Thoughts On The Port Game (post game)

[cmndstab]

Its one journalists view. It is not reflective of anything. Having Dangerfield has 4th best for you smacks of lazy journalism...or someone who saw the last quarter only. He barely went near it for the first three quarters.

Surprised to see Logan on that list too. I'm a big Logan fan but I wouldn't have put him in your best players, from watching the game, or on stats (which is where most of the bests seem to come from).

 

[Macca19]

I thought Logan made a lot of mistakes with the ball, and I rated him a 3 or so because of that, but he did completely shut Mcleod out of the game. Choco praised him for his role after the game and said he was in our top 2-3 players. I would have had Chaplin, Carlile and Thomas in the best for Port

 

[jenny61_99]

THompson has been one of our best players all year but don't take too much notice of Jenny's rambling on this issue. No matter what Thompson does will never be good enough for her.

Thompson is at the bottom of every pack and sets up most of our work from stoppages. He can't do it alone. Speaking to Viney at the season launch, he said he would love to have 2 or 3 players of Thompson's ilk because he is our best midfielder but never gets the credit for his bullocking work.

I guess he is not pretty enough as a player

Bit of an insult to suggest I base my likes/dislikes of a footballer purely on their "prettiness".

In his first season, I thought Thommo was lazy and sloppy. Then in his second he was outstanding. I was thoroughly impressed and shouted it from the rooftops. Since then he has had cameo moments I thought but has been singularly unspectacular on most occasions.

Yes I give you he gets the ball to clear it but to me the statistics don't tell the whole story. He gets the ball - sure - but it's what he does with it that concerns me. 9 times out of 10 he handpasses it within milliseconds of receiving it and very often to a player in a worse position than him. Or he bombs it forward (kick and hope) giving our forward structure no hope. He doesn't think, everything appears to be reactive. I think he has the potential to be the elite player everyone suggest he already is, but to me - he's not there yet.

 

[jenny61_99]

We have built a young team, they have a few players "better" than ours die to high draft picks, but no real youth structure.

We will see how good their youth is once Brogan/Lade/Tredders/Chad/P Burger retire in the next 2-3 years. We got a glimpse last year when they went missing at times. They beat us due to dominance in ruck and Chad being allowed to float around on his own.

I love our structure of players under 23 we have quality in most areas of the ground and with another 50 games this group will show something. Ottens and McKay already look like veterans with less than 30 games. On the plus 23 side we have Stiffy Porps and Vince gaining experience and taking ownership of the club. Goodwin is captain in name only now.

Keep the faith 2009 is not about making the 8, although we can still do it. But about getting quality game time into our kids.

Nicely said.

 

[noddy]

The tactics worked or we wanted Goodwin to play deep?! Craig said in his press conference after the game that we wanted Goodwin on Motlop and last time I checked, Motlop predominantly plays out of the square or very deep in the forward line. He does most of his work in the 50 meter arc.

Now, if you are putting Goodwin voluntarily on Motlop who you know will play 90% of TOG inside their forward 50 arc then I am not sure it was the Port tactics making us do it. We voluntarily went down that path.

Other than Edwards, I question the leadership and willingness to put the body on the line and lay a tackle of every single senior player. That display was soft as butter. They would have made Jericho proud.

Gotta agree with all of that Stiffy we got smashed all over the ground & that would have to be one of the softest displays ever put on by the AFC from the top all the way down to the bottom.

Can't blame the five kids too much but jeez as someone else said some where on here we play the game safe with most of our players taking the option of not trying to upset the apple cart.

Maybe our coaching staff could do with a weeks course with the SAS & have that famous saying "who dares wins" drummed into them.

 

[BWST]

Keep the faith 2009 is not about making the 8, although we can still do it. But about getting quality game time into our kids.

Thrown the towel in already Geoffa ?, bit like Choco this time last season.

 

[jenny61_99]

Thrown the towel in already Geoffa ?, bit like Choco this time last season.

