Opinion No Opp. Supporters - Ampol Sponsorship: A Bridge too Far

[Arr0w]

B&S didn't act? There's a whole web of life around fossil fuels. Action should and can happen in many places.

What did B&S do, write to club? That "could" sway change, especially if a large percentage of members did the same, say a third

The same percentage not renewing their membership, that would certainly force change

Actions not statements

What view do we have on a certified supplier of another longterm sponsor, found to have used child labour, or that very company producing fossil fuel vehicles

Not many companies could claim a clean bill of health

 

[BlueGum]

What did B&S do, write to club? That "could" sway change, especially if a large percentage of members did the same, say a third

The same percentage not renewing their membership, that would certainly force change

Actions not statements

What view do we have on a certified supplier of another longterm sponsor, found to have used child labour, or that very company producing fossil fuel vehicles

Not many companies could claim a clean bill of health

He did more than write to the club. Never claimed perfection by any sponsor or company or person or government or recruiter. Improvement should always be on the agenda.

 

[Arr0w]

He did more than write to the club. Never claimed perfection by any sponsor or company or person or government or recruiter. Improvement should always be on the agenda.

We can play our part in fossil emissions, we just need a strategy to deal with thylacine60

 

[Blue and Silver]

What did B&S do, write to club? That "could" sway change, especially if a large percentage of members did the same, say a third

The same percentage not renewing their membership, that would certainly force change

Actions not statements

What view do we have on a certified supplier of another longterm sponsor, found to have used child labour, or that very company producing fossil fuel vehicles

Not many companies could claim a clean bill of health

So, because my actions have no reasonable chance of achieving my ideal outcome, I should just shut up and sit pretty?

You can't say that it's silly to call for action, that I must wait for some imagined tipping point.

I chose this moment, where the club chose this sponsorship, to make my disappointment known.

I chose to do so publicly in the hope, that in some small way, this might encourage others.

I could have done nothing, and then we wouldn't be talking about it. But the stakes are too high, and I felt this violation a step too far.

Maybe just starting some conversations here will help?

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[ctwenty1]

We can play our part in fossil emissions, we just need a strategy to deal with thylacine60

Impossible

 

[Arr0w]

So, because my actions have no reasonable chance of achieving my ideal outcome, I should just shut up and sit pretty?

Not at all, I am an advocate for freedom of speech

You can't say that it's silly to call for action, that I must wait for some imagined tipping point.

Everyone has a tipping point, on a consistent basis or otherwise

I chose this moment, where the club chose this sponsorship, to make my disappointment known.

Which you are entitled to do, in writing, face to face or cancelling your support for the club

I chose to do so publicly in the hope, that in some small way, this might encourage others.

It may, and if that's part of your goal, it would be an extra layer of satisfaction

I could have done nothing, and then we wouldn't be talking about it. But the stakes are too high, and I felt this violation a step too far.

As I said, everyone has a tipping point

Maybe just starting some conversations here will help?

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Help as in forcing change? Possibly

 

[passmark]

Surprise! Corporate ghoul President decides to trade warm and fuzzie memories like carbon credits.


I hear Raytheon are looking at trying to improve the image around their cluster munitions. Hopefully it involves lots of images of shiny faced kids getting Crippa to sign their jumpers.

**** this club.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

What Australia and the Carlton FC do re our emission targets and oil programs is irrelevant. While I could list hundreds of absolutely essential every day items such as mobile phones, medicines, vaccines, shoes, MRI machines, roads, lubricants, jet fuel etc that are made with oil it's really all pointless anyway.

Go convince America, China and Russia to dismantle their militaries and maybe there's a chance we can save the world from climate change. Collectively those 3 countries produce enough CO2 to doom us all regardless of what the rest of the world does. Given all 3 are in a mini cold war to be the world superpower over the next 100 years id suggest protests, letters of complaint and anything else you do will fall on deaf ears but go right ahead of you think they'll give a toss.

As for Carlton, if it helps fund our footy program and that means I get to see us belt the filth a few more times before the icecaps melt then I say go for it.

 

[ferrisb]

Confucius say if Ampol truly a bridge too far, then need even more petrol to get there...

 

[BlueGum]

We can play our part in fossil emissions, we just need a strategy to deal with thylacine60

He has it in hand.

 

[GoBlues!]

We can play our part in fossil emissions, we just need a strategy to deal with thylacine60

Have to disagree arrow, since Thy has cut back on Indian food his emissions are almost under control..

 

[lily of laguna]

Will check it out!


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[lily of laguna]

What Australia and the Carlton FC do re our emission targets and oil programs is irrelevant. While I could list hundreds of absolutely essential every day items such as mobile phones, medicines, vaccines, shoes, MRI machines, roads, lubricants, jet fuel etc that are made with oil it's really all pointless anyway.

