Autopsy Sydney Legacy in Grand Finals continues 10 goal loss to the Lions

[The King!]

He's now going through who is a blood or not

Not many imo if we say Bloods are hard relentless warrior body on the line, contest by contest types- saturday they were all missing but generally i'd say of the 23 from saturday.

Heeney , Rowbottom, Fox and maybe Melican and maybe Roberts are "bloods"

Cunningham ,Mccartin, Rampe, Mclean, Jordon, Parker are maybe there but not consistent warrior types.

People who to me don't fit the the old bloods culture and again I am not saying don't fit as an insult are

Warner, Florent,Lloyd; Amartey, Grundy, Gulden, Mcdonald , Campbell, Papley, Hayward, Blakey, Jmac

Again just an opinion and not saying it's a bad thing, this just isn't a balls to the wall , warrior team .

 

[The King!]

Didn't realise he was Christian Fagan, thought it was Christopher.

Not a wasted trip to the grand final after all

 

[Bloods86]

Didn't realise he was Christian Fagan, thought it was Christopher.

Not a wasted trip to the grand final after all

Look forward to Samwise Mitchell flogging us next year

 

[Bloods86]

Maybe this group needs to forget bloods culture and whatever that is and forge its own way and commit fully.

To me the bloods will always be that Roosy group. Winning clubs all have strong cultures.

Seltzer86 doesn't have the same ring to it

 

[KingV23]

Seltzer86 doesn't have the same ring to it

"It's that culture the Seltzer, that's what it's all about"

 

[Bloods86]

"It's that culture the Seltzer, that's what it's all about"

Seltzer Culture: Bring the Chunder

 

[zyzzbruh]

Not many imo if we say Bloods are hard relentless warrior body on the line, contest by contest types- saturday they were all missing but generally i'd say of the 23 from saturday.

Heeney , Rowbottom, Fox and maybe Melican and maybe Roberts are "bloods"

Cunningham ,Mccartin, Rampe, Mclean, Jordon, Parker are maybe there but not consistent warrior types.

People who to me don't fit the the old bloods culture and again I am not saying don't fit as an insult are

Warner, Florent,Lloyd; Amartey, Grundy, Gulden, Mcdonald , Campbell, Papley, Hayward, Blakey, Jmac

Again just an opinion and not saying it's a bad thing, this just isn't a balls to the wall , warrior team .

Of that lot I think Hayward does have it, and Gulden, Campbell and Jmac have the potential.

I think Roberts needs to go straight into the guts next year. If he lines up at half back round 1 I will be pretty pissed off.

 

[Bloods86]

Of that lot I think Hayward does have it, and Gulden, Campbell and Jmac have the potential.

I think Roberts needs to go straight into the guts next year. If he lines up at half back round 1 I will be pretty pissed off.

If we put Mills down back, where Roberts has done well, then yeah Roberts back to his old role in midfield might be an option.

But he's pretty decent there for a young guy and if Mills can get back to his 2022 midfield form, then that'd be a win win.

 

[Jeffers]

I dunno. Is Roberts hard enough? Unproven as an extractor but I like his smarts at HBF.

I still think give Sheldrick and Cleary the keys first.

 

[The King!]

Of that lot I think Hayward does have it, and Gulden, Campbell and Jmac have the potential.

I think Roberts needs to go straight into the guts next year. If he lines up at half back round 1 I will be pretty pissed off.

Anyone who plays AFL is tough , but just don't see that strong steel in any of Hayward Gulden and Jmac. Campbell looks as intimidating as fairy floss- doesn't mean he isn't tough and not saying they are scared or anything like that.

Roberts in the guts , I don't know maybe.

 

[Bloods86]

I dunno. Is Roberts hard enough? Unproven as an extractor but I like his smarts at HBF.

I still think give Sheldrick and Cleary the keys first.

He was drafted as a mid/half forward iirc.

He played 2 VFL games this year but I think partly down back in his new role.

In his last month at VFL level last year, he was a mid, and averaged 30 disp, 5.5 tackles, 6.25 clearances.

I think he could be a decent inside mid, but doing a fairly good job down back.

 

[GotTheGoodes]

I haven't seen that "bloods culture" for a while now... I think it left when Kizza & JPK hung up the boots.

We can't look back. We need to look forward. Like Roos did before establishing our most recent "brand" (the "bloods culture"), we need to really dig deep down and commit to who we want to be. We need to establish what that is. Make it clear. Draft accordingly. Train accordingly. Play accordingly.

