Actually, it’s the same lynch mob that tried to get rid of Craig, sando, Pyke and Burton. None of us gave 2 cruds about what cats or tigers were doing with their coaches.
-
AFLW 2024 - Round 8 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
Opinion Matthew Nicks: Adelaide's Coach
- Thread starter Thetrader15
- Start date
- Tagged users None
- Status
Actually, it’s the same lynch mob that tried to get rid of Craig, sando, Pyke and Burton. None of us gave 2 cruds about what cats or tigers were doing with their coaches.
MsTopG
Norm Smith Medallist
- Mar 21, 2023
- 5,535
- 5,161
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
Likely wanted to drop him and the compromise was to play him as sub. Someone mentioned he might be making an announcement at some post game shindig. If he is retiring give him a couple of weeks off so he is fresh for the swans game.
Last edited:
WaynesWorld19
Moderator
- Moderator
- #8,678
We were looking at Top 6, 3 weeks ago ......but the two unacceptable losses to GWS (home) and ESS, put paid to that
The GWS game is an anomaly .....41 degree heat, the type of heat GWS train in regularly .....but I do agree, we went too hard too early ....like young colts off a leash
The RICH game was a physical hangover from the extreme heat the week B4 .......IIRC we were leading again, before being run over late ....as we physically tired from the week B4
I prefer to discuss the poor GWS and ESS performances .....they were the key losses
That’s our soft corporate underbelly.
- Aug 30, 2021
- 18,453
- 36,275
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
Of course you just glossed over Nicks errors and made excuses….
jenny61_99
Premium Platinum
Yep, Nicks has made plenty of errors. He’s also done A LOT right. He has re-developed this team from the roots up - probably the hardest of them all, with a vastly improved culture and team first approach. We’ve got kids falling over themselves to re-sign, we’ve attracted two very talented players from other Clubs. These boys want to play for us, the jumper and each other. Our best is scintillating! Nicks has done that. There are some very exciting times ahead! I’d be happy for them to extend his contract now. A couple of weeks ago I said they should wait until mid year next year, but I don’t see the point now. He’s got us playing exciting footy. Once the age and experience profile lifts so too will our consistency.
I'm not 100% sold on Nicks. He seems to make some amazing adjustments when things aren't going well (see the 7 goal 3rd quarter vs Pies at the G) and then other times seems hesitant to make changes. Hard to read
But i think he's shown enough to warrant next year. We have increased our win count every year since he has been our coach and our record vs the top 4 this year has been pretty good overall
Must make finals next year though and we must continue to see the attacking play style where we have been at our best.
Plus we need another good mid and we'll need to recruit another tall based on injuries. If we can manage that, no reason why finals are the minimum pass mark
But i think he's shown enough to warrant next year. We have increased our win count every year since he has been our coach and our record vs the top 4 this year has been pretty good overall
Must make finals next year though and we must continue to see the attacking play style where we have been at our best.
Plus we need another good mid and we'll need to recruit another tall based on injuries. If we can manage that, no reason why finals are the minimum pass mark
- Nov 5, 2009
- 11,224
- 11,444
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
He has done a lot right. I agree 100%.
But to win a flag you need to be exceptional. He is in his 4th season and is still tactically inept. This isn't to dismiss what he has done right to take us where he has taken us.
The question is whether he can take us to the next step. Our away losses, the lack of tactical ability suggest no.
- Aug 30, 2021
- 18,453
- 36,275
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
No one has denied he hasn’t done a lot of good things and the club is a lot happier place, but there have been more changes than just Nicks in that regard. We’ve also got a lot of talent on the list now who are developing, again that’s not just Nicks.
However on to your opening point. The issue is some on here can’t admit to any errors and that’s there a lot of argy bargy relates to. We saw an example of that this week, “this is the best midfield we could field” Sloane then changed to sub “good move Nicks”.
Also how many errors is a senior coach in his 4 year allowed? He’s made a number of them this year and that’s not good enough.
Are there a lot of people who think the club hasn't made any errors? I think Nicks has done pretty well and am happy for him to continue as coach next year but there have definitely been mistakes, especially if we take a 'the buck stops here' approach and consider all club decisions related to the game are ultimately Nicks' responsibility.
I think the dropoff in performance from our younger players in the second half of the year shows that we should have more proactively rested that group. Rachele, Pedlar, Michalanney and Soligo at least all warranted a rest at some stage and it is possible we would have performed better if they had one earlier. I think North would have been a perfect game to rest Rachele and instead we used it as an opportunity to play him for most of the game in the midfield, so basically the opposite of a rest. I understand the logic but think it was a mistake. We'll know more in the next couple of weeks as Rachele comes back from his suspension and we see how he goes.
Selection wise I'm not too upset with how we handled things (resting aside) but I'd have liked to see Sloane as a sub earlier in the year, or see him rested the way Walker and Smith have been. I also think there's a legitimate argument that not selecting Crouch earlier in the year was a mistake, though I definitely wouldn't have thought that a couple of weeks ago.
