Rumour GFC 2024 Player Trading, Drafting FA, Rumours and Wish lists Pt 1

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sexyhunk said:
maybe just me, but if it comes down to oliver or smith, I take oliver. his best is brownlow best, we also need someone with his game in the middle post dangerfield and selwood.

Also, people talk about his long contract, but it can be a benefit as he is currently 26, in 4 years time he be 30 and could be one of the best in the league still and only on roughly 1 mill? with the yearly cap increase, would you want to pay olvier a mill or mclug 1.5 in 2028?
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i like to correct myself after seeing Oliver yesterday and in general last few weeks. Dude maybe cooked, mentally and physically
 
Sticksman said:
If the numbers of players leaving are as predicted (i.e. many) then I think the coach might also have an understanding with Hocking and he will leave at year end as well. If we are looking for a coach for 2025 that person will already be at the club. My bet is Stephen King.
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For me it would be right up Chris Scott's alley to build the list/club again.
 

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allrighty said:
Needs a refresh. Dees would be glad to bargain basement him I reckon. IF we can get him right he would be a gun.
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A lot would depend on the trade cost to get me keen on him.

We can't be paying overs due to the risk.

Our R1 next year has the chance of being a very low selection IMO and I'd want to be holding that at all costs.

If the Dees are selling low, I think we'd be happy to listen to them.

If they want the world for him, they can keep him.
 
If we're taking on any significant fraction of Oliver's contract he's got to come as a free trade.

What's he worth contract wise right now with all the off field stuff and his poor performances? 4 years at 700k? At best I'd say.

Instead he's got 6 years after this on $1m+.

I don't see how this works as a trade. Even if we pay absolutely nothing as a trade I'm still wanting the Dees to cover $250k to even think about it.
 
sexyhunk said:
I like to think so as well but after getting the top of the mountain in 2022 with team he built is hard to start from scratch mentally with a new group.
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He might see it as challenge?/ Or he might say enuff is enuff.
Either way i'd be happy with.
 
D BRIDGE said:
A lot would depend on the trade cost to get me keen on him.

We can't be paying overs due to the risk.

Our R1 next year has the chance of being a very low selection IMO and I'd want to be holding that at all costs.

If the Dees are selling low, I think we'd be happy to listen to them.

If they want the world for him, they can keep him.
Click to expand...
Given his performance and contract I would be asking for picks not giving them up
 
allrighty said:
Of course you don't do it
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Well, maaaaaaybe.

There is a bit of an angle where it could work, and the circumstances would have to be right. But....

My understanding is that in the event young Clayton signs a contract with us, that would be a new contract, with potentially new terms and conditions.

Melbourne here might find themselves without a lever to pull, and his situation there could be untenable. Clayton may genuinely believe that he is capable of behavioural change in a new environment and is willing to prove it.

In that scenario, could we take on the entirety of Oliver's contract, but add specific clauses for drug use and other agreed specific actions?

Melbourne get to wave goodbye to a financial commitment that will drag them down for the rest of the decade.

Clayton, if he's sincere about change will have no problem signing a contract that commits him to that.

And Geelong, setting transparent standards, provides him a fresh start but with an ability to delist and pay out only the next X months of the contract under a set of specific conditions?

It would still be pretty risky. If he's Jack Steven 2.0 we could get rekt
 

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CatToTheFuture said:
Well, maaaaaaybe.

There is a bit of an angle where it could work, and the circumstances would have to be right. But....

My understanding is that in the event young Clayton signs a contract with us, that would be a new contract, with potentially new terms and conditions.

Melbourne here might find themselves without a lever to pull, and his situation there could be untenable. Clayton may genuinely believe that he is capable of behavioural change in a new environment and is willing to prove it.

In that scenario, could we take on the entirety of Oliver's contract, but add specific clauses for drug use and other agreed specific actions?

Melbourne get to wave goodbye to a financial commitment that will drag them down for the rest of the decade.

Clayton, if he's sincere about change will have no problem signing a contract that commits him to that.

And Geelong, setting transparent standards, provides him a fresh start but with an ability to delist and pay out only the next X months of the contract under a set of specific conditions?

It would still be pretty risky. If he's Jack Steven 2.0 we could get rekt
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Yes of course. My comment was about going overs.

I have posted for some time that we should go hard for him (!) if the deal works for us, not so much for him.
He is damaged goods, he has pissed off many of his teammates and there are risks.

BUT he is a very very good MFer (ha - midfielder) and that is just what we need.
Do we need his bullshit? Of course not.

But can we do a Stengle with him? Who knows but I am sure the Club is looking very hard at him.

The other option Smith is good, but who knows about the knee risk with him?

CO has an existing contract with the Dees and that would need to be worked through. But as I said above I think they would be glad to see his arse and maybe pay for that view for a few years.
 
CatToTheFuture said:
I don't know if Duncan has anything left in the tank. If you add him I have 7 players with games experience on my list of outs

Hawkins
Duncan
Tuohy
Bews
Parfitt
Rohan
Stanley

We'd be losing 1,619 games experience (and counting).

For context when North dumped their senior players end of 2016 they only lost 1,345 games.

