Toast Round 1 = St Kilda 85-102 Collingwood

[Apex36]

LOL. Love your crystal balling, shame the current reality is nothing like delivering on that potential. Macrae can keep working at VFL level and earn his opportunities.

As opposed to Brown, who’s never even cracked 20 disposals in a game, in 4 years at the club delivering on his potential? Since you’re so hot on stats then obviously you realise that Fins numbers were deflated by his 2 games last year playing as sun where he only got 2 disposals in very limited tog.
Fact is that Fins debut had him putting up numbers equal to T Browns best games over 4 years. I’m not sure how you can say that Brown has done anything more than Fin has at this point to earn his opportunity aside from being at the club for a longer period of time with a lower output.

 

[hellfire]

Yesterday was 13 games since the 2019 grand final

Howe is exceptional… no one said his form would be the issue… but he is one more serious season leg injury from retirement

So let’s hope he gets through this season unscathed

 

[Chief Ten Beers]

Yesterday was 13 games since the 2019 grand final

Howe is exceptional… no one said his form would be the issue… but he is one more serious season leg injury from retirement

So let’s hope he gets through this season unscathed

Yeah, hope he doesn't do a Swanny. Knowing our luck...

 

[Mollythedolly]

As opposed to Brown, who’s never even cracked 20 disposals in a game, in 4 years at the club delivering on his potential? Since you’re so hot on stats then obviously you realise that Fins numbers were deflated by his 2 games last year playing as sun where he only got 2 disposals in very limited tog.
Fact is that Fins debut had him putting up numbers equal to T Browns best games over 4 years. I’m not sure how you can say that Brown has done anything more than Fin has at this point to earn his opportunity aside from being at the club for a longer period of time with a lower output.

Macrae couldn’t even make the emergencies so he’s seen as being behind not only Tyler Brown but also his brother and Harvey Harrison… but you know better than selectors….

I’ve also been watching closely the reporting from the VFL practice match against Sandy and he hasn’t even rated a mention yet. So no form going into the weekend and nothing to suggest that’s changed… but don’t let that stop you calling for his inclusion.

His time will come, when he’s earned it.

 

[Mollythedolly]

Missed a huge chance to boost our percentage!

Not as badly as Essendon.

 

[Mollythedolly]

King and Membrey missed some very gettable shots. So many bullets dodged in the 2nd and 3rd qtrs.

Wasn’t it great.

 

[Carringbush2010]

De Goey BOG for me, Lipinski will be an important cog going forward. Wasn’t impressed early in the first when he pulled out of the contest and dropped the uncontested mark running with the flight. But he compensated in other ways.

Sidey is exactly what he should be at his age, more about quality than quantity. He would have been a great asset in a premiership contending side. Just pointing this out to all who thought he didn’t have trade value. Great asset to have teaching our younger players on field.

Josh Daicos is a gun.

Nick Daicos will be a gun no doubt, but im not reading too much into the stats.

I thought Noble had a very good game. As did most of the team to be fair. First noticed the intentional ‘chaos’ ball from Pendles when he switched his grip to tumble the ball forward. What a great tactic when you don’t know what you’re kicking to going forward, certainly limits the intercept marks in our forward 50.

I’m still not convinced we have the skills to play this game style, even st Kilda chopped us up on the rebound from the turnover ….we will struggle against better sides.

'Chaos ball' does not require elite ball use, it requires outnumbering with and without ball. Notice how we closed space without it, that's a deliberate ploy.

This style is somewhat similar to 2018, swarm and spread. You would be right in saying we had better ball users then, but that was our system that enabled us to be a better team than the sum of its parts.

 

[Bianconeri]

Macrae couldn’t even make the emergencies so he’s seen as being behind not only Tyler Brown but also his brother and Harvey Harrison… but you know better than selectors….

I’ve also been watching closely the reporting from the VFL practice match against Sandy and he hasn’t even rated a mention yet. So no form going into the weekend and nothing to suggest that’s changed… but don’t let that stop you calling for his inclusion.

His time will come, when he’s earned it.

Surely the Buckley era has taught us coaches aren’t infallible and the selection team can get it very wrong.

 

[Apex36]

Surely the Buckley era has taught us coaches aren’t infallible and the selection team can get it very wrong.

No point in arguing with the sycophants that act like the club is incapable of making the wrong calls mate, you may as well be banging your head against a brick wall.

 

[Mollythedolly]

Surely the Buckley era has taught us coaches aren’t infallible and the selection team can get it very wrong.

They have more information on which to base their decisions than we do so I’m guessing they get more right than us mug punters. We have a very different looking selection committee this year so happy to give them some time. We’re 1-0 at this stage so hard to knock their effort to date.