There's been a few times the gameplan has completely fallen apart, most notably the final quarter against Collingwood at home. Very obvious now when you go back and watch that quarter that the team was stuck in some sort of 'protect the lead' mindset from the start of the quarter, and Nicks should hopefully have been telling them to keep doing what they had been doing for 3 quarters so far, at least until the last 5-10 minutes. We've done a bit better since then but still have last quarter fadeouts. That's something that needs a serious fix next year.
I think the difference of opinion over Nicks comes down to how much stuff like the above matters versus the overall progress of the group, not simply 'Nicks is perfect and never does anything wrong' vs 'Nicks is a hopeless moron'.
I think the dropoff in performance from our younger players in the second half of the year shows that we should have more proactively rested that group. Rachele, Pedlar, Michalanney and Soligo at least all warranted a rest at some stage and it is possible we would have performed better if they had one earlier. I think North would have been a perfect game to rest Rachele and instead we used it as an opportunity to play him for most of the game in the midfield, so basically the opposite of a rest. I understand the logic but think it was a mistake. We'll know more in the next couple of weeks as Rachele comes back from his suspension and we see how he goes.
Selection wise I'm not too upset with how we handled things (resting aside) but I'd have liked to see Sloane as a sub earlier in the year, or see him rested the way Walker and Smith have been. I also think there's a legitimate argument that not selecting Crouch earlier in the year was a mistake, though I definitely wouldn't have thought that a couple of weeks ago.
There's been a few times the gameplan has completely fallen apart, most notably the final quarter against Collingwood at home. Very obvious now when you go back and watch that quarter that the team was stuck in some sort of 'protect the lead' mindset from the start of the quarter, and Nicks should hopefully have been telling them to keep doing what they had been doing for 3 quarters so far, at least until the last 5-10 minutes. We've done a bit better since then but still have last quarter fadeouts. That's something that needs a serious fix next year.
I think the difference of opinion over Nicks comes down to how much stuff like the above matters versus the overall progress of the group, not simply 'Nicks is perfect and never does anything wrong' vs 'Nicks is a hopeless moron'.
- Sep 3, 2018
- 5,261
- 6,923
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
So where do we want our profile to be in a couple of years time? Let’s not think week by week. We have currently 5-6 guys on the list that have played 100 plus and another 6-7 that are between 60-100. Rightly or wrongly we have identified the group you listed as the core group to get games into - as well as the more elite talent that has been drafted later
Some are there temporarily to help with the games profile and will drop out ove the next 12 months or so (Sloane) but this will build our profile to where it needs to get to
Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
- Sep 11, 2009
- 5,237
- 4,147
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
GWS game you could blame the coach. It was round 1, he went in with a plan and some things didn't work. Berry was soon removed from the 22, wasn't playing well enough. Likewise Brown. Cogs has been a beast all year, not many coaches have stopped him. Some would blame Rankine for that loss, 2.5 he kicked. Personally I blame the team for goal kicking at 40% conversion rate.
Tigers, again we kicked at 38% conversion, that is terrible. Richmond to their credit kicked 17.4 with 2 others rushed, that conversion rate is above AFL average. Statistically the teams were quite even. We generated more scoring shots so the game plan held up. The players didn't finish off their work.
Collingwood game, if I remember rightly Nick's owned that mistake. I believe it was a management thing, Soligo had been on high Time On Ground and they wanted to give him a lighter game. Everything is easy in hindsight I guess. It's hard to look past our amazing conversion rate though. We had more scoring shots, kicked 7.13 to their 8.4 taking out rushed behinds.
Are you saying the maturation of the playing group has nothing to do with the Coach?
- Nov 5, 2009
- 11,224
- 11,444
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
So he made mistakes but they don't count because it was round 1? This is the big league pal - you are accountable for mistakes.
No comment on going in short without a 3rd KPD and having the Tigers 3 talls kick 8 on us?!?!?! You seem to place all the blame on the players and none on the coaching staff.
Question. Your first sentence you admit it was a mistake and that Nicks owned it. The next 5 sentences try and justify the mistake and place blame elsewhere - that simply doesn't make sense!
He has been a part of culture and retention - no doubt.
I guess my point is that a more tactical and astute coach would have us in the 8. My preseason assertion was that our list was good enough to make the 8 if our coach was good enough. Thats still the case.
- Sep 11, 2009
- 5,237
- 4,147
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
Find me one coach who hasn't made errors. Nicks has tried things. Some have worked and some haven't. I much prefer this than a coach who doesn't try anything.
It's very easy to judge this stuff in hindsight. Perfect example, most were up in arms about Crouch staying in the team with Laird back. Turns out it worked really well. Hinge on Powel Pepper was great. Smith to the wing. Selection of Keane over Borlase. Sloane to sub. Every little tinker and instruction and game plan adjustment that worked gets forgotten or not even mentioned. Many we dont even know about. But the 1 thing that didn't work becomes the focus in a loss as people generally need to find something to blame.
