Opinion Hawthorn - Clarkson - Fagan Racism Investigation

[WaynesWorld19]

Was thinking yesterday ....if the AFL adopt an industry wide report of all Clubs ......and similar issues are reported at other Clubs ....does that mitigate any actions that "may" be taken against the defendants ??

 

[GameofSloanes]

Was thinking yesterday ....if the AFL adopt an industry wide report of all Clubs ......and similar issues are reported at other Clubs ....does that mitigate any actions that "may" be taken against the defendants ??

Nope. Just more people that will lose their right to be involved with AFL imo.

I would seriously hope the same issues that have been reported are not happening at other clubs

Would not be surprised if many clubs do have some problems with the way they deal with indigenous people though, particularly in the past. Hopefully not to the same level as the Hawks

 

[Ramify]

Was thinking yesterday ....if the AFL adopt an industry wide report of all Clubs ......and similar issues are reported at other Clubs ....does that mitigate any actions that "may" be taken against the defendants ??

Don't see how it would or should.
Judge and process each defendant and incident individually as they come.

 

[George Kramer]

Was thinking yesterday ....if the AFL adopt an industry wide report of all Clubs ......and similar issues are reported at other Clubs ....does that mitigate any actions that "may" be taken against the defendants ??

Scorpus can we get the thread title changed to include all Hawks scandal discussion in here so the other thread can be for other stuff and not get lost?

 

[Ramify]

Nope. Just more people that will lose their right to be involved with AFL imo.

I would seriously hope the same issues that have been reported are not happening at other clubs

Would not be surprised if many clubs do have some problems with the way they deal with indigenous people though, particularly in the past. Hopefully not to the same level as the Hawks

I wonder how far back to they investigate?
10 to 40 years -AFL era only etc?

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Don't see how it would or should.
Judge and process each defendant and incident individually as they come.

Was simply thinking, how could the AFL minimize the penalty impact on Fagan and Clarko ......if that's possible

 

[Pick4To6]

I have no idea towards the truth, who is guilty, right or wrong or what will happen to any person involved but what I find strange, why didn’t that young First Nations player go speak to Shaun Burgoyne

9

Shaun Burgoyne

Age

41

Ht

186cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

D/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.0

4star

K

9.9

4star

HB

8.1

5star

M

3.5

4star

T

3.8

5star

MG

162.7

3star

D

10.0

3star

K

5.6

2star

HB

4.4

3star

M

1.7

2star

T

2.6

4star

MG

162.7

3star

D

6.2

2star

K

3.2

2star

HB

3.0

3star

M

1.2

2star

T

1.6

4star

?

This is an extremely serious allegation and an extremely serious topic, If this happened to me, I seek some outside advice.

Why didn’t ‘player x’ go seek some advice from a very experienced player from a very famous football family with a very strong advocacy for First Nation people?

I’m certainly not intimating ‘player x, y or z’ is telling any lies.

When all is said and done, I honestly think a few past players reputations will be destroyed and the AFL will be in complete damage control.

 

[Cap]

I think we need to wait to see what happens with the investigations , both have denied it.

But there should a review on how clubs so things with indigenous players, but also expand it to the whole draft recruitment system and the way rookies are treated.

We are putting vulnerable kids in positions where they can be taken advantage of. Let's make sure they aren't.

I'm not trying to bring this back to white people either, racism is happening to other non whites, it's hate for us to start looking but limit it.

 

[Ramify]

Was simply thinking, how could the AFL minimize the penalty impact on Fagan and Clarko ......if that's possible

Ah, you think they are looking for a workaround? A bit like in the Bombers fiasco?

You old Cynic you.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

We are putting vulnerable kids in positions where they can be taken advantage of. Let's make sure they aren't.

This will reignite the need to increase the Draft Age .....it has many merits ....exposes players to the workforce / study

Allows the players to play in the State League's for a year

 

[Cap]

This will reignite the need to increase the Draft Age .....it has many merits ....exposes players to the workforce / study

Allows the players to play in the State League's for a year

I think they need to look at it.

Maybe not the state league as can you imagine the uproar in the SANFL.

Could you have an expanded under-age platform ? No idea how you'd do it though, which is why there probably isn't one.

 

[GreyCrow]

"Clarkson just leaned over me and demanded that I needed to get rid of my unborn child and my partner. I was then manipulated and convinced to remove my SIM card from my phone, so there was no further contact between my family and me. They told me I’d be living with one of the other coaches from that night onwards."

In a state of shock and confusion, Ian phoned Amy, by then at work herself, and in a conversation that lasted only seconds, relayed information she could barely fathom.

"I just remember that he could barely get the words out and he seemed to be crying, and he quickly said that we needed to terminate the pregnancy and end the relationship," Amy says.

"Just like that. I will never forget that phone call or the heartbreak I felt in that moment. I was frozen on the spot, completely numb from what I had just heard Ian say. I had no idea what was happening.

Amy says worse was to come. With Ian's phone disconnected and his whereabouts unknown, she had to somehow stay calm for her toddler and her unborn baby and hunt down club staff she barely knew.

She says she contacted Hawthorn's player development manager, Jason Burt, and asked for a meeting with Ian to understand what was happening. Pointedly, she asked for the meeting to occur at her home so she had an opportunity to talk with Ian away from the club.

She says Hawthorn officials first asked if they could sit in the street outside while Ian met with Amy as they were concerned about Ian's wellbeing and claimed that Amy's father was a threat to Ian.

"My Dad was a well respected loving and caring Aboriginal man in the community," Amy says.

