Snoops 2016 List Management, Trade and Draft thoughts

[Snoop Dog]

And with marchbank wanting out maybe he does make it our way.
We can give him in number 34
Stewart can have number 36

Nice

Yeah I am excited about getting those two boys. I would have no issue making those two the priority but are they were Buckley wants to spend his 'chips' right now in a year he needs a finals appearance.

 

[Snoop Dog]

But would they come to Us after Passing him as a Father/Son?

Possibly....time heals a lot of wounds and it would be more about opportunity and whether he thinks there is a spot for him. Gubby would be the bridge!

 

[dunno4]

Yeah I think thats right. The work the club have done in the off season more recently has been sensational even when things haven't go their way so when you are confident I share that. Have a look at some of the past few years;

Beams - that has been a win for us. Bloke has barely played for 2 years and whilst he will be good for them I have seen really good things from JDG more recently. Crisp has also been a big winner for us and was a great get.

Thomas - the club made absolutely the right call on him. If we had coughed up $600k for him you can only imagine who that would have meant we would have lost.

Mitch Clark - What a win staying away from that bloke. As per Thomas the medico's got that one right. Dodging him I think enabled us to get Varcoe so that was a win.

Howe - Thats been a win

Freeman - Effectively swapped for Aish and a 2nd rounder. I think Freeman is a footballer but the body is a massive ? We are ahead on that one.

H.Shaw - Heater playing great footy but we did well getting Adams back for mine and he will be a 10 year player for us.

Treloar - Yep he cost us 2 first rounders but we have got a Rolls Royce. A win.

Wellingham - Look he was one I would have love to have kept but he did squib it in a Prelim vs the Swans which irked me. The deal was a good deal. Jury still out on Broomhead though.

Dawes - That was a hard call but it was the right call. Kennedy and he have both been busts.

That's a pretty big l

Yeah I think thats right. The work the club have done in the off season more recently has been sensational even when things haven't go their way so when you are confident I share that. Have a look at some of the past few years;

Beams - that has been a win for us. Bloke has barely played for 2 years and whilst he will be good for them I have seen really good things from JDG more recently. Crisp has also been a big winner for us and was a great get.

Thomas - the club made absolutely the right call on him. If we had coughed up $600k for him you can only imagine who that would have meant we would have lost.

Mitch Clark - What a win staying away from that bloke. As per Thomas the medico's got that one right. Dodging him I think enabled us to get Varcoe so that was a win.

Howe - Thats been a win

Freeman - Effectively swapped for Aish and a 2nd rounder. I think Freeman is a footballer but the body is a massive ? We are ahead on that one.

H.Shaw - Heater playing great footy but we did well getting Adams back for mine and he will be a 10 year player for us.

Treloar - Yep he cost us 2 first rounders but we have got a Rolls Royce. A win.

Wellingham - Look he was one I would have love to have kept but he did squib it in a Prelim vs the Swans which irked me. The deal was a good deal. Jury still out on Broomhead though.

Dawes - That was a hard call but it was the right call. Kennedy and he have both been busts.

thats a pretty big list of wins. Could have been disasterous if some of them had gone the other way.
Just hard for us posters to admit sometimes the footy club knows more than we do!

 

[Snoop Dog]

I reckon he was a waste of a first selection, but who am I to judge?! What makes you think he might 'end up pretty good'?

A few times there was an ability to stand the tackle which is good for a 1st year player and then make a good decision by hand. It showed me he has spacial awareness and his decision making was pretty good. Many of the times he got the ball he did well but he just doesn't get enough.

 

[TradeDraft]

Yeah fair points. I agree and to be fair the games I caught of him weren't his best ones and yes there are some tricks there with him but I think if we are being honest he has a fair way to go. He played 8 games and we should discount his last one obviously but possession for those 7 games were in the range of 6 to 17 and something like 3 of those games had him at less than 10. It wasnt great and he didn't take a contested mark in any game. Granted I didn't see every game but he wasnt hidden on a flank all the time either. Now against that, he hasn't had the normal development path and therefore he shouldn't be measured against a kid that might as he would have needed more development / training etc. You are right he is a long term play and I want to keep him but I question whether we are better off using that senior list spot for someone else.

I see Sier pretty much a New Recurit this year.

Hope he has worked on since being out on getting Fitter

 

[Snoop Dog]

This my opinion but it seems most think he's a flop so who knows. Imo, he's going to end up a big unit, when he gets near it he has clean hands in stoppages and generally keeps his head when he gets the ball. His problem right now is that he lacks strength and gets pushed out of the way too easily in stoppages and doesn't have the tank to find much ball on the outside. His pace is pretty good for someone his size.

