Autopsy Round 4: Hawks have mare against Saints

[Denver Day Lewis]

Senior players need to hang their head in shame with that performance.

Agreed.

Next 4-5 weeks should be telling.

Geelong (MCG)
Sydney (Tas)
Melbourne (MCG)
Essendon (Colonial)
Richmond (MCG)

We should win one, maybe a chance for two. Can't see us winning three. But it's entirely possible we don't win any of them. The Scum always seem to take it to us.

Edit: my prediction is we won't grace the Top 8 again until next season.

 

[Leeda]

Gunston and Worpel completely invisible today.
Mitchell battled hard with very little support. Will give him a tick for effort.
Breust with some junk time goals and very little else.
Howe shouldn't be playing seniors footy.
Hardwick had a mare.
Impey probably fast tracked too early. Seemed well off the pace. Hopefully better for the run.
JOM was poor. Kicked a goal and fu** all else.

Senior players need to hang their head in shame with that performance.

Sam needs to get the belt out…or have a quick and quiet chat to Clarko…am mongrel for
saying it but we at Hawthorn gather ourselves….trying all we can

 

[Stottzy]

Sam Mitchell really does needs to make a big call on this midfield. Omeara, Mitchell and Worpel just don't work in the same team. As long as all 3 remain in the same lineup, we won't be contending. I have preached to people how I reckon Worpel could go the next level and he has..... except he has gone down instead of up. He really does struggle with Omeara and Mitchell in the team. I would rather drop Omeara as I reckon it would benefit him. But sadly you can't get away with a 5 possession game. Worst game I've seen him play.

Newcombe and Jiath the stars again. Reeves good after quarter time.

 

[Hodgey 15]

This is one of those games we expected to see in a rebuilding year.
Still didnt make it pleasant to watch mínd you.

 

[shotgun_blues]

5 possies doesn't cut the mustard any way you spin it. Must be dropped.

 

[Jazzfan]

Games like this will happen at times this year, that's just part of being a rebuilding and young side. Looking at the first month, it's an overwhelming positive.

Review it and get back to work with something to prove against the cats.

Positives:

Reeves
Newcombe finding plenty of the ball today, despite butchering it like everyone else
Lewis, yeah he didn't kick straight but eight shots on goal is still a positive for a young, developing tall
Ward showed courage
Maginness. Yeah he isn't great by foot, but he has some serious pace and running capacity. I hope we persist with him in that wing role he played when coming on, surely ahead of Howe.

Negatives:

Bit worried Ratten showed the blueprint on how to play CJ, Hill destroyed us by pushing up the ground whilst CJ stayed back. In the second half CJ followed him up the ground, and it took away from his trademark game.

Worpel. Statement just has to be made by sending him back to Box Hill. He literally isn't an AFL standard player if he's not playing as an inside mid, Newcombe has gone past him there

Hardwick. Worst game he might have played in 100 games. He'll get back at it but

Gunston. Couldn't get near it. Surely we bring in another tall next week so he can get back to that mobile third tall. Three touches is staggering for a guy of his quality.

O'Meara. Much like Worpel, if he's not playing as an inside mid he just doesn't offer much else. Sadly, it's really clear he's been cruelled by injury and never had the career expected. I'd be honestrly surprised if he's not dropped at some point this year. He just looks slow, unable to weave through traffic. Doubt we see him at all in 2023 to be brutally honest.

Any critiscm of Mitchell, having regard to Worpel and O'Meara. Makes no sense to me that one. He is what he is Tom. Least of our midfield worries.

Ward needs to bring a bit more defensive skills to his game. I'm sure he will get there.

Not sure asking Nash to be a back-up ruckman is helping developing him into that big inside mid.

 

[Jables]

To play this game style you need good ball users and composure. We need more of that, didn't help that some of our best ball users had an off day as well.

