters were upset when Geelong lost to Gold Coast in the first pre season match and saying Geelong are a mediocre side. I would jokingly post after one of Geelong victories how they still lost to Gold Coast in the first pre season game and how much does the victory really mean because of that.

Even in the loss against Carlton some people were posting that Geelong are now a mediocre side and won’t play finals. The reality of it is though, is Geelong are in the top 4 and are into another final series.

Before the game some people were saying this match didn’t matter. Now after the match Geelong don’t have the team or game plan to win a tough final or might even be eliminated in straight sets?? That is if they don’t lose to Sydney and not make it into the top 4.

I’m going to look up the word fickle and see what Oxford dictionary has to say.

I’m just going to wait and see what happens from here. Be proud how Geelong have played this year as I feel not many people expected Geelong to be in the position they are in. Hopefully Chris Scott wasn’t showing he’s full hand. With the players missing tonight, I personally feel that Geelong weren’t going 100 percent tonight. I could be wrong though, just wait and see.

A lot can happen in a month. People thought West Coast would be in the top four if Geelong lost tonight just less than a week ago, how did that play out? Richmond lost against Collingwood in a prelim a couple of years ago when they were favourite to win the flag. Even one of Geelongs most dominant teams ever lost a Grand Final in 2008.

Wait and see, maybe everything’s going to be okay.

Terrific post. Thank you for the sanity.

 

[Johnny Cattery]

Hi all,

Long-time lurker, first-time poster.

Last night's game was a weird one. I made the trek down the Pacific to watch it live kinda-sorta hoping we'd nab this one, but it was clear pretty early on we weren't on.

Usually these sorts of games are major triggers, but there was something different this time...

Glass Half Empty
* The starting forward line was literally Hawkins and a bunch of young-uns (none of which had hit 50 games)... how the hell do you hope to kick a score with a line-up like that?
* Jarvis played like a first gamer, unfortunately... got in the same marking contest with Hawk twice that I saw in the first quarter and his man played with impunity
* On that note, it was obvious the Tiger backs were basically ignoring everyone in our forward 50 except Hawkins. The sad thing was they got away with it over and over. (Miers especially disappointing, considering he's a specialist.)
* Ratugolea is never going to be a forward with his kicking
* Fogarty with two turn-overs from lazy kicks... I've been bullish with him, but definitely had his colours lowered (along with a dozen others)
* Menegola was waaaaay off tonight
* Blicavs played really well... but I'm worried about Hendo and Taylor as our KPD in finals
* It's been great winning without a big game from Danger. Not-so-great that we can also lose without a big game from Danger.
* Stewart was the only one winning his spot down back both defensively and offensively (Merrick did OK as well, I guess)

Glass Half Full
* The starting forward line was literally Hawkins and a bunch of young-uns (none of which had hit 50 games)... 1 or 2 changes and the balance improves
* Jarvis improved as the game got on, including a great contested mark from the Rat "hmmm, two free players in the 50... let's think about this for 5 seconds" kick
* Ratugolea took some strong marks and contributed
* Fog got a bit better as the game went on
* I want to believe Menegola can't play much worse (I know, I know, "goes missing in finals"... we gotta live in hope, right?)
* I'm practically sold on the Blitz in the middle - he's playing confidently and contributing
* You'd like to think Dangerfield can improve on this performance (and yeah, I know he was thrown forward a lot because of our primary school forward line... but hopefully won't be as much of an issue with Rohan and Ablett to come in)
* Stewart is unbelievable - nothing more to say

But the big thing wasn't any individual or incident, it was the game style. In the 3rd quarter, we were under siege...

* GHE: something had to change but we didn't seem to have any inclination to do that. Every time someone got it, they just kept chipping it around our back-line while movement up the field remained stagnant.
* GHF: we're holding something back for finals. The zero urgency and zero change-up until the last quarter felt off, but not in the "we freaking suck" kind of way. (And for anyone poo-pooing this... as per the UFO poster, I WANT TO BELIEVE.)

