Review Good/Bad/Ugly vs Hawthorn and their Umpires

[Boxhead_31]

The better team lost tonight if your team keeps playing like that it will be a heck of an exciting season, sit back an enjoy.
Not every week do you have to go up against Nicholls and his love affair with Hawthorn

 

[Sanders]

Not yet he aint... Lets go get a cup and then he can be a winner

I don't think we need to be that kindergarten about it. Success follows him, and fairly instantly too

Bloke is obviously quality.

 

[relapse]

Didn't we beat the Bulldogs in a final recently? That was a big game, wasn't it?

That was the drought breaker and a very rare victory.

People are kidding themselves if they can't see that these types of heart breaking losses have become the norm for this club in Victoria. As much as I was hoping that we were going to hold on, deep down I knew the Hawthorn match winning goal was coming and I bet I wasn't alone.

I honestly think that until this club is good enough to be able to hold on and win these games away from Adelaide Oval we aren't genuine flag contenders.

 

[relapse]

It was a game-changing moment. It changed the WHOLE last 4-5 minutes. These things happen in this sport. One mistake like that and it costs you the game. Hawthorn kicked two goals straight after one another and we all knew how it was going to end when that happened.

I agree.

We had the momentum until that point, Seedsman was one out and had made space to potentially run on and score.

I posted it here at the time after Puopolo goaled from the turnover that Smith has potentially cost us the game. Sadly like you I saw the old familiar script beginning to play out for the 50th time.

 

[Sanders]

Jenny, we've been doing this dance for 10 years.

Your optimism didn't lead to any more success than my pessimism. Just worst predictive skill.

He's got a point.

But... We seem to be better, much better than expected, and much much better than we look on paper. We're not contenders, but we are miles better than we have any right to be.

We can't contend until we can close out consistently, that's true. But how we're competing at the level we are is a mystery. Except for maybe...

Is Don...

 

[GROTTO]

First time on here tonight, first time I have ever seen opposition supporters from other Clubs voice such anger, disapproval and frustration at piss poor biased umpiring.

Houston we have a problem.

 

[relapse]

There were a few times in the game overall I felt the better option was to rush the behind, not just Cheney, reset and try for a coast to coast goal. We seem too intent on playing the ball out in a scramble rather than the rushed behind.

I've noticed this too, it reminds me of the old Graham Cornes days where he used to demand that the players not rush points.

I am not sure why we insist on not rushing points, there was a goal that we conceded in the first quarter from a stoppage that was created because we refused to rush the ball through for a behind. Teams like Hawthorn are more than happy to do it whereas we only ever seem to do it as a last resort.

 

[GROTTO]

Footy world has spoken tonight aside from most Port supporters and all Hawthorn supporters, no one wants the Hawks to win the 2016 flag.

 

[huludicidal]

Some pretty clownish posting going on tonight. Resembles facebook more than it does a footy forum. I'm guessing everyone's drunk as **** or something.

Wanna know how many goals hawthorn kicked from umpiring mistakes tonight? Probably exactly the same number we did! 5 of the 6 goals they kicked directky from frees were genuine frees from where I sat. 1 was a bit dicey but nothing that wasn't at least understandable.

Did we get smashed in centre clearances because of the umpires? No. You lose centre clearances 21-12, guess what? You probably lose the game.

Did the umpires influence the tackle count? No. You lose the tackle count by 20, guess what? You probably lose the game.


The umps made a number of clear blunders on the night. The holding the ball against Douglas (did not lead to a Hawks goal). The phantom free against Tex (actually indirectly led to a Crows behind). The non-mark to Lynch (this one was pretty shit but certainly didn't decide the game ffs). These are the ones people remember because they were near the end.

Guess what? In an amazing turn of events, not every bad decision went against us tonight! I'd say there were probably 15 howlers, and we were on the bad end of about 8 of them. 5 or 6 of those 8 cost us absolutely nothing.

There's a number of reasons why we lost the game. Our inability to stay composed in the intense heat of the last 5 minutes was one of them. Getting smashed at the centre clearances was another. Being smashed in the tackling was another.

The umpires? Pffft. This was not even close to being a repeat of the 2012 prelim. That day we were cheated out of a grand final spot. I have still to this day not seen more one-sided bullshit than that game. Rules were being invented on the spot. Tonight, we blew it. Despite the stats above, we were HOME if we kept some poise in the last 5. We didn't. Against the greatest team of all time, that doesn't cut it. Puopolo and Cyril took full advantage of CROWS BLUNDERS to kick the last 3 goals.

Goal 1: Smith shank leads to turnover, 10 seconds later Cheney inexplicably fails to dive and knock the ball through despite it being obvious that his opponent was about to go the soccer - Puopolo goals. Umpires had no decisions to make.

