Autopsy Sydney Legacy in Grand Finals continues 10 goal loss to the Lions

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Spec_K said:
Try being a Bills, Arsenal and Swans fan..
Click to expand...
you follow all 3? interesting.

Buffalo bills lost 4 Superbowls in a row from 1990 to 1993.

Arsenal FC Have won a fiar bit of prizes since I was Born in 1987. Arsenal Won 2 1st divison titles in 1989 and 1991 so thats Pre EPL titles. Won a league cup and FA cup in 1993. They have won 3 EPL titles in 1998, 2002 and 2004. Won FA Cubs in 1998 and 2002 and 2005. After the 2005 FA cup win, Arsenal didnt win a cup until winning another FA cup in 2013.


As for the Swans... At least the swans Won the 2005 and 2012 flags.

I remember rocking up here and offering condolences a few hours after the 2022 grand final. wrong time to do it.

Its been a good 2 weeks since the 2024 grand final result.

But looking at the grand finals after 2012.

2014 vs Hawks: Both sides were top 2. Hawks just had a good day. Swans had a shocker.

2016 v the dogs. Close game for 3 and a half quarters. Injuries to key players didnt help. Some umpiring decisons didnt help the swans either. For the record, I wanted the swans to win this one.

2022 vs the cats. Same like 2014, the game was done at half time

2024 vs Brisbane. I personally didnt care who won. I am happy either way with the cup leaving Victorian soil. I Actually thought this one was gonna be a swans flag considering Swans had an easy prelim final win vs the Port Adelaide side and Brisbane finished 5th and had to come back from the dead vs GWS in the semi and Cats in the prelim. It was a tight 1st quarter in the grand final then Brisbane pulled away.




This is a weird problem because go look at the prelim finals the swans won. 2022 was the only close one as they beat the magpies by a point. the 2014, 2016 and 2024 prelim finals they won easily.
 
Freomaniac said:
you follow all 3? interesting.

Buffalo bills lost 4 Superbowls in a row from 1990 to 1993.

Arsenal FC Have won a fiar bit of prizes since I was Born in 1987. Arsenal Won 2 1st divison titles in 1989 and 1991 so thats Pre EPL titles. Won a league cup and FA cup in 1993. They have won 3 EPL titles in 1998, 2002 and 2004. Won FA Cubs in 1998 and 2002 and 2005. After the 2005 FA cup win, Arsenal didnt win a cup until winning another FA cup in 2013.


As for the Swans... At least the swans Won the 2005 and 2012 flags.

I remember rocking up here and offering condolences a few hours after the 2022 grand final. wrong time to do it.

Its been a good 2 weeks since the 2024 grand final result.

But looking at the grand finals after 2012.

2014 vs Hawks: Both sides were top 2. Hawks just had a good day. Swans had a shocker.

2016 v the dogs. Close game for 3 and a half quarters. Injuries to key players didnt help. Some umpiring decisons didnt help the swans either. For the record, I wanted the swans to win this one.

2022 vs the cats. Same like 2014, the game was done at half time

2024 vs Brisbane. I personally didnt care who won. I am happy either way with the cup leaving Victorian soil. I Actually thought this one was gonna be a swans flag considering Swans had an easy prelim final win vs the Port Adelaide side and Brisbane finished 5th and had to come back from the dead vs GWS in the semi and Cats in the prelim. It was a tight 1st quarter in the grand final then Brisbane pulled away.




This is a weird problem because go look at the prelim finals the swans won. 2022 was the only close one as they beat the magpies by a point. the 2014, 2016 and 2024 prelim finals they won easily.
Click to expand...


as an aside we should have won in 2022 by 6-8 goals as well. Got panicky after sam reid got injured. bit like in 2015 when a sam reid injury might also have cost us another away qualifying final win.
 

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DavyRed said:
Great idea 😀. I threw well over $1,000 against the wall to watch that crap. Mind you, a friend of mine was lamenting the fact that he’s been to all of the last four of the Swans’ Grand Finals, so goodness knows what he’s owed by now!
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I've been to everyone one of them since '96. Lot's of looses there.
 
I am not totally dismissive of peoples criticism of Longmire but I think it is important to acknowledge something that I don’t think gets mentioned enough. He started as an assistant coach in 2002 and was heavily involved in our successful period in 2005-2006. Although he was officially our senior coach in 2011 he started taking the reigns in 2010 as the succession plan was played out from Roos to Longmire. I don’t think it’s fair to say that 2012 was entirely a Roos created team.

I am comfortable for Longmire to at least see out the end of his contract and decide on his own terms if he wishes to extend or not. Again I don’t disagree with all the criticism but I think some people have short memories.
 