You have to remember that he's still very young and has gone from playing in an ok schoolboy footy comp to playing against men in the country's second strongest competition. That's a huge step up and it's not a surprise that he's taking a while to adapt, especially considering he's had a few injury interruptions. Our expectations of him should be more in line with a ruck or key position player who require more time to develop. We've come to expect mids to make an impact relatively early but many of these guys are well developed and been involved in elite underage programs for a number of years. Even then many of them struggle to make an immediate impact (i.e. Aish). Sier has neither of these advantages but I'd rather take the punt on his potential than other midfielders who were drafted around his spot. For example, Rhys Mathieson was a midfielder we could of drafted and who was tipped to go around 30. He's made an immediate impact at Brisbane, is in their best 22 but is a very limited play with little scope for improvement. He's not someone who's will ever make a difference when it matters - he's a best 18-22 player at best. So are Phillips and Smith fwiw. They are all much much better than Sier atm but I'd take Sier in a heartbeat for what he could be.

Good post.

Not sure if you read what i wrote just above about him but I see the same things you do. He just needs to get fitter and its why I still am staggered that he didn't do any testing at combine or privately with collingwood pre the draft. No doubt plenty were into him but he could have done some testing surely. Maybe Pies didn't want to tip off other clubs but thats a massive amount of conviction in your first pick.

Agree re Mathieson and far be it from me to comment given the quality we pulled later in the draft but I really do still wonder if guys like Hibberd, Balic, Cole come back to haunt.

 

[Snoop Dog]

Agree that that back 6 looks good on paper, but Keeffe hasn't played for 2 years and Reid is fragile. Neither are young. I just think we desperately need to bring in at least one young kpd. Highest priority in my mind.

Vankri

to be fair i was 50:50 on Brown and if he went i'd be ok. Keefe footy at FB was pretty good and he was a terrific user of the footy. Great mobility but its a big ask to have him ready Rd 1. Will be interesting.

 

[Snoop Dog]

That's a pretty big l

thats a pretty big list of wins. Could have been disasterous if some of them had gone the other way.
Just hard for us posters to admit sometimes the footy club knows more than we do!

Yeah thats I wanted to post it. Dekka has been terrific.

Sure maybe we could have taken Wright and not De Goey but it wasnt a big bust and I haven't yet seen a trade thats been horrendous for us. The ones that were forced on us could have turned sour but they didn't and thats been a real credit to him

 

[TradeDraft]

Yeah thats I wanted to post it. Dekka has been terrific.

Sure maybe we could have taken Wright and not De Goey but it wasnt a big bust and I haven't yet seen a trade thats been horrendous for us. The ones that were forced on us could have turned sour but they didn't and thats been a real credit to him

Agree. Wright been the Better Fit but De Goey looks like he can come a Very Good Midfielder for us

 

[Pacman Carney]

N

So Cloke value is not very high?

Not high at all. I believe the club is happy to rid themselves of his salary and would do so for very little in return.

 

[soreplums]

Terrific post and see it pretty much the same way.

Stewart and Marchbank would be a win wouldnt it. I was musing today if you really wanted to spin the 'wheel' and given Gubby is now in the seat he may do it you could do;

Witts for Marchbank (will need a top up / maybe a pick for Broomhead as a top up). Witts will be worth a pick 15-20 and so with a Broomhead pick of say 30 added you might be in an effective range of about 10-12 so its just in the realms)
# 25 for WHE
Williams for Walters (dont think likely though)
Cloke for Jong
Pick receive from North for Brown ontraded for Stewart.

If you couldnt / didnt want to get JOM you could achieve that possibly.

Marley and a second rounder could get Walters. An early second rounder will need to be used by Freo to get Mcarthy/ or Hill. Freo may even look to swap their pick 3 for two later first rounders

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Agree. Wright been the Better Fit but De Goey looks like he can come a Very Good Midfielder for us

Dave in time, De Goey might become elite level mid. He's just so tough.
I think he's part of the future that will turn out very special. Well that's my plan

 

[Schraderbrau]

Walters is a complete gun and exactly the sought of player that would improve us a lot. If he were available then I'd be prepared to offer overs. He's from WA though so I doubt he's leaving.