Go convince America, China and Russia to dismantle their militaries and maybe there's a chance we can save the world from climate change. Collectively those 3 countries produce enough CO2 to doom us all regardless of what the rest of the world does. Given all 3 are in a mini cold war to be the world superpower over the next 100 years id suggest protests, letters of complaint and anything else you do will fall on deaf ears but go right ahead of you think they'll give a toss.

As for Carlton, if it helps fund our footy program and that means I get to see us belt the filth a few more times before the icecaps melt then I say go for it.

Nah, each country has a global responsibility including Australia.

We are in a position to show what is possible in the renewable transition and don’t think for a moment that other global leaders are not looking at South Australia as an example of what can be done.

Can’t leave it to the big boys it’s a team sport!!!!!!


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[Fabab]

I was quoted on an earlier post so have came back in this thread.
So the fans that have an issue with ampol dont drive petrol or diesel vehicles and dont use buses etc or fly anywhere?
We must have the fittest fan group in the Afl as its walking or ,jogging or cycling to work or just to get from A to B.

Nothing previously about complaining about Hyundai or virgin or any other sponsor?

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Nah, each country has a global responsibility including Australia.

We are in a position to show what is possible in the renewable transition and don’t think for a moment that other global leaders are not looking at South Australia as an example of what can be done.

Can’t leave it to the big boys it’s a team sport!!!!!!


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

China and the USA account for 45% of the worlds total CO2 emissions. We account for 1.1%.

Unfortunately it's a bit more like Basketball than AFL, the big guns dominate the league and the role players are just along for the ride.

Chinas gearing up to invade Taiwan and the USA is gearing up to go to war with them when they do.

We could close down every coal mine, block every oil venture, ban every petrol car and turn every cattle farm into forest land here in Australia... It still wouldn't do jack ****

 

[djw1952]

Today's announcement of Ampol sponsoring the club, has made me angry in a fairly profound way.

Ampol, as you might know is a brand of Petrol Station, formerly operating as CalTex in large parts of Australia.

They are obviously a massive provider of fossil fuels in this country and a key part of the lobbying groups to maintain Australia's dependency on these fuels.

They have a clear business interest in prolonging the use of fossil fuels in personal transportation for as long as possible with no regard to the existential danger this poses to large portions of the world, particularly Australia.

While I have been no fan of many a corporate sponsor, I have never felt that any of them were so egregious as to require an active resistance.

But I cannot stomach that the Carlton Football Club will be used to try and buy any sort of complicity in the ongoing crisis.

The Oil and Gas industry are actively trying to fight progress and transition to a clean energy system.

I cannot and will not support them, our great football club should not be used to support them.

I know that the mods may feel this is "political" but I feel it is too important, and central to how Carlton presents to its members for it to be shuffled off the board.

I intend to write to the club about this, and to look at other options in trying to dissuade the club from continuing with this immoral and frankly dangerous sponsorship.

Totally agree with you as the club is selling it`s soul doing this and just shows that too many people are still burying their head in the sand when it comes to having a conscience about the damage big polluters really are doing to the planet, just so their Ceo, shareholders and company executives can live in more luxury, while we mere mortals and the future generations of Aussies have to live on this planet and put up with temperatures like Sydney has just experienced as a regular occurence!!! I cannot see this sponsorship as anything but blood money by the club, and backing a mob like Ampol that do not give a rats arse about the planets`future is just doing a deal with the devil, and even worse than the AFL and their support of gambling........but then again I really love this planet so perhaps I am too biased, but we are not going to another one anytime soon so why support a bunch of thugs like the fossil fuel companies as it`s like drinking poison as far as I am concerned........

 

[NYCFC]

I work in the advertising industry, and many advertising networks refuse to work with big oil, largely because what they want from us is effectively greenwashing. Our role is/would be to actively position them as part of the solution, rather than as part of the problem. To position their pitiful efforts around renewables as core to their efforts. Lying, essentially.

Sponsorship in the AFL is really more about basic brand recognition at the retail level than anything else. Specific messaging is non-existent. Hyundai uses Carlton for brand visibility rather than to say anything about their cars or their company.

Ampol has 1,900+ retail outlets across Australia, and I'd imagine the point of this sponsorship is purely to gain top of mind brand recognition vs Shell, BP, Coles Express, etc. They want you to fill up there so they can sell you more shit from their retail shop than anything else (not a lot of $ in actually selling you the petrol).

So the role of the club is to help create brand recognition ultimately leading to preference over other petrol retailers (or at the very least not driving past an Ampol in favor of a BP, rather than greenwashing the role of the company.

Nuance maybe, but one that makes a difference to me. I'm ok with this.

But I also understand people who take an absolutist stance on this. We all have different levels of commitment to causes and also many of us (and I know I'm one) will turn more a blind eye to something if it's in service of the club we love, and may ultimately lead to on field success.

 

[katmanblue]

Pokies contributed 20 million to our coffers last year.

Now we're in bed with polluters as well. Great.

Where do you draw the line?

Are cars not a major source of pollution?