Are we still basing our culture on "the bloods"? If so, we've gone so far off track there has obviously been a huge error in direction & management... I think we'd committed to changing our culture after 2013-2015. We moved to flashier players. Faster ball movement. We no longer played to "our culture" & that internal culture changed... And that's ok. But right now I think the club is confused. Are we "the bloods" or are we "Proudly Sydney"? Unfortunately, we can't be both & be successful. It's asking too much of the club to cover everything. We can't choose to be hard nosed, ruthless, tough & also flashy, fast & expansive... It's physically, psychologically & practically impossible IMO.

Find our culture. Who are we? Build it. Plan for it. Play to it. Don't deviate. Commit in full to it.

We need to be honest with ourselves. We haven't looked like "the bloods" for a while now - let's not try to pretend that is our core dna when it clearly isn't anymore. IF we want it to be then we need to build our club around it & play to it... Which we haven't the past decade.

 

[zyzzbruh]

I dunno. Is Roberts hard enough? Unproven as an extractor but I like his smarts at HBF.

I still think give Sheldrick and Cleary the keys first.

Roberts has proven he can accumilate. The numbers he was getting in stages as a HB was pretty impressive that's not easy to do. I rekn he can do it as a mid.

 

[The King!]

I haven't seen that "bloods culture" for a while now... I think it left when Kizza & JPK hung up the boots.

We can't look back. We need to look forward. Like Roos did before establishing our most recent "brand" (the "bloods culture"), we need to really dig deep down and commit to who we want to be. We need to establish what that is. Make it clear. Draft accordingly. Train accordingly. Play accordingly.

Are we still basing our culture on "the bloods"? If so, we've gone so far off track there has obviously been a huge error in direction & management... I think we'd committed to changing our culture after 2013-2015. We moved to flashier players. Faster ball movement. We no longer played to "our culture" & that internal culture changed... And that's ok. But right now I think the club is confused. Are we "the bloods" or are we "Proudly Sydney"? Unfortunately, we can't be both & be successful. It's asking too much of the club to cover everything. We can't choose to be hard nosed, ruthless, tough & also flashy, fast & expansive... It's physically, psychologically & practically impossible IMO.

Find our culture. Who are we? Build it. Plan for it. Play to it. Don't deviate. Commit in full to it.

We need to be honest with ourselves. We haven't looked like "the bloods" for a while now - let's not try to pretend that is our core dna when it clearly isn't anymore. IF we want it to be then we need to build our club around it & play to it... Which we haven't the past decade.

Yep well said, this whole Bloods culture thing is just a name of what a particular group tried to do and has almost become this faint annoying legacy that hangs around and they half commit too.

When is this group good? they are probably good when Papley in the face and they have a strut and go quick and take risks. they had none of that saturday, looked scared as shit.

If you want to be pricks all year then be pricks all year and come out and dominate and have a presence .

Anyway this piddling pants over what's bloods culture and what isn't is a pile of old rubbish. I know people will hate it, but the club just should just stfu up about it , up there with shinboner spirit.

Bloods culture is what 5 premierships in 127 years ? The Hawks don't bang on about Hawk culture they just go out and are ruthless and win every decade

 

[Nuggetz]

We've lost 2014, 2016, 2022, 2024, while having players that embody the 'bloods culture'. Clearly something is wrong with the game style on the MCG/GF, imo it's our inability to stop the heavy marking strategy opposition teams undertake to beat us. Fix that & we'll go a long way to having better GF results.

 

[Nuggetz]

I don't buy into the losing 'bloods culture' or not having it. No one talked about it during the season & finals when we won games. If we don't have that 'bloods culture', we don't have a comeback win v pies or gws. I think it's just an excuse as a reason for our GF loss.

Imo tactics & team selection have had a much bigger bearing on our GF losses. Our kryptonite is teams who can employ an effective marking/uncontested possession strategy against us.

 

[zyzzbruh]

Anyone who plays AFL is tough , but just don't see that strong steel in any of Hayward Gulden and Jmac. Campbell looks as intimidating as fairy floss- doesn't mean he isn't tough and not saying they are scared or anything like that.

Roberts in the guts , I don't know maybe.

I think Hayward does more than enough of it for his role. Jmac is hard as nails for his stature, i think he has the ability to play in a similar way Ah Chee does for the lions. We just need to adjust a few roles. Get Jmac into the thick of it and play more of a central forward half position where he would be able to cause more damage. Make HIM our midfield scoring option rather than relying on the pure mids - because part of our issue is we're easy to transition against because our mids are relied on to push forward and score whilst most mids including brisbane couldn't give a toss about it, they're just pure mids who are always accountable when defending the middle of the ground.

We also need to push blakey up to be that pressure defensive winger to essentially replace Jmac, whilst also being a marking option. Obviously that relies on bringing in another defender.