Actually no - most of us have believed this is the reality for the AFC this year - we'll be competitive but probably won't make the finals or if we do, won't be any significant threat. We won't be tanking, however, unlike your Club.

 

[Jars458]

Shocking performance by us. Really poor, but we knew we owuld have these games.

Vince Bock and Otten were good, other than that I struggle to name any.

Edwards had a really poor game but he's allowed one at his age.

Porps had no influence even though he kicked three goals and IMO should be starting to show a bit more.

Well done to Port, their intensity was too much. Tredrea was back to his old self and Chad and Kane smashed us. Brogan far too good as well in the ruck, though he is the ugliest man in football.

Move on to next week. I think we need to play Maric and Griffin and Tippett up froward.

 

[Asgardian]

We won't be tanking, however, unlike your Club.

What would be the point?

After all, have a look at the Demons, Tigers, Roos, Eagles & Dockers. All of them are terrible, just terrible, and no amount of tanking from the Crows could make you any worse than those 5 clubs this year.

Its one journalists view. It is not reflective of anything. Having Dangerfield has 4th best for you smacks of lazy journalism...or someone who saw the last quarter only. He barely went near it for the first three quarters.

Spot on Craig, after reading the reports in the Sunday Mail I figured I had watched the wrong game. A generic reporting effort from a vanilla journo that probably only listened to the 5aa call, at least what he wrote read that way.

 

[adelaide_40]

Weak performance by us, I hope we bounce back next week.

Delivery into the foward line was an issue, it would just go straight to a port defender or a contest where port would run it out to easily.

Rucks were absolutely slaughtered, starting to become a concern. Anyone know how maric went?. I know he kicked 4 goals.

Sometimes I think we play on to quickly get pressured, handball to someone who is then put under pressure.

Vince is starring at the moment.

While petrenko was quiet early got himself back into the game, Love his tackling and hard ball gets. This is why he needs to stay in.

Otten is solid down back loving him at the moment.

Stevens didnt do a thing, macca and goodwin were quiet.

Edwards is having a great year.

 

[Jars458]

Thrown the towel in already Geoffa ?, bit like Choco this time last season.

Nothing like it in fact. We will still TRY to make the eight unlike your mob who only this year have decided to live the creed.

 

[Sekaj]

Nothing like it in fact. We will still TRY to make the eight unlike your mob who only this year have decided to live the creed.

I disagree. I thought they lived the creed beautifully in the 2007 Grand Final.

 

[feenix67]

Bit tired of readng "our game plan sucks". Dont forget that we have a couple of quality mid coaches atm, including last years "rolling zone mastermind". THe game plan is not the problem, its our execution of it.

We have young bodies who are easily knocked off the line, which is why we are getting hammered at stoppages. Our players lack confidence to carry the ball forward, which is why we tend to stagnate across half back. The only real disappointment for mine is the lack of ticker from some of our seniors.

We are a young developing team, blokes like Goody, Macca, Thomson and Reilly need to show some nuts and get in amongst it.

But please dont blame the gameplan.

 

[kaysee]

...
We will see how good their youth is once Brogan/Lade/Tredders/Chad/P Burger retire in the next 2-3 years. We got a glimpse last year when they went missing at times. They beat us due to dominance in ruck and Chad being allowed to float around on his own.

...

think you're right on the money with Brogan/Lade as we haven't recruited/develpoed well for these retirements. That said I think Lade will retire this year and Brogan (as a ruckman) will have about 2-3 years left in him after this one. Hopefully durring that 2-3 years we can find and develop Brogan's replacement.

Tredrea is irreplaceable. Port though have the ability to be successful with a small forward setup though (made the 2007 GF with little impact from Tredrea). Westhoff is his obvious replacement and whilst not the 'monolith' that Tredrea his Westie is competitive and very creative... he reminds me of John Klug. Port also havea couple other young key forwards developing in the wings in Westhoof v2 and Nick Salter (who I rate and could come on nicely).