Goal 2: ground ball inside 50 for Hawks. Cheney puts one of the most pathetic tackles ever seen on his opponent (can't recall if Puopolo or someone else but probably Puopolo because he was involved in roughly 50 goals tonight it seemed), who is able to fire out a handball to Cyril who goals. Seriously, Cheney needed to force a bounce or a spillage and had a strength advantage here - it was pissweak. Umpires no influence.

Goal 3: Smith shanks a kick-in 48m to a contest. Ball punched out of bounds. Mackay does a Mackay and gets rag-dolled near the boundary from the resulting throw in. Hawks gather loose ball. Pissant attempts to tackle ensue - Thommo for one should've been much more desperate to tackle or smother. Mitchell gets a quick kick inside 50 where Smith is caught lagging behind Puopolo. Smith then makes an absolute **** of himself and gives away a blatant free reminiscent of Rutten in the 09 final against Collingwood (which was also a stupid and blatant free). Goal. Umpiring was spot on.


Whinge all you want about umpiring. They didn't do any of that, or lose the centre clearances, or lose the tackling.

As for the appeals for a free in the final 3 seconds, that was play on all night and would've been an absolutely disgusting call of holding the ball.

It's a heartbreaking loss, but the umps didn't cause it.

Not an easy loss to get over but hopefully a couple of blokes in particular will learn from it.


Oh and ps, the umps didn't cause Laird to play like an absolute donkey up until 3/4 time either. Seriously, was he drunk? Unbelievable stuff from him tonight. Love him, but that was next level terrible.

 

[relapse]

He's got a point.

But... We seem to be better, much better than expected, and much much better than we look on paper. We're not contenders, but we are miles better than we have any right to be.

We can't contend until we can close out consistently, that's true. But how we're competing at the level we are is a mystery. Except for maybe...

Is Don...

The concern is valid about the club's inability over the last decade or so to be able to withstand the wet sail effect in Melbourne against the top clubs. Despite the list completely being turned over and 4 different coaches we witnessed groundhog day once again.

I hoped that the Bulldogs final last year got the monkey off our backs, but it's still clearly still there.

 

[NTRabbit]

Haven't read the rest, too angry.

Thought Douglas was probably our poorest tonight. That's a few sub par games in a row to start the season, he really seems to be struggling to come to grips with either the new speed to our game, or whatever his role is supposed to be.

Scott Thompson remains a titan.

 

[GROTTO]

Menzel, Milera and Brouch.

We definitely have another gear, these are A class players at their peak potentially to come in.

I look forward to playing hopefully the Hawks in September.

 

[Sanders]

Ive had 7 jaeger bombs

And only another 7 to go!

 

[relapse]

Some pretty clownish posting going on tonight. Resembles facebook more than it does a footy forum. I'm guessing everyone's drunk as **** or something.

Wanna know how many goals hawthorn kicked from umpiring mistakes tonight? Probably exactly the same number we did! 5 of the 6 goals they kicked directky from frees were genuine frees from where I sat. 1 was a bit dicey but nothing that wasn't at least understandable.

Did we get smashed in centre clearances because of the umpires? No. You lose centre clearances 21-12, guess what? You probably lose the game.

Did the umpires influence the tackle count? No. You lose the tackle count by 20, guess what? You probably lose the game.


The umps made a number of clear blunders on the night. The holding the ball against Douglas (did not lead to a Hawks goal). The phantom free against Tex (actually indirectly led to a Crows behind). The non-mark to Lynch (this one was pretty shit but certainly didn't decide the game ffs). These are the ones people remember because they were near the end.

Guess what? In an amazing turn of events, not every bad decision went against us tonight! I'd say there were probably 15 howlers, and we were on the bad end of about 8 of them. 5 or 6 of those 8 cost us absolutely nothing.

There's a number of reasons why we lost the game. Our inability to stay composed in the intense heat of the last 5 minutes was one of them. Getting smashed at the centre clearances was another. Being smashed in the tackling was another.

The umpires? Pffft. This was not even close to being a repeat of the 2012 prelim. That day we were cheated out of a grand final spot. I have still to this day not seen more one-sided bullshit than that game. Rules were being invented on the spot. Tonight, we blew it. Despite the stats above, we were HOME if we kept some poise in the last 5. We didn't. Against the greatest team of all time, that doesn't cut it. Puopolo and Cyril took full advantage of CROWS BLUNDERS to kick the last 3 goals.

Goal 1: Smith shank leads to turnover, 10 seconds later Cheney inexplicably fails to dive and knock the ball through despite it being obvious that his opponent was about to go the soccer - Puopolo goals. Umpires had no decisions to make.

Goal 2: ground ball inside 50 for Hawks. Cheney puts one of the most pathetic tackles ever seen on his opponent (can't recall if Puopolo or someone else but probably Puopolo because he was involved in roughly 50 goals tonight it seemed), who is able to fire out a handball to Cyril who goals. Seriously, Cheney needed to force a bounce or a spillage and had a strength advantage here - it was pissweak. Umpires no influence.