The only other issue that brings in is making our forwards more accountable. We definitely need another 1 or 2 zippy forwards in there.

We're still a few players away from being a complete team.

 

[DavyRed]

24 possies , should've been moved forward

I don’t want to suggest that Gulden was the only player who had the problem but 16 of those possessions were in the second half, 9 were in the last quarter when the game was long dead and Brisbane were going through the motions. They were pure stats padding.

Importantly, when the game was on the line in the second quarter he had only 3 possessions (only 2 effective). Like many of his teammates, he went missing when he was needed most. 24 possessions in total means nothing in the context of the game.

 

[melbournehammer]

I don’t want to suggest that Gulden was the only player who had the problem but 16 of those possessions were in the second half, 9 were in the last quarter when the game was long dead and Brisbane were going through the motions. They were pure stats padding.

Importantly, when the game was on the line in the second quarter he had only 3 possessions (only 2 effective). Like many of his teammates, he went missing when he was needed most. 24 possessions in total means nothing in the context of the game.

this.

and this is the case for all of the midfield.

the last quarter was played like a practice match. 2022 continued at a higher tempo than this game and geelong kept trying to drive the nail in. brisbane couldnt give a damn if parker had a shot or three.

and to be honest neither could i. it wasnt waving the flag. it was in every conceivable way worse than 2022 but it was entirely predictable and was a fair reflection of our form from july onwards.

 

[Bloods86]

Yep well said, this whole Bloods culture thing is just a name of what a particular group tried to do and has almost become this faint annoying legacy that hangs around and they half commit too.

My bad.

 

[Dubai Quacker]

Rory Sloane great reputation , we need someone young like him , not 50yo's

Rory Sloane is untried - but gee I rated him as a leader & seemingly a genuinely decent individual.

I don’t think (?) he had anything to do with Collective Minds.

I just can’t see the Swans going with anyone without at least a stack of assistant coaching experience.

And at the moment, I don’t even know if the call for 2025 to be Horse’s last will be made. Surely it has to.

 

[ashep]

96% of VFL/AFL flags in history have been won by sides without "Bloods culture".

I couldn't give a toss about it. Every generation, player and side is different.

It's great to have an identity for the club and supporters to hang their hat on, but we didn't lose on Saturday because of our lack of one specific culture in the playing group. We lost because our opponent played out of their skin, our tactics were wrong, too many players played below their best, and some gaps in our list.

It tempting to look back at what Roos did with that particular group to break our drought, and elements of it can certainly be instructive, but I don't necessarily know that it's a blueprint which needs to be followed.

Also to be clear I don't want to dismiss the importance of it to the club and its history, but it doesn't have to be the measuring stick against which all teams need to be measured.

 

[GreyGooseGuy88]

We've lost 2014, 2016, 2022, 2024, while having players that embody the 'bloods culture'. Clearly something is wrong with the game style on the MCG/GF, imo it's our inability to stop the heavy marking strategy opposition teams undertake to beat us. Fix that & we'll go a long way to having better GF results.

Ouch when you see it like that.

WE LOST;
2014
2016
2022
2024

Let that sink in for a while.....

 

[The King!]

I think Hayward does more than enough of it for his role. Jmac is hard as nails for his stature, i think he has the ability to play in a similar way Ah Chee does for the lions. We just need to adjust a few roles. Get Jmac into the thick of it and play more of a central forward half position where he would be able to cause more damage. Make HIM our midfield scoring option rather than relying on the pure mids - because part of our issue is we're easy to transition against because our mids are relied on to push forward and score whilst most mids including brisbane couldn't give a toss about it, they're just pure mids who are always accountable when defending the middle of the ground.

We also need to push blakey up to be that pressure defensive winger to essentially replace Jmac, whilst also being a marking option. Obviously that relies on bringing in another defender.

The only other issue that brings in is making our forwards more accountable. We definitely need another 1 or 2 zippy forwards in there.

We're still a few players away from being a complete team.

Maybe , some of it's subjective, Hayward lays some good tackles and again not saying people are soft just guess i am picturing Kirk, Bolton, Buchanan, Jpk and don't see Hayward and Jmac that way personally

 

[The King!]

I don’t want to suggest that Gulden was the only player who had the problem but 16 of those possessions were in the second half, 9 were in the last quarter when the game was long dead and Brisbane were going through the motions. They were pure stats padding.

Importantly, when the game was on the line in the second quarter he had only 3 possessions (only 2 effective). Like many of his teammates, he went missing when he was needed most. 24 possessions in total means nothing in the context of the game.

Gulden had a shocking September let's be honest . He will always find it 20 odd times. But he had 0 impact