Finally, it was great to see that QLD Tiger supporters had as much class, grace, and eloquence in victory as their Victorian counter-parts.

What a cracking first post. Agree totally ... most of all on the last part. Made the Port and Freo supporters look like church choirs, although I couldn't help wondering what they would be like sober ...

 

[Tristan34]

Love how it is Scott’s fault. Players turning to water under pressure is hardly a coaching fault, he can’t lay a tackle or kick the ball for them. He has actually coached brilliantly all year. His biggest issue last night was bringing in Jarvis but when we are basically guaranteed top 4, you would be an idiot to risk Rohan particularly given last night showed his importance to the structure.

Its the chipping around the backline that gets me.. It doesnt work against Richmond.. They just shift for the switch... The cats had to eventually kick it to a contest and usually it was bombed into the forward 50, then cleaned up by their KPD...

 

[you pick one]

Our best side would be one where we could run two tall forwards Hawkins, Sav/Jenkins and Rohan without one having to go into the ruck at all,same the other end Blitz permanently at full back not having to ruck around the ground unfortunately we have over the last however many years settled on a policy that our second key forward is also our second ruck competent or not,How do we fix that.Stanley back goes half way,the next bit will be controversial and probably should have been tried well before now.Play both Sav and Jenkins/Fort.

 

[tielgaz]

We were smashed, but thought we played dumb footy. Bombed it long in the forward line all night, apart from Sav in the last quarter barely took a mark inside 50 all night. At least we learnt our bottom 5 tonight aren’t up to it yet: Fogarty, Close, Jarvis, Atkins, Henry replace with the seasoned players who are ready to come in, change our undies and we go again. Hope Port lose to the pies and we play Bris week 1 would be nice.

 

[Schlurp]

Much worse.
That week we annihilated them, both sides took nothing away from the game. The week we beat Brisbane, we completely turned the tables on them in the second half and they had no answers whatsoever.
No Andrews either. Massive out for Brisbane.

Sorry to intrude but if Richmond do play Brisbane in the first week of the finals, the Andrews omission will be cancelled out by the Lynch injury. It evens the odds substantially but I think Brisbane will miss Andrews more.

 

[Gee Class Loco]

He aint nearly 31. He just turned 30 four months ago. He is only 14 months older then martin. He has had plenty of rest up foward this season. Games are also shorter in a shorter season. Has been playing with no obvious injury concerns this season either which is rare. He should be primed.

OK OK if u are gonna go down the fact file... let's get it right first.
He is 30 years 5 months and a week. Not 4 months ago. He's closer to turning 31 than to turning 30... that is fact.
So let's all agree he is nearly 31... coz he isn't nearly 30 as that ship has already sailed.
Now onto your second point of Martin. Whats that gotta do with Dangers' fitness level?? Nothing.
As for... Plenty of rest up forward?? So he doesn't run jump tackle pressure whilst up forward?? Yeah Ok. HELLO!! There is no rest. It isn't 1989.
Should be primed?? He is, for a nearly 31 year old man that has been a explosive battering ram type of player for 10 plus years.
His tank is not at a level to play 16 plus minutes x 4 in the guts IMO. Scotty knows it. Coaching staff know it and maybe, just maybe danger knows it.
We will just agree 2 disagree on Danger this time around Seeds.
Cheers.

 

[Ratcat]

Our best side would be one where we could run two tall forwards Hawkins, Sav/Jenkins and Rohan without one having to go into the ruck at all,same the other end Blitz permanently at full back not having to ruck around the ground unfortunately we have over the last however many years settled on a policy that our second key forward is also our second ruck competent or not,How do we fix that.Stanley back goes half way,the next bit will be controversial and probably should have been tried well before now.Play both Sav and Jenkins/Fort.

Been saying this all week only to be ridiculed, now the chickens have come home to roost.
To all of those abusive naysayers,... lol!

 

[frggr]

Dude the ONLY reason I'm here is because of the absolute flogging Cats trolls gave our boards ALL WEEK. So yep I came looking for some humble pie eating from said trolls. Trust me I don't usually waste my time on oppo boards unless it's to ask a genuine question or get some inside info.