Goal 3: Smith shanks a kick-in 48m to a contest. Ball punched out of bounds. Mackay does a Mackay and gets rag-dolled near the boundary from the resulting throw in. Hawks gather loose ball. Pissant attempts to tackle ensue - Thommo for one should've been much more desperate to tackle or smother. Mitchell gets a quick kick inside 50 where Smith is caught lagging behind Puopolo. Smith then makes an absolute **** of himself and gives away a blatant free reminiscent of Rutten in the 09 final against Collingwood (which was also a stupid and blatant free). Goal. Umpiring was spot on.


Whinge all you want about umpiring. They didn't do any of that, or lose the centre clearances, or lose the tackling.

As for the appeals for a free in the final 3 seconds, that was play on all night and would've been an absolutely disgusting call of holding the ball.

It's a heartbreaking loss, but the umps didn't cause it.

Not an easy loss to get over but hopefully a couple of blokes in particular will learn from it.


Oh and ps, the umps didn't cause Laird to play like an absolute donkey up until 3/4 time either. Seriously, was he drunk? Unbelievable stuff from him tonight. Love him, but that was next level terrible.

If I could like this 100 times I would

 

[Stringer2Dogs]

Result aside, I just came here to say the Crows are by far the most exciting team to watch in the AFL. You guys are playing a game style that is pretty unique and I think it will hold up all season and deep into finals.

 

[feenix67]

My concern is that it's the continuation of a pattern.

We don't have the opportunity to redeem ourselves until finals. Unfortunately we now, at best, have to enter finals with that doubt.

Instead of what should have happened. We should have had a great inspiring, confidence building, win.

Here's a pattern, knobjockey.

Last season, Hawthorn pantsed us. Last night we knocked 70ish points off that gap. Thats a grand total of 70 points we have made up on them in 5 matches. With a new coach. And a fresh game plan still being bedded in. And a couple of rookies. And the loss of our B&F form 2015.

Seriously mate, you're full of shit. You go on the main board and argue that we lost the North game because of poor umpiring decisions, and at the same time you're on this board serving up page after page of obnoxious bullshit.

Read the first paragraph and see if you can notice the pattern. Then stop posting.

 

[Tyls83]

The worst thing is we think we are an up and coming side, problem is Hawthorn will do their usual sale of the century and buy in ready made replacements for any retirements or deficiencies they have

 

[relapse]

Here's a pattern, knobjockey.

Last season, Hawthorn pantsed us. Last night we knocked 70ish points off that gap. Thats a grand total of 70 points we have made up on them in 5 matches. With a new coach. And a fresh game plan still being bedded in. And a couple of rookies. And the loss of our B&F form 2015.

Seriously mate, you're full of shit. You go on the main board and argue that we lost the North game because of poor umpiring decisions, and at the same time you're on this board serving up page after page of obnoxious bullshit.

Read the first paragraph and see if you can notice the pattern. Then stop posting.

I don't often agree with ST, but this time I do.

I've gone back from tonight to 2006 and found that for games that end in a margin of 2 goals or less in Victoria that we're 4 wins and 17 losses (23%).

If you look at tonight's game in isolation, yes it is a clear sign of how much we've improved. However, the old chestnut reared it's ugly head again tonight where we failed again to be able to withstand the pressure in the final quarter. While some might choose to ignore the elephant in the room, the damning stat is that over the last 10 years we lose 77% of games in Victoria where the margin is 2 goals or less.

Ultimately it's not going to matter how much the club has improved, until we're mentally strong enough to be able to win our fair share of those games we're not going to be legitimate contenders.

 

[crowsarethebest]

Just another one. Sauce while looking good stats wise is having a very poor year. He's just not athletic enough and if he doesn't win the hit out at the centre bounce, he's absolutely useless. With the game it is played now, it's all about how much damage you do around the ground as a ruckman. Hitouts aren't really in vogue anymore and don't matter. Sauce is a decent link man at times due to his huge engine but him getting run around consistently like a witches hat is depressing. Honestly, I'd try give O'brien a game whenever possible as he seems more athletic and better around the ground.

Doesn't help however that Jenkins gives him little support though...

 

[Long Shanks]

We got beaten on the outside of the contest.

We didn't get enough ball in our half.

We turned the ball over a few times and went into our shell a bit.

Yes the umpiring was as ugly as a half eaten mud cake left in the sun and yes we lost but it's not all as bad as a lot of people on here is making out to be.

 

[MRB37]

Some pretty clownish posting going on tonight. Resembles facebook more than it does a footy forum. I'm guessing everyone's drunk as **** or something.