"He was not a threat to Ian at all. They had never met my Dad — they just assumed he was a threat."

It turned out the club would not be allowing her to meet Ian at all. At a cafe a week later, she says she had to make do with meeting Burt and another Hawthorn staffer, who bluntly repeated the club's stance on the relationship.

"It felt like Burt talked the entire time," Amy says.

"For the whole week Jason had repeatedly told me that Ian had made these decisions on his own, but I knew there was more to it. Burt actually confirmed my thoughts when he said Hawthorn had decided it was better for Ian's footy career if he didn't become a father. He was already a father!

"I had asked for Ian to be present at this meeting because this was about something that would affect his whole life, not just his footy career but they kept him away. I knew then that the club had something to do with Ian's phone call to me.

"They didn't care. They just wanted him to move on from his family and focus on football. Burt said that from then on, I needed to contact him with anything relating to the pregnancy. I felt so alone.

"These people had no idea who he was, who I was, what sort of family we were. They just judged us and broke us apart."

The months following were bewildering for Amy. She says she contacted Burt to advise of an important ultrasound and was reassured Ian would be there, but he never showed up. Not wanting Ian to miss out on the important stages of the pregnancy, unable to text or call him, she resorted to emailing him images of the baby.

Only at the five-month mark of the pregnancy, by which point Ian's mental health had noticeably frayed, did the club finally allow Ian's return to his family. But that too came with conditions: a move away from a suburb the club didn't approve of to one more in keeping with Hawthorn's image.

"They just bullied us into moving house and I gave in, because I felt powerless," Amy says.

"I just wanted to keep my family together and for Ian to live his dream of playing AFL footy. But it meant moving away from family support at a very stressful time. I had gestational diabetes ... we were made to move house when I was 37 weeks pregnant. It was a very stressful time and I remember thinking that I should be resting right now, not moving heavy furniture. I had my baby the following week at 38 weeks."

Three months later, Amy dug in and demanded a return to the neighbourhood where she had support.

"I was suffering with postnatal depression and felt very isolated," she says.

"I needed my family."

Even back in the "rough" suburb, there were smaller slights that still rankle. She says she was affronted when Clarkson insisted on visiting one night and offered commentary on the house's cleanliness.

Six months after the birth of their child, Ian and Amy were shocked to find they were expecting again. She explains the initial excitement she felt and says it "was quickly replaced with fear when I remembered the trauma we had just gone through bringing our previous baby into the world."

"I spoke to Ian and he became stressed immediately. Not because he wasn't a capable, beautiful father, but because we both knew what the reaction of the club would be," Amy says.

"I didn't want to lose Ian again. I needed him there with me and the kids and I didn't want to put his footy career at risk. [I felt like] Hawthorn always used that against us."
She resigned herself to a termination whose heartbreaking legacy now surrounds her in the form of pregnancy-themed artworks and textiles she has created as a means of processing her grief and guilt.

"I remember my mother taking me to the hospital and as I got out of the car she said to me: 'You don't have to do this'," Amy says.

"Before I knew it I was laying in a hospital bed waiting to be taken into the theatre room. The nurses had given me medication to soften my cervix. I remember getting up at one stage and saying to myself 'Just walk out, just leave'. I began to feel the cramps and thought to myself: 'It's too late, they have already given me medication'.

"To this day, I haven't been able to completely forgive myself. I often wonder what life would have been like if I had just listened to my mother or followed through with walking out of the hospital that day. It's a decision I have made in my life that I will always regret."

"This is a sacred thing, the bond between a mother and a child, and Hawthorn wiped their feet all over that.

"Hawthorn says it's the family club. Yet they tore ours apart."

There should be texts , emails and call logs to back this up

 

[jo172]

There should be texts , emails and call logs to back this up

Jackson's article suggests that he has seen emails at least that do back these things up.

 

[Big Crow]

Was simply thinking, how could the AFL minimize the penalty impact on Fagan and Clarko ......if that's possible

You know they’ll try to find a way.

Crows camp reaction was all in on smashing the club.

Reaction to the Hawks revelations has been “this could be happening anywhere”.

Hardly the most important aspect of these things coming to light, but the difference in response from the AFL and AFL media is clear.

 

[jo172]

 

[GreyCrow]

There should also be secondary texts to family members

 

[GreyCrow]

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Thats fairly damning

 

[TheVelourFog]

This will reignite the need to increase the Draft Age .....it has many merits ....exposes players to the workforce / study

Allows the players to play in the State League's for a year

Logistically I think it would be too hard for the AFL to do this. Can you imagine being the team that finished last and was told that basically you couldn't pick the best kids in the country and instead had first choice of any of the players who weren't picked the year before provided they weren't picked in the mid season draft already.
Clubs just wouldn't allow it despite the potential positives it may bring.

 

[relapse]

 

[GROTTO]

Thats fairly damning

Career ending, legacy shattered.

 

[GROTTO]

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Its kinda sad and depressing what has happened and is happening. This kind of humour is welcomed.

 

[jenny61_99]

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She lost the baby.

 

[relapse]

Its kinda sad and depressing what has happened and is happening. This kind of humour is welcomed.

I now kinda wish that Port did sack Hinkley and got Clarkson.

 

[GameofSloanes]

I wonder how far back to they investigate?
10 to 40 years -AFL era only etc?

Last 20 years maybe?
Can't see any point in looking at pre AFL

 

[jo172]

Point being, Kylie is either one of the most prepared liars of all time, playing the long game to take down Clarkson at Fagan, at a not logically beneficial moment, with stories remarkably similar to two other persons or Kylie is telling something that is very substantially the truth.