Should we return all the money Hyundai have pumped in until they have 100% electric cars made in factories that use 100% renewable energy?

That's a little facetious but the point stands.

A football club should not be the arbiter of right and wrong, good and bad.

A company whicg is operating legally, within the laws of the land, has approached Carlton for a sponsorship and Carlton FC have accepted.

If we don't like that, we should be contacting politicians to get those laws changed, not the football club.

I wonder how many of the people raising concerns about Ampol continue to put petrol/diesel into their cars week on week? You can bet it's not zero.

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[bigm386]

Today's announcement of Ampol sponsoring the club, has made me angry in a fairly profound way.

Ampol, as you might know is a brand of Petrol Station, formerly operating as CalTex in large parts of Australia.

They are obviously a massive provider of fossil fuels in this country and a key part of the lobbying groups to maintain Australia's dependency on these fuels.

They have a clear business interest in prolonging the use of fossil fuels in personal transportation for as long as possible with no regard to the existential danger this poses to large portions of the world, particularly Australia.

While I have been no fan of many a corporate sponsor, I have never felt that any of them were so egregious as to require an active resistance.

But I cannot stomach that the Carlton Football Club will be used to try and buy any sort of complicity in the ongoing crisis.

The Oil and Gas industry are actively trying to fight progress and transition to a clean energy system.

I cannot and will not support them, our great football club should not be used to support them.

I know that the mods may feel this is "political" but I feel it is too important, and central to how Carlton presents to its members for it to be shuffled off the board.

I intend to write to the club about this, and to look at other options in trying to dissuade the club from continuing with this immoral and frankly dangerous sponsorship.

I agree with your concerns in principal, but I also doubt it's possible for all supporters to agree with all sponsors. I really didn't like a few years ago when the club came out talking up Frydenberg and the Feds contribution to IKON park redevelopment while practically ignoring the equal contribution from the state Labor gov.

Reality is, most people just don't care. Although I do appreciate your effort.

 

[lily of laguna]

China and the USA account for 45% of the worlds total CO2 emissions. We account for 1.1%.

Unfortunately it's a bit more like Basketball than AFL, the big guns dominate the league and the role players are just along for the ride.

Chinas gearing up to invade Taiwan and the USA is gearing up to go to war with them when they do.

We could close down every coal mine, block every oil venture, ban every petrol car and turn every cattle farm into forest land here in Australia... It still wouldn't do jack ****

You are missing the point.

Yes we have less emissions though not so much on a per capita basis.

And no one is suggesting cold turkey moves, we can still have valuable input to the challenges if we are serious about moving forward.

The alternative is to ‘throw another log on the fire’, business as usual??




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[bigm386]

China and the USA account for 45% of the worlds total CO2 emissions. We account for 1.1%.

Unfortunately it's a bit more like Basketball than AFL, the big guns dominate the league and the role players are just along for the ride.

Chinas gearing up to invade Taiwan and the USA is gearing up to go to war with them when they do.

We could close down every coal mine, block every oil venture, ban every petrol car and turn every cattle farm into forest land here in Australia... It still wouldn't do jack ****

You do realise if all the countries that make up the other 55% do nothing the outcome is still the same yes?

What is also missed is Australia is a massive exporter of fossil fuels, second in coal and fifth in gas. Although those fuels aren't burnt here we do enable it. So two points who should be responsible for those emissions firstly and secondly if the global economy demands it why shouldn't we supply it? This is really the challenge we face. Do we value the short term financial gain, which let's be honest largely goes to overseas internationals OR the long term survivability of the species (Assuming you believe in science).

Finally, it's easy to point to China's emissions. While also ignoring China is essentially the worlds production line. So we actually benefit significantly as do most countries from the China emissions.

It's a one in all in problem and a very tangled web .

 

[ITCHY EYEBALLS]

Will check it out!


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I saw on the news last night that if are to reach net zero emissions using renewables it will require the use of 1/3 of our agricultural land (our food supply ) and 15% of our total land mass. 162,000,000 million acres! Think about that for a minute

 

[bradfisher14]

Not at all, but if you want change, it's more about actions than statements

Glad you have arrived at a slightly more balanced point of view.

However, there has to be room for actions and statements. We agree that actions drive change more effectively. Statements are the next avenue to do so where actions are not possible or practical. Yes, we are all reliant on fossil fuels in many aspects of our daily lives, but this hypocrisy should not preclude people from demanding better. To suggest that you should keep quiet until you have boycotted fossil fuels entirely is regressive and unnecessary.

 

[BluStreak]

FWIW lithium is an incredibly recyclable material, ballpark of 95-98% recyclable (& improving).

Lithium-ion battery recycling

How can we best address Australia's annual 3,300 tonnes of lithium-ion battery waste?

www.csiro.au

 

[myopic]

Sad reality is Australia is going to need diesel trucks moving forwards.
Even the Nev industry acknowledges this.