Chad as a utility is replaceable as our defence is now getting better with less reliance on him. Carlie and Chaplin are our twin defensive towers now. Krackour and Salopek our defensive generals guiding the play forward. Pettigrew is our defensive liability ATM (as seen by his stupid after mark chest bump/push that gave away 50m)

Midfield is looking strong too in the youth department (Boak, Salopek, Cassisi, Jnr Burgoyne, Rodan, Gray, Thomas, Logan, Lower, Hartlett) so Snr Burger might even be asked to step down at the end of this year.

I know Port dominate the ruck on Saturday night, but Port have always did well in the ruck against the Crows... nothing really changed there. Chad played well but again he normally turns it up when playing the Crows. I don't think you should merely cast it off as "ahh Port smashed us in the ruck, so that won them the game". In showdowns gone by your midfield has normally smashed us in clearances and tackling pressure... on Saturday night that was missing and our midfield dominated giving our forwards good service.

Keep in mind that Port were missing Shaun Burgoyne and Justin Westhoff on Saturday night.

All that said I do think Adelaide have the right building blocks there... good experienced (but not old) defense, good developing midfield (but not as good as it has been)... but they really need to settle that forward line and use it correctly. I rate Walker, Porps, Petrenko and Moran, but not Tippet, Stevens and the rest. Continue to play Walker out of the square with Porps and Petrenko at his feet.. and have Moran roaming around the F50 arc just competing.

PS - I know a few have mentioned Hartlett, but what are you thoughts on Robbie Gray?? IMO he reminds me of Gary Ablett Jnr when he 1st entered the AFL and played as a small foward with some midfield time. Small and compact with great awareness and creativity. RG is carrying an injury so PAFC are trying to manage that by not over-working him in the middle ATM.

Cheers

 

[WALL-e]

Grays downfall for me is his kicking. It's horrid at times. But he certainly is a livewire.

 

[the egg]

I thought Patrenko tried pretty hard, although i think he tries TOO hard sometimes and slips over when he's running 100k's an hour at the opposition and they just side step him. That'll be addressed with experience though.

 

[King Elvis]

Bit tired of readng "our game plan sucks". Dont forget that we have a couple of quality mid coaches atm, including last years "rolling zone mastermind". THe game plan is not the problem, its our execution of it.

We have young bodies who are easily knocked off the line, which is why we are getting hammered at stoppages. Our players lack confidence to carry the ball forward, which is why we tend to stagnate across half back. The only real disappointment for mine is the lack of ticker from some of our seniors.

We are a young developing team, blokes like Goody, Macca, Thomson and Reilly need to show some nuts and get in amongst it.

But please dont blame the gameplan.

One size does not fit all.

If we aren't capable of playing the same gameplan as Hawthorn or Geelong, then we shouldn't play it.

Having said that - it's not the gameplan itself which frustrated me so much on the weekend - it was the lack of a Plan B.

The gameplan we were using did not work for the 1st, 2nd, 3rd of 4th Quarter.

So why didn't we try something different (man on man being the obvious one).

Quarter time - the zone is struggling, but fair enough, it's only one quarter, we'll persist with it.

Half time - zone is still struggling, but we'll make a few adjustments and see how we travel in the 3rd quarter.

Three Quarter time - the zone still isn't working, we wont win the game with the style of footy we're playing, should we try something different? We know the Power seem to dislike hard, man on man, disciplined footy, should we give that a go?

Nah, the zone might come good this quarter.


I'm a huge Craigy fan, but that was just flat out ridiculous.

 

[CROW36]

A few things Craigy really needs to work on:

1. We do not move the ball fast and clean enough down the ground the produce potent delivery into the forward line. So many time we would lumber up the field then deliver a pass that would get chopped off by Krakouer, Surjan or Pettigrew.
2. Defensive pressure in our forward 50 and through the midfield. We finished minor premiers two year in a row by smothering teams with our tackling and is the same reason St Kilda are top of the table so far and the same reason why Port beat us tonight.
3. Our kids go missing in games for much too long and i think 5 is too many. I think Walker and one of Cook/Petrenko/Dangerfield needs to go this week.
4. I really wish Porps was a taller, would be so good to see him getting pack marks and slotting them home.
5. Bernie and Nathan were good tonight

I disagree it was VB worst game for the year to many turn overs.