I don't have a strong opinion either way with Nicks. Though I don't see any reason to give him an extension at the moment.
Not trying to compare Nicks to Hardwick, but watched an interview with him a while back in which he admitted that a large part of his journey was learning from the mistakes he made leading into 2017.
I'm not convinced Hardwick would work tbh.
No one is pinching nicks, no need to jump just yet.
- Sep 11, 2009
- 5,237
- 4,147
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
Dont twist words, its a terrible habit. I never said the mistakes dont count because it is round one. I said it was round one and Nicks tried some things, some worked and some didnt. Find me one coach who hasn't made mistakes. One government. One researcher. One supervisor. One football player. One parent. One student. One human being who hasn't made mistakes. The true test is what the individual does after making a mistake.
How many changes were on display in that round 1 game that did work? Things the team did differently from the previous year? Why dont we talk about them, and instead only focus on the "mistakes".
You also mentioned Nicks bringing in Brown as a sub and ineffectively tagging Cogs as if it was a mistake. Cogs has dropped below 25 touches only twice this year, no team has really stopped him, and Brown isnt in our 22 now.
Sure, ill comment.
Tom Lynch kicked 3.0. In his previous 15 games Lynch kicked 3 goals or more 12 times. 3.0 was actually his lowest return in the last 7 games, and 4th lowest in last 15 games. Bloke is a gun and 3 goals wasnt a bad outcome.
Riewoldt kicked 2.2, about his norm. Nothing special there.
Ryan is a 206cm giant. Kicked 3, averages just under a goal a game. Thats the only one I have an issue with.
On their recent form in the lead up to the game, 6 goals from the 3 talls would have been a slight win. They got 8. Meanwhile the rest of their forward line only contributed 3 goals between them. On 2022 averages Martin, Bolton, Rioli and Graham average 4.5 goals a game. Perhaps the smaller defense helped reduce the smalls impact, but lost out in the talls. Play Butts, Bolton and Martin kick 2 or 3 more and the "mistake" was playing too tall.
Conceeding 4 goals to their mids was worse than the 8 from their talls.
Worse again is us kicking 10.16. Richmond kicking 17.6 is one of the most accurate games of the season.
Actually I never said I admitted it was a mistake, it says Nicks admitted it was a mistake. I wrote what I remember from the article or interview with Nicks later that week regarding the Soligo subbing, the article used Time On Ground management as the reasoning.
What do you think had a bigger impact in losing that game? Subbing Soligo, the impact this had is nothing but speculation and assumptions. Or the cold hard fact that the team collectively kicked 7.13 to Collingwoods 8.4. We missed a lot of gettable goals and just a single one of those shots on goal changes the outcome from a L to a W.
The decision to sub Soligo comes from people with decades of experience in sports science, physical management etc. I tend to trust their decisions just as I trust my doctor to diagnose me if I am sick.
Greenfinger
(formerly crowbots are dead)
- Sep 21, 2021
- 532
- 1,190
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
Didn’t like the footage of nicks joking with players about giving contract extensions for keen and Murphy. I know it was jokes but feels inappropriate and too matey for me. No need to bring in contract talk like that
too piss weak to actually drop Sloane.
- Sep 20, 2014
- 1,928
- 1,784
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
- Other Teams
- dallas cowboys,chicago bulls
jenny61_99
Premium Platinum
God forbid they come up with novel ways to announce extensions.
God forbid a coach smile in front of players. That's not tough and manly something something.... shit coach.God forbid they come up with novel ways to announce extensions.
On SM-G781B using BigFooty.com mobile app
- Aug 30, 2021
- 18,453
- 36,275
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
Hindsight? What I find a cop out is hiding behind that when nuffies point out the errors beforehand.
As for other coaches errors, easy to say, multiple examples from some coaches please.
Nicks has made a lot of mistakes that would have probably seen him sacked by now had we not bottomed out like we had and are in full rebuild. He has made way too many mistakes for an extension right now. Not a single club will be knocking on Nicks door for a coaching gig. Lets just wait and see how we stand at the middle of next year.
My main fear is we end up stagnated around the 8-10 position because he failed to put games into players outside of the 25 he over selected until the season was virtually almost lost and it was forced on him. We had a good run with injuries, the big question is what happens when we dont? thats what Nicks hasn't prepared the list for.
I wonder if someone has had a word in his ear about selection. The other coaches maybe. Because there is no doubt had it been 5 weeks ago McHenry or Sholl would have come into the side instead of Soligo.
My main fear is we end up stagnated around the 8-10 position because he failed to put games into players outside of the 25 he over selected until the season was virtually almost lost and it was forced on him. We had a good run with injuries, the big question is what happens when we dont? thats what Nicks hasn't prepared the list for.
I wonder if someone has had a word in his ear about selection. The other coaches maybe. Because there is no doubt had it been 5 weeks ago McHenry or Sholl would have come into the side instead of Soligo.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Poll