Wanna know how many goals hawthorn kicked from umpiring mistakes tonight? Probably exactly the same number we did! 5 of the 6 goals they kicked directky from frees were genuine frees from where I sat. 1 was a bit dicey but nothing that wasn't at least understandable.

Did we get smashed in centre clearances because of the umpires? No. You lose centre clearances 21-12, guess what? You probably lose the game.

Did the umpires influence the tackle count? No. You lose the tackle count by 20, guess what? You probably lose the game.


The umps made a number of clear blunders on the night. The holding the ball against Douglas (did not lead to a Hawks goal). The phantom free against Tex (actually indirectly led to a Crows behind). The non-mark to Lynch (this one was pretty shit but certainly didn't decide the game ffs). These are the ones people remember because they were near the end.

Guess what? In an amazing turn of events, not every bad decision went against us tonight! I'd say there were probably 15 howlers, and we were on the bad end of about 8 of them. 5 or 6 of those 8 cost us absolutely nothing.

There's a number of reasons why we lost the game. Our inability to stay composed in the intense heat of the last 5 minutes was one of them. Getting smashed at the centre clearances was another. Being smashed in the tackling was another.

The umpires? Pffft. This was not even close to being a repeat of the 2012 prelim. That day we were cheated out of a grand final spot. I have still to this day not seen more one-sided bullshit than that game. Rules were being invented on the spot. Tonight, we blew it. Despite the stats above, we were HOME if we kept some poise in the last 5. We didn't. Against the greatest team of all time, that doesn't cut it. Puopolo and Cyril took full advantage of CROWS BLUNDERS to kick the last 3 goals.

Goal 1: Smith shank leads to turnover, 10 seconds later Cheney inexplicably fails to dive and knock the ball through despite it being obvious that his opponent was about to go the soccer - Puopolo goals. Umpires had no decisions to make.

Goal 2: ground ball inside 50 for Hawks. Cheney puts one of the most pathetic tackles ever seen on his opponent (can't recall if Puopolo or someone else but probably Puopolo because he was involved in roughly 50 goals tonight it seemed), who is able to fire out a handball to Cyril who goals. Seriously, Cheney needed to force a bounce or a spillage and had a strength advantage here - it was pissweak. Umpires no influence.

Goal 3: Smith shanks a kick-in 48m to a contest. Ball punched out of bounds. Mackay does a Mackay and gets rag-dolled near the boundary from the resulting throw in. Hawks gather loose ball. Pissant attempts to tackle ensue - Thommo for one should've been much more desperate to tackle or smother. Mitchell gets a quick kick inside 50 where Smith is caught lagging behind Puopolo. Smith then makes an absolute **** of himself and gives away a blatant free reminiscent of Rutten in the 09 final against Collingwood (which was also a stupid and blatant free). Goal. Umpiring was spot on.


Whinge all you want about umpiring. They didn't do any of that, or lose the centre clearances, or lose the tackling.

As for the appeals for a free in the final 3 seconds, that was play on all night and would've been an absolutely disgusting call of holding the ball.

It's a heartbreaking loss, but the umps didn't cause it.

Not an easy loss to get over but hopefully a couple of blokes in particular will learn from it.


Oh and ps, the umps didn't cause Laird to play like an absolute donkey up until 3/4 time either. Seriously, was he drunk? Unbelievable stuff from him tonight. Love him, but that was next level terrible.

I'm pretty sure the umps were inventing rules out there tonight. "Team holding the ball", a trip call even though the player was standing upright and never even lost a tad of his footing, "ducking isn't prior".

Haven't read the rest, too angry.

Thought Douglas was probably our poorest tonight. That's a few sub par games in a row to start the season, he really seems to be struggling to come to grips with either the new speed to our game, or whatever his role is supposed to be.

Scott Thompson remains a titan.

Thought Douglas was quite good in the 2nd and 3rd quarters. He's doing more inside work for us this year, it's not where he's at his cleanest though.

 

[Bonkers000]

Last year Hawks got us by 74. We've knocked 71 points of that in 4 games.

 

[jenny61_99]

You know I'm disappointed for the loss. **** the umpires. We lost it in the last five minutes when umps had no bearing and free flowed. There a lot to gain from this.

Did you watch the last five minutes?

 

[momentbymoment]

Soft frees are so frustrating - especially in the final quarter. All the umpires have to do is let the game flow and every fan will be happy.

Guys well played. I went to bed PO about the result and have woken up the same way.

 

[jenny61_99]

I've noticed this too, it reminds me of the old Graham Cornes days where he used to demand that the players not rush points.

I am not sure why we insist on not rushing points, there was a goal that we conceded in the first quarter from a stoppage that was created because we refused to rush the ball through for a behind. Teams like Hawthorn are more than happy to do it whereas we only ever seem to do it as a last resort.

Because sometimes they pay deliberate?