 

[Mollythedolly]

No point in arguing with the sycophants that act like the club is incapable of making the wrong calls mate, you may as well be banging your head against a brick wall.

LOL, just loving the salt. Grow up.

 

[Go Woods]

It sort of got glossed over because of how laissez faire it all seemed. But that curling goal from Ginnivan was pure class.

Sure he could have done the team thing and tried to drill the ball to an under the pump Elliott. But honestly I don’t mind a small forward whose primary focus is the goals.

Totally agree, can anyone recall the last time we had a hungry small forward prior to Gini?....A guy called Peter Daicos is my guess.

 

[Scodog10]

Just on the whole T Brown thing we’re unanimous in the understanding he doesn’t find enough of it, yeah? That’s just fact and not changing. What I’m struggling with is the “give him a month to see what he’s got” justification. This is it ball winning wise at literally every level he’s played from juniors until now he’s struggled to find the ball. He has to find a second position if he’s going to make it and like Callum in 2021 after we finally gave up on him as a fwd it has to be at VFL level. If we’re taking the give him time path we’re sticking with the wrong Brown anyway…

FWIW I wouldn’t mind getting a look at T Brown as a 3rd tall defender. With Murphy out we’re light on in that department and a Howe injury away from being seriously exposed. He’s heavier than his profile suggests and is the same height as Madgen with a better athletic profile. What’s there to lose? Because he isn’t a mid and his old man went alright undersized at the other end of the ground.

 

[Pie eyed]

Just about to watch the replay, looking forward to it.

Worth the watch.
A good first hit out for a new side with a new game plan.

The fact they came back from losing the lead in the 4th will only build confidence.


Go Pies!

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Brown had just. 53% TOG… first game after a long layoff after doing his shoulder last year. Give him some time.

 

[Scodog10]

Brown had just. 53% TOG… first game after a long layoff after doing his shoulder last year. Give him some time.

Let’s have a football discussion on that point. Specifically what does time at the top level provide him beyond what we’ve seen already? He’s a guy that has the tempo because he looks fine when he get’s it, his shoulder injury (not one that requires extensive fitness work unlike Murphy’s will) was 10 months ago and he’s year 5. Year 5 midfielders don’t make it to year 6 or get a significant block of games without being named Brayden Sier…

The same things can/ have been said of C Brown (fwd), Bianco (fwd) and Kelly (fwd) and the brutal truth is in those roles it’s not going to happen. Can anyone see the theme?

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Let’s have a football discussion on that point. Specifically what does time at the top level provide him beyond what we’ve seen already? He’s a guy that has the tempo because he looks fine when he get’s it, his shoulder injury (not one that requires extensive fitness work) was 10 months ago and he’s year 5. Year 5 midfielders don’t make it to year 6 or get a significant block of games without being named Brayden Sier…

The same things can/ have been said of C Brown (fwd), Bianco (fwd) and Kelly (fwd) and the brutal truth is in those roles it’s not going to happen. Can anyone see the theme?

No I don’t really see any theme except randomly bagging out some players who for one reason or another haven’t made the grade yet.

If there’s no obvious choices to force him out (eg A senior player coming in) then there’s no reason why he shouldn’t get a few games of continuity to settle in to the senior side. That applies to Bianco as well although in Biancos case WHE and Kreuger are waiting in the wings so he might not get the luxury. Tyler has no direct challengers that are demanding his spot… and the VFL season hasn’t started yet.

Re Tyler’s injury… I wasn’t suggesting he had justifiable fitness issues…. More lack of opportunity to display his development or otherwise during 2021. He’s still an open book. Whether he’s on the list or not year is another question… but giving him at least a small block of games now (especially after missing last year);will help us answer that question.

 

[Rusty Beam]

Just on the whole T Brown thing we’re unanimous in the understanding he doesn’t find enough of it, yeah? That’s just fact and not changing. What I’m struggling with is the “give him a month to see what he’s got” justification. This is it ball winning wise at literally every level he’s played from juniors until now he’s struggled to find the ball. He has to find a second position if he’s going to make it and like Callum in 2021 after we finally gave up on him as a fwd it has to be at VFL level. If we’re taking the give him time path we’re sticking with the wrong Brown anyway…

FWIW I wouldn’t mind getting a look at T Brown as a 3rd tall defender. With Murphy out we’re light on in that department and a Howe injury away from being seriously exposed. He’s heavier than his profile suggests and is the same height as Madgen with a better athletic profile. What’s there to lose? Because he isn’t a mid and his old man went alright undersized at the other end of the ground.

I actually don’t mind this idea.

He often looks like he is trying to figure out what to do rather than do it innately. Reacting rather than being proactive.