 

[Frank Gallagher]

Very enjoyable read, just on your 2017 best 22 who gets the chop out ruck role? I'd prefer it wasn't Moore, IMO White has to come into that side.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Thanks for the read Snoop.

I know it was a long time ago, but could the Cameron Wood trade (pick 14 to Brisbane) be a fair proxy for what we might get for Witts?

 

[TradeDraft]

Thanks for the read Snoop.

I know it was a long time ago, but could the Cameron Wood trade (pick 14 to Brisbane) be a fair proxy for what we might get for Witts?

Love to get a Top 20 Pick for Witts but I think Pick 20 be about the Highest we would get

 

[Quicky]

Marley and a second rounder could get Walters. An early second rounder will need to be used by Freo to get Mcarthy/ or Hill. Freo may even look to swap their pick 3 for two later first rounders

That sounds an awful lot like the second round we might be able to get from Brisbane for Witts. I would happily lose Witts and Williams for Walters. We desperately need more goal kicking options.

 

[Quicky]

You've lost the plot if you want James Stewart.

Do you always need to be so rude?

 

[RupetFan]

Do you always need to be so rude?

It's being rude it's better then being delusional in thinking a spud is an answer for us.

 

[Quicky]

On Cloke I think we are about to make a big mistake trading him out. We would be better off retaining him. I have to assume we are making a big play at a free agent in 2017, or else it just doesn't make sense.

How we replace him is really tricky. The Petries and Schulz of this comp could be good stop gaps, but why wouldn't we just keep Cloke unstead? He's better. The Stewarts and Tomlinsons don't particularly excite me as anything special, but maybe I'm missing something? I'm leaning toward a cheap mature age stop gap, and a play at a big fish in 2017.

What I do know is if the return for Cloke is Jong we have dudded ourselves. He barely gets 20 touches a game in midfield and uses the ball poorly. If it were a straight swap scenario, I reckon Webb is the guy. Williams will be out, we need good footskills. We'd be buying low with Webb, but getting a good player. But my suspicion is it will get a whole lot more complicated than that. I can see it being multiple clubs and multiple pick exchanges to get us into a position that really favours us. Hine has been a master of this recently.

 

[Quicky]

It's being rude it's better then being delusional in thinking a spud is an answer for us.

That's a matter of opinion. The OP and broader discussion deserves a greater level of respect. You can express your opinion without being rude about it. You can also take another step and be constructive. For example you could have said something like "I disagree about Stewart because of xyz". Instead of getting all personal and telling people they've lost the plot and are delusional over a difference of opinion.

 

[CFC2010]

It's being rude it's better then being delusional in thinking a spud is an answer for us.

RupetFan one thing Snoop is not is delusional............Quicky is right tone it down a little mate.

You don't agree.......then you don't agree.......no need to hammer the point home.

 

[Moist Biscuit]

Marley and a second rounder could get Walters. An early second rounder will need to be used by Freo to get Mcarthy/ or Hill. Freo may even look to swap their pick 3 for two later first rounders

Let me stop you guys here. We aren't trading Walters and if we did, Fringe players aren't going to cut it. Some of the suggestions are ridiculous, a pies supporter actually came to our board and suggested Witts plus your second for Walters plus our 4th

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Let me stop you guys here. We aren't trading Walters and if we did, Fringe players aren't going to cut it. Some of the suggestions are ridiculous, a pies supporter actually came to our board and suggested Witts plus your second for Walters plus our 4th

Not sure about your point, not fussed who draws who, but you do have a fascinating avatar name?
What is the origin of your name?
Dunking biscuits into tea perhaps?

 

[Bay Pie]

On Cloke I think we are about to make a big mistake trading him out. We would be better off retaining him. I have to assume we are making a big play at a free agent in 2017, or else it just doesn't make sense.

He wants out though Quicky. I'd like to keep him too, but he has asked for a trade. I'm in the camp that we don't trade him unless we get something decent in return. I can't see us trading him solely for Lin Jong.

Dogs will offer up more, IMO. Boyd, Morris and Murphy likely last year next year. Redpath is gone for just about the whole year. If he gets back, he'll be massively underdone. They won't win the comp next year without someone else with Tom Boyd and that's if they get some improvement from Boyd. I'm not even sure they can, even if they get Cloke but he'll improve them.

I've said it before but pick 30ish, being Dogs 2nd rounder is fair. They should get a decent 3 years out of him. They paid pick 34ish for Barry Hall coming off a huge suspension, while being a few years older. They only got 2 years out of Hall, albeit pretty decent years.