Analysis Hawks 2022 Hypothetical trades (read the pinned post)

[Strapping Young Lad]

Firstly, the "No Kane Cornes

Kane Cornes

Age

41

Ht

183cm

Wt

78kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

23.5

5star

K

12.5

5star

HB

11.0

5star

M

5.2

5star

T

3.3

5star

CL

2.6

4star

No current season stats available

D

13.0

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

5.4

4star

M

3.0

3star

T

1.2

3star

" Rule is back

 

[HedgeFund]

I love Hawthorn and the Sam Mitchell but you have made it seem like I have something against both.

I stayed away from this site for the last few years because this is what always happens. You can see that from my profile picture and username which are no longer relevant.

Some of you regulars think your job is to defend the coach or the club as soon as someone gives an opinion that is not glorifying things.

I'll go now and this time I'll stay away for good so that those of you in control of the forum don't feel offended. But you've been incredibly rude and unfair. I posed an opinion and you attacked me personally for it. I did not attack you or anyone else in such a personal way. This is just a forum. There is no need for it. Not everyone's opinions on a subject will always align with yours in life. Attacking people or thinking yourself as a saviour on behalf of players and coaches (who we are here to discuss) is not your job.

The funny thing is I've been an Analyst for 20 years and I've also been involved with player agents and I actually have something of value to offer, other than just opinions, that is relevant. But I'm not going to accept being treated like this. I came back thinking people may have changed and maybe this time it will be different but I was very wrong. It took just a few days for you to make that clear to me.

I wish you all the best.

 

[almuz]

What’s with the lamenting about (possibly) missing out on players who want a trade?

I’d much rather free hits like Amon.

We miss out on players seeking a trade but keep our draft picks so it’s not a disaster.

 

[Mercy Seat]

What’s with the lamenting about (possibly) missing out on players who want a trade?

I’d much rather free hits like Amon.

We miss out on players seeking a trade but keep our draft picks so it’s not a disaster.

Are we even missing out on players like Bruhn? Seems to be a lot of jumping at shadows. All I’ve seen is some of our ITKs saying it’s basically done, and a few twitter posts suggesting Geelong want him too cos they missed out on Hopper but nothing beyond speculation.

 

[Dewnior]

Why do we want Bruhn?

Because of his surname

 

[Howe Amazing]

James Harmes

22

James Harmes

Age

29

Ht

186cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.4

5star

K

9.4

4star

HB

10.0

5star

M

3.1

3star

T

4.1

5star

CL

2.4

4star

D

16.3

4star

K

7.4

3star

HB

8.9

4star

M

2.9

3star

T

1.6

3star

CL

1.9

4star

D

10.6

3star

K

5.2

2star

HB

5.4

4star

M

1.6

2star

T

1.8

4star

CL

0.2

2star

is one I would look at and would be able to get midfield minutes he might not get with Dees. Should not cost too much and right age bracket

 

[Bremner20]

There’s a huge amount to play out over the coming weeks but I’d be happy with if we end up something like:

-Swap Mitchell for Bergman (port) (or use Mitchell pick for bruhn)
-Swap future 3rd for Flanders (probably need to offer more - maybe a pick slide /swap somewhere)
-Draft Phillipou with our first. See what we can get with our 2nd/3rds.

If we have another trade finding a player that would give us a 2nd would be ideal (but no candidates have hit media as all are contracted).if Gunston leaves maybe we get a future 3rd to offset the trade above.

Would give our midfield a boost (albeit some risk in Flanders/Bergman making it). With Amon that’s potentially 4 new faces in the 22 (assuming our first pick plays a bit).

For anyone interested GC vs Southport on 7mate at 1pm in the “VFL” Should get a good look at Flanders .

 

[Dewnior]

Algorithmically , Tom Mitchell is worth 893 points, which equates to Pick 21.

 

[ahhhhhh]

Absolutely don’t want Bruhn, especially if he costs more than a third rounder. I don’t understand all these people saying he played out of position, Connor MacDonld was played out of position this year and was terrific.

 

[HedgeFund]

It might pay for some of the gloomers to revisit who was being lumped in with Collingwood for most of the year as bringing an “an exciting brand of football to the competition” before injuries struck.

These statements of how we’ve shown little or that we’re a vanilla side with nothing that players or managers would identify as a place to be are too much.

Sure we had some down moments, but we’ve got enough talent and excitement in the current list to have others look at it and think we’re building something on and off the field.

Amon certainly did.

Seems to me there’s a tendency on here for posters to take everything written by some to heart and see things purely in black and white (not Collingwood ). Then they attack the poster for being a troll or un-Hawthorn like.

The reality is there’s shades of grey in every debate. You can support the club……and also identify deficiencies.