Rhysswans13 said:
I am not totally dismissive of peoples criticism of Longmire but I think it is important to acknowledge something that I don’t think gets mentioned enough. He started as an assistant coach in 2002 and was heavily involved in our successful period in 2005-2006. Although he was officially our senior coach in 2011 he started taking the reigns in 2010 as the succession plan was played out from Roos to Longmire. I don’t think it’s fair to say that 2012 was entirely a Roos created team.

I am comfortable for Longmire to at least see out the end of his contract and decide on his own terms if he wishes to extend or not. Again I don’t disagree with all the criticism but I think some people have short memories.
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I could not agree more. I like the long man. If it was my decision I would leave it up to him. Love the Horse.
 
Thinking about the McDonald injury. Horse & co made the hard call on Callum Mills, a much better player than McDonald, days earlier. They actually teased us with the prospect that they'd learned their lessons and would not take such a clearly-unfit player into a grand final. And then they went and did exactly that. That is the most egregious thing.

I get that sometimes it's avoidable. Like Heeney with the ankle injury. There was just no way we were not going to name our number one player in a grand final, even if not at 100%, and I expect literally every coach in the competition would do the same. Chris Fagan just did it with Lachie Neale. So I'm OK with that.

McDonald is not Isaac Heeney or Lachie Neale.

I've seen the argument that Mills plays a more heavily-involved role than McDonald, so he can't afford to not be at 100% whereas maybe McDonald could be. But that doesn't make sense to me. If McDonald is not that involved, to me that just means he can be replaced more easily, and doing so would impact the chemistry of the team less. Horse had a perfectly fit Cleary that was supposedly banging the door down during grand final week. We could've just gone smaller, opted for more pressure, changed it up. Surely this team Horse rates so much, that dominated All Australian, Brownlow proceedings etc is still capable of enacting our game plan after one structural change?

Ohhhh but wait, Horse would not ****ing budge from his structures all season long. So much so that he played three ****ing ruckmen against Port Adelaide earlier in the season just so he could still have three talls.

Actually I lie. He did decide to change the structures when he finally got rid of any sort of pressure player from the forward line and one of our only hard, contested mids... just in time for finals, when those things are most important.

If true that Tom Harley is conducting a review then Horse should be ripped a new one. He did a lot right this season as coach but he also got plenty wrong, and the things he got wrong were absolute doozies.
 
caesar88 said:
Thinking about the McDonald injury. Horse & co made the hard call on Callum Mills, a much better player than McDonald, days earlier. They actually teased us with the prospect that they'd learned their lessons and would not take such a clearly-unfit player into a grand final. And then they went and did exactly that. That is the most egregious thing.

I get that sometimes it's avoidable. Like Heeney with the ankle injury. There was just no way we were not going to name our number one player in a grand final, even if not at 100%, and I expect literally every coach in the competition would do the same. Chris Fagan just did it with Lachie Neale. So I'm OK with that.

McDonald is not Isaac Heeney or Lachie Neale.

I've seen the argument that Mills plays a more heavily-involved role than McDonald, so he can't afford to not be at 100% whereas maybe McDonald could be. But that doesn't make sense to me. If McDonald is not that involved, to me that just means he can be replaced more easily, and doing so would impact the chemistry of the team less. Horse had a perfectly fit Cleary that was supposedly banging the door down during grand final week. We could've just gone smaller, opted for more pressure, changed it up. Surely this team Horse rates so much, that dominated All Australian, Brownlow proceedings etc is still capable of enacting our game plan after one structural change?

Ohhhh but wait, Horse would not ****ing budge from his structures all season long. So much so that he played three ****ing ruckmen against Port Adelaide earlier in the season just so he could still have three talls.

Actually I lie. He did decide to change the structures when he finally got rid of any sort of pressure player from the forward line and one of our only hard, contested mids... just in time for finals, when those things are most important.

If true that Tom Harley is conducting a review then Horse should be ripped a new one. He did a lot right this season as coach but he also got plenty wrong, and the things he got wrong were absolute doozies.
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Given that we're supposed to have a selection committee I would have liked to be a fly on the wall. Were there any dissenting voices? Line coach? Medical? I wouldn't have picked Horse as a dictator but now I'm wondering a bit, at least about who has a spine and who doesn't.
 

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Heeney2Franklin said:
Logan injury looked terrible the way his ankle just collapsed, i was genuinely shocked to hear he was named.

Again how on earth did he pass a fitness test when it was obvious in the first few mins he wasnt right??
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I said straight after game looked shocking

Complete idiots playing him
 
caesar88 said:
Thinking about the McDonald injury. Horse & co made the hard call on Callum Mills, a much better player than McDonald, days earlier. They actually teased us with the prospect that they'd learned their lessons and would not take such a clearly-unfit player into a grand final. And then they went and did exactly that. That is the most egregious thing.

I get that sometimes it's avoidable. Like Heeney with the ankle injury. There was just no way we were not going to name our number one player in a grand final, even if not at 100%, and I expect literally every coach in the competition would do the same. Chris Fagan just did it with Lachie Neale. So I'm OK with that.