I feel like too much of the institutional knowledge gained is just being soaked up by people that won't be in our core in 3 years, the key to this game style is obviously in the midfield and Newcombe is well suited to it, being a more inside version of Isaac Smith basically, but everyone else? They are married to Clarksons grind it out gamestyle he adopted in recent years because he didn't have the cattle to play possession footy anymore. Now maybe that was a mistake but I can see why we did it, best to try and retain a competitive culture because we'd need senior midfielders from another club to compete in a similar age bracket to the rest of our better players. But none of the actual big targets ever went to us.

2005 is a good comparison to the current situation with our last new coach, we already had rough, lewis, buddy, mitchell, hodge, sewell, croad, chance, williams, all assuming a decent amount of responsibility so I could stomach a heavy defeat, gotta learn the coachs gamestyle and we were focusing on learning that possession game and weird new defensive team wide tactics.

But knowing anyone half competent will beat us on their day and we won't likely get much for it is hard to reconcile with. I hope I'm wrong.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

Former player from the 50's. Geoff Wilson i think it was who they announced prior to the game

Yes, Geoff Wilson played 31 games, 30 goals from 1958-1960. Wore the number 18.

 

[Hawker55]

My concern isn’t about level of effort. It’s that he must have tried everything to get into the game and couldn’t.

If Worpel wants to put that level of effort he doesn't even deserve a game at Box Hill

 

[The hands of stone]

Hawks rating in my system is going to take a massive hit today.

You might have to tinker with the system

 

[Jazzfan]

If you're feeling generous you could say last week took it out of us and seeing Gold Coast beating Carlton by 6 goals might lend weight to that.

It also suggest the Carlton hype was another false dawn

 

[hawkman]

Newcombe and Jiath the stars again. Reeves good after quarter time.

Jiath was poor. They played through Hill a lot and he caused a lot of damage

 

[hawkheart]

Agreed.

Next 4-5 weeks should be telling.

Geelong (MCG)
Sydney (Tas)
Melbourne (MCG)
Essendon (Colonial)
Richmond (MCG)

We should win one, maybe a chance for two. Can't see us winning three. But it's entirely possible we don't win any of them. The Scum always seem to take it to us.

Edit: my prediction is we won't grace the Top 8 again until next season.

 

[ahhhhhh]

Sam Mitchell really does needs to make a big call on this midfield. Omeara, Mitchell and Worpel just don't work in the same team. As long as all 3 remain in the same lineup, we won't be contending. I have preached to people how I reckon Worpel could go the next level and he has..... except he has gone down instead of up. He really does struggle with Omeara and Mitchell in the team. I would rather drop Omeara as I reckon it would benefit him. But sadly you can't get away with a 5 possession game. Worst game I've seen him play.

Newcombe and Jiath the stars again. Reeves good after quarter time.

Came here to say the exact same thing, they all play very similar games. Hunt the ball at all costs, but lack defensive intent and when they get it I feel they don’t have the ability to get the ball moving forward in a damaging manner.

Based on Ned Long’s game today at Box Hill I would prefer him over any of them as he is accountable when he doesn’t have the ball. If we don’t win the tap those three are on the back foot immediately and as we’ve seen over the last 4 years, other teams just waltz it out of the middle with ease on a consistent basis.

 

[hawkman]

My concern isn’t about level of effort. It’s that he must have tried everything to get into the game and couldn’t.

I don't think he did though, that is the concern. He spent most of the 2nd half just jogging around

 

[Hawker55]

Jiath was poor. They played through Hill a lot and he caused a lot of damage

CJ was horrible. His last quarter merits dropping - switched off abs played for himself

 

[HedgeFund]

Howe must hold the record for smothers against. He’s that bloody slow from hand to foot to kick. What the hell do we do with JOM and Worps. One has to go for Ned Long. For me it’s JOM

Yeah - drop the current captain when the other bloke had 5 crap touches and has been poor all year.

Pull the other one. They tried to tag Steele with Worpel and Steele ended up with 33 and BOG.