People nit-picking at minor / side issues and then attacking the poster, especially when that poster addresses the central argument, seems commonplace.

Hopefully those in charge of this Board recognise this and don’t pander to those for whom this board is apparently supposed to be a shrine to all that’s brown and gold.

Having said all that - I agree with SYL that we were playing exciting footy for a good portion of games in the first half of the year. There was definitely a change in offensive ball movement to be more attacking / direct which was exciting. I don’t think it was necessarily injuries which saw that recede a bit. More that opposition sides watched our new line up more closely and worked out how / when to exploit our defensive deficiencies. We will hopefully get fitter / more confident and able to push back more often when the opposition get a run on in 2023.

Next year will be another step forward, but I agree with Clarko’s Soldier - most players looking to move won’t see us as a desired destination unless / until we have a positive W/L and an established senior coach - which Sam will be in 2024.

 

[burner1]

Absolutely don’t want Bruhn, especially if he costs more than a third rounder. I don’t understand all these people saying he played out of position, Connor MacDonld was played out of position this year and was terrific.

There’s a lot of GWS posters that are pretty adamant he got decent midfield opportunities this year - just wasn’t good enough so fell behind others by end of season. Which is not unusual for a 2nd year mid not being ready - but different from the ‘played out of position’ narrative that there an elite midfield talent that just needs opportunity in the middle.

 

[Brishawk]

Seems to me there’s a tendency on here for posters to take everything written by some to heart and see things purely in black and white (not Collingwood ). Then they attack the poster for being a troll or un-Hawthorn like.

The reality is there’s shades of grey in every debate. You can support the club……and also identify deficiencies.

People nit-picking at minor / side issues and then attacking the poster, especially when that poster addresses the central argument, seems commonplace.

Hopefully those in charge of this Board recognise this and don’t pander to those for whom this board is apparently supposed to be a shrine to all that’s brown and gold.

Having said all that - I agree with SYL that we were playing exciting footy for a good portion of games in the first half of the year. There was definitely a change in offensive ball movement to be more attacking / direct which was exciting. I don’t think it was necessarily injuries which saw that recede a bit. More that opposition sides watched our new line up more closely and worked out how / when to exploit our defensive deficiencies. We will hopefully get fitter / more confident and able to push back more often when the opposition get a run on in 2023.

Next year will be another step forward, but I agree with Clarko’s Soldier - most players looking to move won’t see us as a desired destination unless / until we have a positive W/L and an established senior coach - which Sam will be in 2024.

We don’t need most players to desire us, just some that are on board with our direction and want to be a part of it.

 

[derp de derp]

The problem with this thread as I see it is we have ITK's posting tidbits of information in what is supposed to be a "Hypothetical trades, unfeasible wishlists and crazy suggestions" thread so the lines between "fact" and fiction are becoming blurred. So I'm not surprised that some people are getting confused with some of the posts on here.

Not sure what the point of the Hawks 2022 trade targets - news and snippets thread is when it's all getting lumped here.

I think most of us understand it. What I find most frustrating is when those who claim to know what they are talking about start guessing or offer their opinion under the guise of fact. Then revert back to nothings certain this time of year.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jazzfan]

What’s with the lamenting about (possibly) missing out on players who want a trade?

I’d much rather free hits like Amon.

We miss out on players seeking a trade but keep our draft picks so it’s not a disaster.

I think the idea of Bruhn wanting to come to us, he still might, caused many to talk him up too much on our board.

He's just as likely to make it as he isn't IMO. Not a player I'll lose any sleep over if he doesn't come. Not a player I want either of our first two picks used for.

Amon is a good start. But I would be disappointed if we can't find a way to add another top 30 pick to what we already have.

The best outcome for me isn't Bruhn, our Henry who seems to want to take the easy way out, it's pick 2.

If we could somehow get pick 2 that's the best bloody outcome for us this trade period.

 

[Yardie]

So, as the captain he was not regarded as a leader (that's what an on-field coach is in case you think it's actually like an assistant coach role) but when he wasn't the captain he was a leader. Makes a lot of sense.

Being the Captain and being an on field coach are two very different things.

 

[Billyc]

I think the idea of Bruhn wanting to come to us, he still might, caused many to talk him up too much on our board.

He's just as likely to make it as he isn't IMO. Not a player I'll lose any sleep over if he doesn't come. Not a player I want either of our first two picks used for.

Amon is a good start. But I would be disappointed if we can't find a way to add another top 30 pick to what we already have.

The best outcome for me isn't Bruhn, our Henry who seems to want to take the easy way out, it's pick 2.

If we could somehow get pick 2 that's the best bloody outcome for us this trade period.