 

[cmndstab]

I disagree it was VB worst game for the year to many turn overs.

He's probably referring to Nathan Bock.

 

[CROW36]

Just a couple of extra things, Walker was given 70% game time last night, so I'm not sure we can use that as an excuse for his lack of footy. Our system going forward, or lack of and our structure up there on the other hand could be. However his checkside shot on goal was disgraceful from one with such a quality set shot, shows he's really lacking in confidence. I'm sorry but I don't think a run in the SANFL would hurt him at all. Now chances are NC'll give him another week and he'll kick 5 against the dogs, but at the moment I don't think it'd hurt for him to have a break.

With regards to Doughty's game, I actually thought he played quite a serviceable game and didn't panic too much under pressure, also still put his body on the line, still struggling to get up to last years standards, but did show some leadership out there I thought.

I wonder how many goals Tredders would have got if the ball was presented to him the way it was coming into our forward line.

 

[CROW36]

Definately a superstar in the making.

What would you rather, finish 5th-8th and get knocked out in the first week of finals OR finish 13th and draft a player of Hartletts ilk? People rave about our young guys, I would swap our small/mids for ports without a second thought.

Unfortunately the script in our CREED wont allow it.

 

[cmndstab]

By the way, on Robbie Gray, I think he's fantastic. I don't know what you mean about his kicking, WALL-e, I think it's a feature of his game. He's very clever, has lots of time and a real goal sense. He seems to me like Port's version of Porplyzia.

 

[WALL-e]

By the way, on Robbie Gray, I think he's fantastic. I don't know what you mean about his kicking, WALL-e, I think it's a feature of his game. He's very clever, has lots of time and a real goal sense. He seems to me like Port's version of Porplyzia.

Seems to clock out at 40 meters, not confident in his kick at all.

He'll learn though, exciting youngster,

 

[kaysee]

I wonder how many goals Tredders would have got if the ball was presented to him the way it was coming into our forward line.

Probably 0-1... which is normally what happened in 2005/2006 when you guys won the Showdowns and Rutten 'did a number' on Tredrea despite the fact we were smashed in the middle and what deliveries there were forward were crap.

IMO, ignoring all other game factors the Rutten/Tredrea battle is a very even one (almost like Jakovich/Carey). As with any Defender/Forward battle so much is reliant on midfield delivery/pressure. In 2005/2006 Crows dominated the midfield. In 2007/2008 Tredrea has been effect by injury plus Adelaide still mainly dominated the midfield.

Rutten is stronger in the wrestling battles, but at full fitness Tredrea is too quick (1 on 1) on the lead.

PS: As noted before Robbie Gray has had injury problems (groin) that need managing ATM. It does seem to be having a physical and mental effect on his kicking, which is why from >40m out he looks at dishing off.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

The tactics worked or we wanted Goodwin to play deep?! Craig said in his press conference after the game that we wanted Goodwin on Motlop and last time I checked, Motlop predominantly plays out of the square or very deep in the forward line. He does most of his work in the 50 meter arc.

Now, if you are putting Goodwin voluntarily on Motlop who you know will play 90% of TOG inside their forward 50 arc then I am not sure it was the Port tactics making us do it. We voluntarily went down that path.

Other than Edwards, I question the leadership and willingness to put the body on the line and lay a tackle of every single senior player. That display was soft as butter. They would have made Jericho proud.

Yes I agree that we may have preferred Goodwin to play deep on Motlop ......nut either way it's then hard to criticize him for not being in the play enough??

BTW it appeared on TV that Otten found himself on Motlop quite often .....was that by design ??

Still do not agree that Macleod & Goodwin have not been tackling or putting their bodies on the line ...........maybe not this week but I have seen both in recent weeks do some pretty desperate act son the field .....tackling and dives I mean