Play him in defence and just give him a specific job to do as a lockdown type.

 

[Apex36]

LOL, just loving the salt. Grow up.

It’s funny because you’re oblivious to the irony of following the first sentence with the second.

 

[Mollythedolly]

It’s funny because you’re oblivious to the irony of following the first sentence with the second.

No irony, just immaturity on your behalf. Don’t like someone disagreeing with you, try your typically overly aggressive slap down and when that doesn’t work get personal. Just weak. Grow up.

 

[Rusty Beam]

Totally agree, can anyone recall the last time we had a hungry small forward prior to Gini?....A guy called Peter Daicos is my guess.

Dids and Leon… with Krak for a couple of years.

 

[Scodog10]

No I don’t really see any theme except randomly bagging out some players who for one reason or another haven’t made the grade yet.

If there’s no obvious choices to force him out (eg A senior player coming in) then there’s no reason why he shouldn’t get a few games of continuity to settle in to the senior side. That applies to Bianco as well although in Biancos case WHE and Kreuger are waiting in the wings so he might not get the luxury. Tyler has no direct challengers that are demanding his spot… and the VFL season hasn’t started yet.

Re Tyler’s injury… I wasn’t suggesting he had justifiable fitness issues…. More lack of opportunity to display his development or otherwise during 2021. He’s still an open book. Whether he’s on the list or not year is another question… but giving him at least a small block of games now (especially after missing last year);will help us answer that question.

How is pointing out guys are being played out of position bagging out? If anything I was bagging out the previous coaching group for favouring FS’…

Ignoring that the balance wasn’t quite right with Roughy, Maynard and Kreuger out of our best 22 if we need a midfield replacement I would have C Brown every day of the week over T Brown. He’s a senior player just not established. T Brown is able to showcase that 2021 development at VFL level just like Macrae so why should he receive deferential treatment by getting that block in the seniors? Pick guys on form (of which T Brown has never shown any) it’s not hard.

 

[Mollythedolly]

No I don’t really see any theme except randomly bagging out some players who for one reason or another haven’t made the grade yet.

If there’s no obvious choices to force him out (eg A senior player coming in) then there’s no reason why he shouldn’t get a few games of continuity to settle in to the senior side. That applies to Bianco as well although in Biancos case WHE and Kreuger are waiting in the wings so he might not get the luxury. Tyler has no direct challengers that are demanding his spot… and the VFL season hasn’t started yet.

Re Tyler’s injury… I wasn’t suggesting he had justifiable fitness issues…. More lack of opportunity to display his development or otherwise during 2021. He’s still an open book. Whether he’s on the list or not year is another question… but giving him at least a small block of games now (especially after missing last year);will help us answer that question.

I agree. Be good to get a replay of the VFL or a comprehensive report and some stats so we’d at least know what our options are.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

How is pointing out guys are being played out of position bagging out? If anything I was bagging out the previous coaching group for favouring FS’…

Ignoring that the balance wasn’t quite right with Roughy, Maynard and Kreuger out of our best 22 if we need a midfield replacement I would have C Brown every day of the week over T Brown. He’s a senior player just not established. T Brown is able to showcase that 2021 development at VFL level just like Macrae so why should he receive deferential treatment by getting that block in the seniors? Pick guys on form (of which T Brown has never shown any) it’s not hard.

Ok maybe I misread your post. Apologies.

However Almost all young players start their careers being played out of position …it pretty much goes with the territory. How long do you think Nick D will stay on the half back flank?

Maybe Tyler could play half back himself… not a bad suggestion. As for him showing no form…. Refer to my comment about him being unable to display any form last year due to injury. I’ll stick with the clubs judgement over yours.. and hope they give him a decent block of games to gain his confidence.

 

[Scodog10]

Ok maybe I misread your post. Apologies.

However Almost all young players start their careers being played out of position …it pretty much goes with the territory. How long do you think Nick D will stay on the half back flank?

Maybe Tyler could play half back himself… not a bad suggestion. As for him showing no form…. Refer to my comment about him being unable to display any form last year due to injury. I’ll stick with the clubs judgement over yours.. and hope they give him a decent block of games to gain his confidence.

I’m hoping Daicos spends his whole career off HB because it would mean our midfield is absolutely stacked! If it’s a question of how long until he goes in there I think it’s a while off. I would hope when weighing the pros and cons of what a guy is capable of the entirety of his career is taken into account rather than a theory that he missed out last year. Going to Macrae even though I don’t think he’s the solution right now he has shown more at both levels already. The problem for Macrae is the bar is very low up against T Brown who’s probably one of our worst performed midfielders at any level this past decade…