Some detail:
Click to expand...

And we are gonna be in a bumpy period for a while. This is why I don’t want to give up any future picks. Those will be top level picks through a rebuild.
 
So are we thinking Stengle leaves??
60/40 to go
Heard Essendon are into him, would fit nicely there too
 
Commando said:
So are we thinking Stengle leaves??
60/40 to go
Heard Essendon are into him, would fit nicely there too
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Guys on Gettable said no movement on contract talks to come over Bye period but they were pretty certain he is staying.

They said long way to go though. And Twomey is a Dons supporter
 
Oliver has had an interesting career. This is not his first drop in performance. I remember watching him during that interrupted Covid year and he was quite poor then too.

But when he is up and running, he is a super player.

You pay him for 6 and you might get 3 elite years.

We would probably take that given our position with Cameron and Stewart and wanting to challenge again immediately.
 
FootyLad0 said:
And we are gonna be in a bumpy period for a while. This is why I don’t want to give up any future picks. Those will be top level picks through a rebuild.
Click to expand...
I really doubt that.

The teams who have really, really fallen off the cliff in recent times and stayed there have had it happen because they put everything on the credit card, and had not prepared for the future whatsover.

It's a very surface level analysis to think "oh, some players are retiring, they're in for some pain now" IMO. There are so many factors at play here when it happens.

A couple examples:

West Coast - The Eagles fall down the ladder 2022 in hindsight is obvious.

They'd taken 2 first round picks in the previous 5 years combined, and one of those was Campbell Chesser, who was taken in 2021.

They'd ignored young talent for years prior to their fall, and got exactly what was coming to them.

Injuries and COVID played a huge part in that too, but with the lack of future proofing that they had done, it was always going to happen this way.

North Melbourne - North are an interesting case, because it's arguably two separate 'rebuild' attempts.

We'll start with the end of 2016 though, as that's really where their troubles began.

North hadn't ignored the draft to the same level as West Coast...but they'd hardly prioritised youth, either.

At the time, their leading young talents were Ben McKay, Sam Durdin, Taylor Garner, & Luke McDonald. Truly and imposing list of names.

Stupidly, after one draft they believed they had fixed the problems, and went on a shopping spree for ordinary at best players in Dom Tyson, Jasper Pittard, Aaron Hall, & Jared Polec.

It's no surprise they ended up where they did.

Hawthorn - The Hawks took the aforementioned examples and said "Hold my beer"

The Hawks took just two first round picks between 2010-2018 (Isaac Smith, Ryan Burton), with a clear vacuum of youth on the list.

If they had simply changed direction at the conclusion of the 2016 season, it's well within the realms of possibility that the Hawks would've been contending over the last couple years.

Instead, they traded the farm for the likes of O'Meara, Mitchell, & Wingard.

While having zero quality youth on the list, they sacrificed any chance they had of allaying those issues by doubling down, before finally retuning to the first round of the draft in 2019 to select Will Day, after the experiment had well and truly failed.

******************************

Like I've said on many occasions now, we are far more likely to follow the trail that Sydney have set through 2019 & 2020 before a bounce in 2021.

Our commitment to bringing in quality young talent over the last 5 years is infinitely better than the negligence shown by these clubs.

We have bought in 8 selections in the top 25 of the draft, while finding late gems in Mullin, Dempsey, Neale, & Humphries to continue turning over the list.

The clubs I've listed (among others like Richmond) had/have done none of that.

Like I said, these dramatic falls down the ladder don't just happen because of retirements.

It comes from a complete lack of preparation, which is the opposite of what we've been doing.
 
Kobe Gryant said:
I really doubt that.

The teams who have really, really fallen off the cliff in recent times and stayed there have had it happen because they put everything on the credit card, and had not prepared for the future whatsover.

It's a very surface level analysis to think "oh, some players are retiring, they're in for some pain now" IMO. There are so many factors at play here when it happens.

A couple examples:

West Coast - The Eagles fall down the ladder 2022 in hindsight is obvious.

They'd taken 2 first round picks in the previous 5 years combined, and one of those was Campbell Chesser, who was taken in 2021.

They'd ignored young talent for years prior to their fall, and got exactly what was coming to them.

Injuries and COVID played a huge part in that too, but with the lack of future proofing that they had done, it was always going to happen this way.

North Melbourne - North are an interesting case, because it's arguably two separate 'rebuild' attempts.

We'll start with the end of 2016 though, as that's really where their troubles began.

North hadn't ignored the draft to the same level as West Coast...but they'd hardly prioritised youth, either.

At the time, their leading young talents were Ben McKay, Sam Durdin, Taylor Garner, & Luke McDonald. Truly and imposing list of names.

Stupidly, after one draft they believed they had fixed the problems, and went on a shopping spree for ordinary at best players in Dom Tyson, Jasper Pittard, Aaron Hall, & Jared Polec.

It's no surprise they ended up where they did.

Hawthorn - The Hawks took the aforementioned examples and said "Hold my beer"

The Hawks took just two first round picks between 2010-2018 (Isaac Smith, Ryan Burton), with a clear vacuum of youth on the list.