McDonald is not Isaac Heeney or Lachie Neale.

I've seen the argument that Mills plays a more heavily-involved role than McDonald, so he can't afford to not be at 100% whereas maybe McDonald could be. But that doesn't make sense to me. If McDonald is not that involved, to me that just means he can be replaced more easily, and doing so would impact the chemistry of the team less. Horse had a perfectly fit Cleary that was supposedly banging the door down during grand final week. We could've just gone smaller, opted for more pressure, changed it up. Surely this team Horse rates so much, that dominated All Australian, Brownlow proceedings etc is still capable of enacting our game plan after one structural change?

Ohhhh but wait, Horse would not ****ing budge from his structures all season long. So much so that he played three ****ing ruckmen against Port Adelaide earlier in the season just so he could still have three talls.

Actually I lie. He did decide to change the structures when he finally got rid of any sort of pressure player from the forward line and one of our only hard, contested mids... just in time for finals, when those things are most important.

If true that Tom Harley is conducting a review then Horse should be ripped a new one. He did a lot right this season as coach but he also got plenty wrong, and the things he got wrong were absolute doozies.
Click to expand...

Mills definitely wouldn’t have helped. He looked well short of a gallop pretty much every time he played last season. Coming back from another injury straight into the GF probably wouldn’t have worked out. I don’t think Cleary would have helped either. He’s a promising player, but I question whether he’d be ready for such a key role in a grand final.

I am surprised McDonald played though. He didn’t look right from the first bounce (and neither did McInerney tbh). For a team that had such a good injury run throughout the season, we went into the GF kinda banged up.
 
After two weeks, I'm starting to let go of the huge disappointment that I'm sure all of our fans have been feeling.

One theory I have that could have been a big factor was the club's reaction to the great win against Port Adelaide in the Preliminary final at the SCG. When Channel 7 went into the rooms with BT, the scenes and the number of people in the rooms were reminiscent of a club winning the flag. The place was chockers with sponsors, families and past players. I remember Taylor himself(and I know he can be a goose) asking out loud about how we could come back down to earth.

To contrast, I remember Roos after the 2005 Prelim final over the Saints, keeping people out of the rooms at the MCG specifically so the club wouldn't get carried away and the players distracted. i don't know what the approach was after we beat Collingwood in the Prelim and that game was at ANZ stadium.

Has anyone else had similar thoughts?
 
McGowan3 said:
After two weeks, I'm starting to let go of the huge disappointment that I'm sure all of our fans have been feeling.

One theory I have that could have been a big factor was the club's reaction to the great win against Port Adelaide in the Preliminary final at the SCG. When Channel 7 went into the rooms with BT, the scenes and the number of people in the rooms were reminiscent of a club winning the flag. The place was chockers with sponsors, families and past players. I remember Taylor himself(and I know he can be a goose) asking out loud about how we could come back down to earth.

To contrast, I remember Roos after the 2005 Prelim final over the Saints, keeping people out of the rooms at the MCG specifically so the club wouldn't get carried away and the players distracted. i don't know what the approach was after we beat Collingwood in the Prelim and that game was at ANZ stadium.

Has anyone else had similar thoughts?
Click to expand...

I did think they were oddly happy after the Port game. I sensed great elation and even relief. I remember Hayward shrieking with delight as they went off the ground. Of course you expect them to be happy after a prelim win, but I didn’t see any “steely resolve” or even a thought that there was another game next week. I remember noticing this but thinking I was probably reading too much into normal post win celebrations.
 
Paps talking about the GF on his podcast, starting at 2:35. Nothing too different from what we've heard so far - "won't define us", "we'll get back on the horse and try again", "trained well leading up to it"

 
McGowan3 said:
After two weeks, I'm starting to let go of the huge disappointment that I'm sure all of our fans have been feeling.

One theory I have that could have been a big factor was the club's reaction to the great win against Port Adelaide in the Preliminary final at the SCG. When Channel 7 went into the rooms with BT, the scenes and the number of people in the rooms were reminiscent of a club winning the flag. The place was chockers with sponsors, families and past players. I remember Taylor himself(and I know he can be a goose) asking out loud about how we could come back down to earth.

To contrast, I remember Roos after the 2005 Prelim final over the Saints, keeping people out of the rooms at the MCG specifically so the club wouldn't get carried away and the players distracted. i don't know what the approach was after we beat Collingwood in the Prelim and that game was at ANZ stadium.

Has anyone else had similar thoughts?
Click to expand...

I have a few books from the 05 era which state past players and families were in the rooms after the Prelim win after the Saints.

I don’t think we have changed our methods after the preliminary final wins all that much. It is a mentality issue between the different eras.
 

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Autopsy Sydney Legacy in Grand Finals continues 10 goal loss to the Lions

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