Worpel goes out for at least 2 matches until he can find it 40 times at BH and hit targets at 80%.

He is in worse form than Howe and Maginness. Why persist?

 

[OhhhhhCyril]

That’s a reality check we were bound to have. A frustrating and very disappointing performance from many players, especially the senior ones. Our midfield was particularly poor and our skills and lack of composure were not AFL standard. Was that really the same team I watched last week?

 

[TassieGrown]

Take out first 2 minutes and that was just yuck

midfield, just horrible, slow 2nd to the ball all day. That midfield will have us bottom 6 for sure.

Worpel the invisible man, hardly sighted. Time for a rest bring Long in.

Lewis good game deserved more than 1 goal, great signs he might just kick straight next week.

TOM serviceable game, not the worst by far.

overall some good signs for 2 or 3 years time, the senior part of the side was the problem today.

 

[Kuuz]

Not our day, but despite a drubbing, good to have some positives - all of which bode will for the future:

• Lewis, despite not having the radar on, still kicked three and hit some contested marks (a beauty in the last);
• Newcombe, despite not having many games to his name, was impactful with clearances and I50s;
• Moore, despite a quiet second half, still played an important role for us early, and is going to be a key small forward for us over the next 7-10 years;
• Reeves, did better around the ground and held his own at points against a more experienced ruck duo

Concerns:

• Our midfield depth and stocks are underwhelming. Going to be the challenge over the next few years to turn this train around.
• Worps - surely he's injured as he was labouring at parts in the second half, needs a rest at any rate
• Experienced heads were off today - expect them to bounce back next week against the Cats

Plenty of learning, but hopefully Mitchell isn't too heavy-handed, need to preserve any confidence for future weeks

 

[LunchboxLegend]

Take out first 2 minutes and that was just yuck

midfield, just horrible, slow 2nd to the ball all day. That midfield will have us bottom 6 for sure.

Worpel the invisible man, hardly sighted. Time for a rest bring Long in.

Lewis good game deserved more than 1 goal, great signs he might just kick straight next week.

TOM serviceable game, not the worst by far.

overall some good signs for 2 or 3 years time, the senior part of the side was the problem today.

Lewis kicked 3

 

[badboybobba]

Worpel. Statement just has to be made by sending him back to Box Hill. He literally isn't an AFL standard player if he's not playing as an inside mid, Newcombe has gone past him there

Duke may have gone past him but really he needs to play predominantly midfield, currently JOM and Mitch are pushing him out.

He’s a midfielder being asked to play forward.
That’s the problem with most of our midfielders, they aren’t very good anywhere else.

Worps is a Crimmins medalist playing midfield, he needs to be played there in my opinion.

Time to move on from JOM, his body just doesn’t allow him to be that burst player he was.

 

[Lickmesocks]

Sam Mitchell really does needs to make a big call on this midfield. Omeara, Mitchell and Worpel just don't work in the same team. As long as all 3 remain in the same lineup, we won't be contending. I have preached to people how I reckon Worpel could go the next level and he has..... except he has gone down instead of up. He really does struggle with Omeara and Mitchell in the team. I would rather drop Omeara as I reckon it would benefit him. But sadly you can't get away with a 5 possession game. Worst game I've seen him play.

Newcombe and Jiath the stars again. Reeves good after quarter time.

He did try and trade them to anyone that was interested if you remember back 4 months. Sam knows what he has got and that is a slooooooow midfield that runs one way .

 

[Stottzy]

Jiath was poor. They played through Hill a lot and he caused a lot of damage

I thought he played well considering they were targeting him. Still created a lot off back. Wasn't BOG, but certainly can say he had a go.

 

[detox]

He's a scape goat. He could literally have 40 touches at 100% with 4 goals, and people would want him dropped.

In reality, he came on when the game was done and his teammates were doing nothing to help him

Except he couldn't have 40 touches.

He gets 7 a game, 3 turnovers, and 3 htb against.

He's shown nothing.