Agree. Bruhn was an early pick in a weak draft where Victorian players were selected blindly based on U17s and before that. He’s played one very good AFL game against the worst side in the comp and otherwise struggled for much impact. There are reasons to think he could improve in a different environment given he very obviously never wanted to be there but the chances of him being a star aren’t high. I see him as having a Liam Shiels type ceiling. That’s a neat player to have but im not going to lose sleep one way of the other over him.

Henry likewise isn’t holding his spot for Collingwood and wants to leave a side that looks set to contend for a while. They seem willing to let him move. Could be a solid player but not a break the bank or lose sleep over player.

Top 2 is absolutely what we need as it would give us the best chance of getting what we actually need which is top end elite talent.

Otherwise very happy for us to look at those possible value younger players like Bruhn Flanders and Henry and it would be handy to get one but it’s not likely to be central to our rebuild

 

[TylerDurden]

Edmund saying Tom wants the Pies.
He's got one foot out the door.

 

[KermitJagger]

I love Hawthorn and the Sam Mitchell but you have made it seem like I have something against both.

I stayed away from this site for the last few years because this is what always happens. You can see that from my profile picture and username which are no longer relevant.

Some of you regulars think your job is to defend the coach or the club as soon as someone gives an opinion that is not glorifying things.

I'll go now and this time I'll stay away for good so that those of you in control of the forum don't feel offended. But you've been incredibly rude and unfair. I posed an opinion and you attacked me personally for it. I did not attack you or anyone else in such a personal way. This is just a forum. There is no need for it. Not everyone's opinions on a subject will always align with yours in life. Attacking people or thinking yourself as a saviour on behalf of players and coaches (who we are here to discuss) is not your job.

The funny thing is I've been an Analyst for 20 years and I've also been involved with player agents and I actually have something of value to offer, other than just opinions, that is relevant. But I'm not going to accept being treated like this. I came back thinking people may have changed and maybe this time it will be different but I was very wrong. It took just a few days for you to make that clear to me.

I wish you all the best.

If you can't accept being disagreed with then maybe it's a good idea not to be on an internet discussion board.

None of Brant's post was a personal attack it was against the point you made, you're now the one who got personal by claiming you've got more than just opinions - unlike the rest of us - because of your experience.

I wish you all the best.

 

[Fleabane]

I love Hawthorn and the Sam Mitchell but you have made it seem like I have something against both.

I stayed away from this site for the last few years because this is what always happens. You can see that from my profile picture and username which are no longer relevant.

Some of you regulars think your job is to defend the coach or the club as soon as someone gives an opinion that is not glorifying things.

I'll go now and this time I'll stay away for good so that those of you in control of the forum don't feel offended. But you've been incredibly rude and unfair. I posed an opinion and you attacked me personally for it. I did not attack you or anyone else in such a personal way. This is just a forum. There is no need for it. Not everyone's opinions on a subject will always align with yours in life. Attacking people or thinking yourself as a saviour on behalf of players and coaches (who we are here to discuss) is not your job.

The funny thing is I've been an Analyst for 20 years and I've also been involved with player agents and I actually have something of value to offer, other than just opinions, that is relevant. But I'm not going to accept being treated like this. I came back thinking people may have changed and maybe this time it will be different but I was very wrong. It took just a few days for you to make that clear to me.

I wish you all the best.

A shame, I would have liked you to stay. It's good to have a mix of opinions and insights (not when the person is obviously trolling but just offering a different perspective)

 

[SodaPop]

Edmund saying Tom wants the Pies.
He's got one foot out the door.

What deal do you reckon will get it done?

 

[hawkmang]

22 days until trade period

 

[VandoHawk]

Would like to push for Mitchell + 50 for 15 (values him Pick 23) with us paying a large chunk of his salary.
More likely to be Mitchell & 24 for 15 and 47 (values him Pick 30).

 

[Flukey!]

What deal do you reckon will get it done?

I would say Crisp.

Pies don't have a 2nd rounder but have 3, 3rd rounders.
I cant see them giving up 15 so if the trade is just picks, I feel we get nothing worthwhile.

 

[hawkmang]

Pies will most likely be getting in picks for Grundy and Henry, there’ll be something that satisfies us for Tom in there I’m sure.

 

[CaptainWorpedo]

Even if we do not trade for another player i am already happy.

We have picked up Amon, let go of the players past it or not up to it.

Trade out Tom and Brockman for picks, an focus on the draft.

Next year trades and more f/a will open up for us.

 

[Billyc]

Would like to push for Mitchell + 50 for 15 (values him Pick 23) with us paying a large chunk of his salary.
More likely to be Mitchell & 24 for 15 and 47 (values him Pick 30).

On trade 6, 15 and 47 to West Coast for 2 and 38

OUT: Mitchell, 6, 24
IN: 2, 38

I'd do that. It seems fair for Collingwood to gain Mitchell. Would West Coast?