If they had simply changed direction at the conclusion of the 2016 season, it's well within the realms of possibility that the Hawks would've been contending over the last couple years.

Instead, they traded the farm for the likes of O'Meara, Mitchell, & Wingard.

While having zero quality youth on the list, they sacrificed any chance they had of allaying those issues by doubling down, before finally retuning to the first round of the draft in 2019 to select Will Day, after the experiment had well and truly failed.

******************************

Like I've said on many occasions now, we are far more likely to follow the trail that Sydney have set through 2019 & 2020 before a bounce in 2021.

Our commitment to bringing in quality young talent over the last 5 years is infinitely better than the negligence shown by these clubs.

We have bought in 8 selections in the top 25 of the draft, while finding late gems in Mullin, Dempsey, Neale, & Humphries to continue turning over the list.

The clubs I've listed (among others like Richmond) had/have done none of that.

Like I said, these dramatic falls down the ladder don't just happen because of retirements.

It comes from a complete lack of preparation, which is the opposite of what we've been doing.
Click to expand...
We have been playing the long game whilst remaining competitive in the short term. Anyone who knows anything about this stuff will get that that is a real challenge.

Plus with the equalisation crap distorting the whole thing according to the funders AFL requirements it just adds another significant and uncontrollable risk factor to the deal.

We are going ok
 
Kobe Gryant said:
I really doubt that.

The teams who have really, really fallen off the cliff in recent times and stayed there have had it happen because they put everything on the credit card, and had not prepared for the future whatsover.

It's a very surface level analysis to think "oh, some players are retiring, they're in for some pain now" IMO. There are so many factors at play here when it happens.

A couple examples:

West Coast - The Eagles fall down the ladder 2022 in hindsight is obvious.

They'd taken 2 first round picks in the previous 5 years combined, and one of those was Campbell Chesser, who was taken in 2021.

They'd ignored young talent for years prior to their fall, and got exactly what was coming to them.

Injuries and COVID played a huge part in that too, but with the lack of future proofing that they had done, it was always going to happen this way.

North Melbourne - North are an interesting case, because it's arguably two separate 'rebuild' attempts.

We'll start with the end of 2016 though, as that's really where their troubles began.

North hadn't ignored the draft to the same level as West Coast...but they'd hardly prioritised youth, either.

At the time, their leading young talents were Ben McKay, Sam Durdin, Taylor Garner, & Luke McDonald. Truly and imposing list of names.

Stupidly, after one draft they believed they had fixed the problems, and went on a shopping spree for ordinary at best players in Dom Tyson, Jasper Pittard, Aaron Hall, & Jared Polec.

It's no surprise they ended up where they did.

Hawthorn - The Hawks took the aforementioned examples and said "Hold my beer"

The Hawks took just two first round picks between 2010-2018 (Isaac Smith, Ryan Burton), with a clear vacuum of youth on the list.

If they had simply changed direction at the conclusion of the 2016 season, it's well within the realms of possibility that the Hawks would've been contending over the last couple years.

Instead, they traded the farm for the likes of O'Meara, Mitchell, & Wingard.

While having zero quality youth on the list, they sacrificed any chance they had of allaying those issues by doubling down, before finally retuning to the first round of the draft in 2019 to select Will Day, after the experiment had well and truly failed.

******************************

Like I've said on many occasions now, we are far more likely to follow the trail that Sydney have set through 2019 & 2020 before a bounce in 2021.

Our commitment to bringing in quality young talent over the last 5 years is infinitely better than the negligence shown by these clubs.

We have bought in 8 selections in the top 25 of the draft, while finding late gems in Mullin, Dempsey, Neale, & Humphries to continue turning over the list.

The clubs I've listed (among others like Richmond) had/have done none of that.

Like I said, these dramatic falls down the ladder don't just happen because of retirements.

It comes from a complete lack of preparation, which is the opposite of what we've been doing.
Click to expand...

Might be skipping a bit on the list for North there. They had just drafted Simpkin, Zurhaar, and Larkey, though they wouldn't have known Souv would be a gun.

They had Goldy, Cunners, Higgins in the middle. Tarrant and Thompson were a compelling backline combo.

They had a skeleton to work with
 
Sticksman said:
If the numbers of players leaving are as predicted (i.e. many) then I think the coach might also have an understanding with Hocking and he will leave at year end as well. If we are looking for a coach for 2025 that person will already be at the club. My bet is Stephen King.
Click to expand...

Rahilly for me if we went that way but king is very good too.
 
allrighty said:
Needs a refresh. Dees would be glad to bargain basement him I reckon. IF we can get him right he would be a gun.
Click to expand...

Too many off field ? With him
 
Footy Smarts said:
If we're taking on any significant fraction of Oliver's contract he's got to come as a free trade.

What's he worth contract wise right now with all the off field stuff and his poor performances? 4 years at 700k? At best I'd say.

Instead he's got 6 years after this on $1m+.

I don't see how this works as a trade. Even if we pay absolutely nothing as a trade I'm still wanting the Dees to cover $250k to even think about it.
Click to expand...

They wont do that. If they didnt do it with grundy zero chance they do it with oliver.
 
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