So far I've read fifteen pages of your review thread and clicked (haha) ONE time and made zero comments. The only other like I made was one of your posters who gave some credit where it was due. Maybe take a look in your own backyard pal.

Why are you talking like other posters are my responsibility? Take some responsibility for your own behaviour

 

[you pick one]

One thing I'd try if we play the Tigers again this year is tagging Grimms with Rohan we need to curtail his influence from the back half.

 

[ATSAM]

For me.
At nearly 31 years old he hasn't got a tank for 4 quarters in the middle TBH.
Powerful Burst players vs Endurance athletes i guess.
Cheers Seeds.

Yep that is true but then why haven't we recruited hard running mids or at least trained them to be so. Seems that we got Dangerfield and thought great we are now ok. Bit like when Carlton recruited Judd, thought that every problem was answered.

 

[frggr]

Rohan would not have got a kick Richmond crowed our forward line no space for Rohan to run down tackles or lead

There were plenty of run down opportunities last night - Rohan would have feasted

 

[you pick one]

Been saying this all week only to be ridiculed, now the chickens have come home to roost.
To all of those naysayers, lol!

Basically we have to un pick our own best structure at both ends of the ground to have some one fulfil the ruck duties where they seldom if ever dominate you won't get away with that against good sides in finals.

 

[frggr]

Anyone have a heat map of sav? I don't have access.

 

[frggr]

We realllly need to revisit the way our defence matches up. Who was kolo's direct opponent?

 

[goyoucatters]

One thing that deserves to be said - Blicavs was really good tonight.

Was my first live game for the season last night. And the running that Blitz did to break up so many Richmond outlets was staggering. Gets to and affects so many contests, and is much more reliable with his hands when he gets there these days. Either halves the contest or brings the ball away, rather than just halting their momentum for all of three seconds by losing possession back to the opposition almost immediately.

I get the arguments for sending him back to try and stem the bleeding when we're under siege. But I can't help feeling that the ball comes in to our D50 even more often (and even more 'clean') if you take him away from breaking up opposition possession chains in the middle of the ground. Which is why just cloning him seems like an easier option than working out how you are best to use his assets in one distinct role.

Once again, would have been far uglier last night if he wasn't filling so many gaps through the middle of the ground. So I'm probably still slightly in the 'Blitz up field' group in preference to sending him back if the group back there is then just going to be further swamped with quality, quick entries.

 

[Ricketz]

We were woeful. Seemed to forget how we have played all year. Rushed disposals, even after taking marks. No attempt to change the pace of the game, just panic panic panic. Danger uncharacteristically a liability all game with ball in hand, if it ever managed to stay there, and barely in the middle that I can remember. Duncan largely in effectual, same with Menegola - they don't have that many stoppers to account for that much loss of quality.

Glad we got that one out of the system. I'm going to make a point of not shitting the bed like we did last night. It's one bad game out of very few this year, and I saw nothing in the Tigers game that says our best won't beat theirs on the day.

Jarvis and Sav a bust. Can't understand why we played Jarvis instead of Narkle, as he provided little defensive pressure and we had no run down the flank. Fogarty cost us two direct goals with his inexperience, and I don't think he will keep his spot, as much as I like him. Other than that, pretty much everyone else has the runs in the bank for mine.

I'm sure the knives will be out for some, so for my sanity I might avoid those types all week. Selwood, Ablett, Stanley and Rohan in next week will give our side a much better look at how we shape for finals. Won't be drawing to many conclusions from this one.

Whilst Richmond were clearly the better team on the night, we were within three goals with ten minutes to go after kicking one for the rest of the match. Let's not pretend they blew us away, despite their missed shots - you don't win games with woulda, coulda, shouldas - and they could easily have thrown it away as well. We beat them in almost every statistical category, except marks inside fifty - they flooded as suspected, and we did nothing to stretch their defence by carefully controlling across halfback before launching like we have in almost every other game this year. So it's not going to take much to clean that up moving forward.

Plenty to look forward to. I'm still excited - carn the Cats!