Thoughts On The Port Game (post game)

[Go the Guts]

Bit tired of readng "our game plan sucks". Dont forget that we have a couple of quality mid coaches atm, including last years "rolling zone mastermind". THe game plan is not the problem, its our execution of it.

We have young bodies who are easily knocked off the line, which is why we are getting hammered at stoppages. Our players lack confidence to carry the ball forward, which is why we tend to stagnate across half back. The only real disappointment for mine is the lack of ticker from some of our seniors.

We are a young developing team, blokes like Goody, Macca, Thomson and Reilly need to show some nuts and get in amongst it.

But please dont blame the gameplan.

Agreed. So many variables that can make the difference between a win or a loss, gameplan is but one of them. Tackling pressure and intensity IMO are very important aspects, more than just blaming the whole gameplan alone. We have lacked both for some time now, since late last year.

I wonder how many goals Tredders would have got if the ball was presented to him the way it was coming into our forward line.

True, but so many times the other night our forwards had no space to run into, and it was at least 2 on 1, and often 3 on 1 for our forwards all night. Port had done their homework. Williams seriously outcoached Craig this time round.

I also couldn't believe how bad Stevens was all night. His worst game I can remember. The amount of times I said "Geez Stevens, would you take a mark!" I generally love him as a player, and hopefully the game back will at least have given him some confidence his head's gonna be OK for this week.

 

[Stiffy_18]

Yes I agree that we may have preferred Goodwin to play deep on Motlop ......nut either way it's then hard to criticize him for not being in the play enough??

BTW it appeared on TV that Otten found himself on Motlop quite often .....was that by design ??

Still do not agree that Macleod & Goodwin have not been tackling or putting their bodies on the line ...........maybe not this week but I have seen both in recent weeks do some pretty desperate act son the field .....tackling and dives I mean

Me questioning thier hardness and leadership was specific to the showdown and not this season. While both have shown some acts of leadership and hardness this year, it was sadly missing in the showdown.

 

[lacrow]

The issue for me is that we are constantly stopping play. How many times during the game were the crows streaming out of defense only to take a mark on the center wing and then just stop (even with team mates running past), thus allowing Port to get back defensively and destroy any chances we'd have to score.

Why are we dropping so many players back behind the play? In 2005/06 we had such a dominating defense without the use of this ploy because our defensive action was coordinated and SMART. Basset would simply run off his man and chop off inbound passes that Rutten didn't get to. Simple. No need for 12 players inside the defensive 50 arc.

 

[Stiffy_18]

The issue for me is that we are constantly stopping play. How many times during the game were the crows streaming out of defense only to take a mark on the center wing and then just stop (even with team mates running past), thus allowing Port to get back defensively and destroy any chances we'd have to score.

Why are we dropping so many players back behind the play? In 2005/06 we had such a dominating defense without the use of this ploy because our defensive action was coordinated and SMART. Basset would simply run off his man and chop off inbound passes that Rutten didn't get to. Simple. No need for 12 players inside the defensive 50 arc.

Actually thats not quite right. We used this ploy and its the reason why our defence was good. Our wingman were used as extra defenders with Burton and Mattner dropping back to help out the defence. So in reality we played an 8 man defence.

Speaking of Mattner, how ****ing brilliant and desperate was that tackle on Riewoldt to assure Swans of the win. THAT was inspirational! I wish our boys could tackle as well as Mattner.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

Actually thats not quite right. We used this ploy and its the reason why our defence was good. Our wingman were used as extra defenders with Burton and Mattner dropping back to help out the defence. So in reality we played an 8 man defence.

Speaking of Mattner, how ****ing brilliant and desperate was that tackle on Riewoldt to assure Swans of the win. THAT was inspirational! I wish our boys could tackle as well as Mattner.

Ahh Mattner...those were the days (before he went to deep in defence i mean). