Analysis The Rebuilds of Geelong and Richmond and their Future Prospects

[Cleansweep17]

Exactly. All above is very true.

Dynasties are sustained success over a long period of time. Which we did

Success is winning flags. 4 in 16 isn’t that impressive.

 

[PhatBoy]

Um no man just look at the Dynasties and you can see the B2Bs !!!! It’s in the books

And?
Where’s your bigger trophy

 

[RUNVS]

I genuinely don't understand how some football experts think Geelong will be pushing for top 4 this year. It is one of the most baffling calls I have seen in a while. I don't even think Geelong fans think they will be in premiership contention this year.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

Funny that you don’t care about successive flags but you do with successive finals campaigns. Like what even? and you think it’s just a COINCIDENCE that you a Geelong supporters thinks that and the Cats didn’t achieve it. Wow shocker. This is copium on the highest level.

Facts are facts to be in the dynasty club you actually have to achieve the same things they did. Which was:

1. At least 3 flags

2. At least 1 b2b

You don’t meet the criteria. The End.

Definition of DYNASTY

a succession of rulers of the same line of descent; a powerful group or family that maintains its position for a considerable time… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

By definition, Harley/Ling/Selwood is a dynasty.

 

[Cleansweep17]

But your team was built on him I thought? He was the best defender of all time I heard.

Anyway, it’s great being s**t and getting picks hey braaaaaa!!!

Ooof I’ve melted ya brain

I thought it was obvious that a dynasty wouldn’t have been built around a guy who only played in 1 flag

 

[Cleansweep17]

And?
Where’s your bigger trophy

The bigger ones go in a “dynasty collection” cabinet. Cats can’t afford one yet unfortunately. You wouldn’t get it.

 

[Kobe Gryant]

I genuinely don't understand how some football experts think Geelong will be pushing for top 4 this year. It is one of the most baffling calls I have seen in a while. I don't even think Geelong fans think they will be in premiership contention this year.

Yeah, I haven't seen this much fear before entering a season since 2022.

 

[Cleansweep17]

I genuinely don't understand how some football experts think Geelong will be pushing for top 4 this year. It is one of the most baffling calls I have seen in a while. I don't even think Geelong fans think they will be in premiership contention this year.

They won’t make the 8

 

[Pure_Ownage]

I genuinely don't understand how some football experts think Geelong will be pushing for top 4 this year. It is one of the most baffling calls I have seen in a while. I don't even think Geelong fans think they will be in premiership contention this year.

We dont but frankly the standard of the comp is pretty weak this year so anything is possible. If say 6 to 10th is pretty realistic for us though.

 

[Cleansweep17]

Definition of DYNASTY

a succession of rulers of the same line of descent; a powerful group or family that maintains its position for a considerable time… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

By definition, Harley/Ling/Selwood is a dynasty.

You do realise you don’t even fit the description you gave right

You didn’t have any “SUCCESSION” i.e b2bs you kept getting dethroned. That’s not what a dynasty does, in anything.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

I actually thought Balta did his best work up the ground, helping in ruck and around the scrimmages. That and CHB I'd see as his best roles (Mooney had a phase doing pretty well in these roles), but there's no getting around the fact Richmond needs forwards.

Kozzy is not the answer.

Gibcus was a mixed bag for me. Had composure sometimes but not others. Strong sometimes but not others. He has time on his side but is a couple of years away at least from being a good KPD.

Young is a limited player.

Ross as a sub? Nope, he should be starting.

It was hard to tell Ryan was playing.

MRJ had his moments and Campbell was good.

Hopper ended up having a good game.

It's a list that looks in no man's land and that will need to be addressed by future drafts.

We had some shocking performances today. Ryan, Dow, and Koschitzke playing fairly key roles just got smashed. Ross had a slightly limited pre-season after an op so the club maybe just managing him at this stage.

Our midfield was destroyed really but some changes are coming there, and this Suns midfield could well be the best in the competition.

Early days, Steely green and Coulthard looked decent in the VFL practice match, Tom Brown is in the wings and Sonsie. Trezise looked good again today in the VFL team. And the new pick 40 odd McAuliffe is looking a bit of a prospect. We have enough depth with our youngsters, just lacking a top end mid and top end forward amongst them.

Gibcus I think will be fine but will have plenty of days like today this year, he will get outbodied at times, the club will just be telling him to not drop his head and keep doing what he does well. Plays like that need games and time to get to their potential level.

Young is a good player but you are not going to expect him to be able to carry a whole backline at this stage. I think key forwards might have some days out against us this year but the club will wear that knowing these guys will improve the more they play together.

 

[PhatBoy]

The bigger ones go in a “dynasty collection” cabinet. Cats can’t afford one yet unfortunately. You wouldn’t get it.

Well they don’t, but You know we have won back to back flags before right?

 

[Cleansweep17]

You know we have won back to back flags before right?

Yes I know but you do realise B2Bs alone aren’t a dynasty right?

It’s at least 3 flags INCLUDING a B2B. It’s what every other dynasty has done. They and we get the bigger cups, you don’t unfortunately. Maybe next time if they change the f/s rules again.

 

[PhatBoy]

I genuinely don't understand how some football experts think Geelong will be pushing for top 4 this year. It is one of the most baffling calls I have seen in a while. I don't even think Geelong fans think they will be in premiership contention this year.

Most football experts have been saying that we won’t be for a long long time and it’s worked out the opposite way most of the time so maybe they’ve finally gone the other way? Who knows. I don’t think many cats fans think we will be challenging for the flag.

 

[Kobe Gryant]

You do realise you don’t even fit the description you gave right

You didn’t have any “SUCCESSION” i.e b2bs you kept getting dethroned. That’s not what a dynasty does, in anything.

Not even taking the piss here, I'm genuinely curious...why does it bother you so much?

If you want to make it a competition, I've seen 4, you've seen 3, but who really gives a s**t?

Go outside brother, you're so worried about something that means NOTHING.

I get the old jibe here and there, but you and PB are on here all day every day arguing about the same shit all the time. It reflects on you two more than it does Geelong & Richmond.

 

[PhatBoy]

Yes I know but you do realise B2Bs alone aren’t a dynasty right?

It’s at least 3 flags INCLUDING a B2B. It’s what every other dynasty has done. They and we get the bigger cups, you don’t unfortunately. Maybe next time if they change the f/s rules again.

Oh right so in other words you’ve just made up your own definition on the spot because it happens to fit in exactly with what Richmond actually did.

#b#biggerCups

 

[Cleansweep17]

We had some shocking performances today. Ryan, Dow, and Koschitzke playing fairly key roles just got smashed. Ross had a slightly limited pre-season after an op so the club maybe just managing him at this stage.

Our midfield was destroyed really but some changes are coming there, and this Suns midfield could well be the best in the competition.

Early days, Steely green and Coulthard looked decent in the VFL practice match, Tom Brown is in the wings and Sonsie. Trezise looked good again today in the VFL team. And the new pick 40 odd McAuliffe is looking a bit of a prospect. We have enough depth with our youngsters, just lacking a top end mid and top end forward amongst them.

Gibcus I think will be fine but will have plenty of days like today this year, he will get outbodied at times, the club will just be telling him to not drop his head and keep doing what he does well. Plays like that need games and time to get to their potential level.

Young is a good player but you are not going to expect him to be able to carry a whole backline at this stage. I think key forwards might have some days out against us this year but the club will wear that knowing these guys will improve the more they play together.

I still don’t think the club knows what to do with Balta. I saw him everywhere trying to be Mr Fix it. Was good but detrimental for his development, thought it was a Dimma thing and Yze would settle him somewhere.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

I genuinely don't understand how some football experts think Geelong will be pushing for top 4 this year. It is one of the most baffling calls I have seen in a while. I don't even think Geelong fans think they will be in premiership contention this year.

Very tough for the Cats to genuinely contend with their current list profile. Similar to Richmond, they are basically compelled to play some players who are likely to be exposed.

 

[Mr Meow]

Campbell was on debut after an injury ruined first season and he is only just turned 19. Tough to know what he could do but you never know if a player like this can get to the level of say a Zorko. The club would be happy with his debut though not a dominant one, but that would be too much to expect.

Balta I think they will persevere forward regardless of match results or oppo keys kicking bags. He was lively today, though has a lot to learn, the club probably thinks what is to be lost playing him forward/ruck this season. I tend to agree with that. If it cost games Richmond gets better draft picks. If it wins games, happy days. Our key backs are definitely going to get exposed at times though, I agree with that. I guess that is part of building a team.

I just don't think the club was in any position to pass over Hopper and Taranto. Dow played inside mid today and got 6 touches. Prestia is past his very best. You can't go into AFL games with a totally uncompetitive inside midfield, your team loses all drive and structure, putting pressure on the development of the young players in other arts of the ground.

Let's see how the team looks with Lynch, Dusty, Nankervis and later Graham back and a more normal schedule from rd 3 onwards. We definitely need a gun inside mid and gun key forward of the future, 25yo or younger right now. Million a year type players. The money will be there to try to get them, it is just whether the right players are available and want to come, same as for plenty of other teams.

Prestia, Broad and Grimes look cooked. Surely there's a kid you can play instead of McIntosh? It's time to move past Pickett too.

The names you suggested being back will help, but 3 of them are near the end so it just highlights what the future is going to look like. There was little sympathy when Geelong were missing 6-8 players routinely last season (all age ranges).

Anyway, full strength I'd go:

FB: Young Gibcus Vlastuin
HB: Short Balta Rioli
C: Ross Taranto Banks
HF: Bolton Ryan Graham
FF: Campbell Lynch Baker
FOL: Nankervis Hopper Martin
IC: MRJ Trezise Kozzy Sonsie

Get a top 3 draft pick a couple of years in a row, make a smart FA acquisition or two and who knows.

 

[RUNVS]

Most football experts have been saying that we won’t be for a long long time and it’s worked out the opposite way most of the time so maybe they’ve finally gone the other way? Who knows. I don’t think many cats fans think we will be challenging for the flag.

Don't get me wrong, I respect Geelong as a side a lot but given your list profile I think the next few years for Geelong are going to be a transition period. You guys should not do a North Melbourne and cull your older players, but rather keep them for as long as possible and help protect the younger players, help them develop so they are ready to take over in a few years.

 

[Cleansweep17]

Oh right so in other words you’ve just made up your own definition on the spot because it happens to fit in exactly with what Richmond actually did.

#b#biggerCups

Richmond and the other like 8ish dynasties? Yeah I think it’s fair to say that It’s not the same as your embarrassing ugly duckling position. You could make a new “fake/almost dynasty” club once more 3 in 5 members turn up though. Good effort I guess

 

[PhatBoy]

Don't get me wrong, I respect Geelong as a side a lot but given your list profile I think the next few years for Geelong are going to be a transition period. You guys should not do a North Melbourne and cull your older players, but rather keep them for as long as possible and help protect the younger players, help them develop so they are ready to take over in a few years.

Tend to agree.

I don’t ever agree with just not trying to win unless you’re left with no other choice. It’s the league fan in me

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

You do realise you don’t even fit the description you gave right

You didn’t have any “SUCCESSION” i.e b2bs you kept getting dethroned. That’s not what a dynasty does, in anything.

Ling succeeded Harley. Selwood succeeded Ling. It's similar with Richmond's "succession of rulers": Cotchin following on from storied leaders such as Chris Newman and Kane Johnson, then passing the torch to Grimey and big Nank. Basically the same thing.

Not good enough for the Cleansweep dictionary definition, but oh well, can't have everything I suppose.

 

[PhatBoy]

Richmond and the other like 8ish dynasties? Yeah I think it’s fair to say that It’s not the same as your embarrassing ugly duckling position. You could make a new “fake/almost dynasty” club once more 3 in 5 members turn up though. Good effort I guess

Ugly duckling as in ‘most successful club of the century.’

Yeah it sucks.

 

[RUNVS]

Tend to agree.

I don’t ever agree with just not trying to win unless you’re left with no other choice. It’s the league fan in me

Also I think history has shown tanking does not work, not in the long run. Instilling a winning culture is so much more important than some slightly better draft picks.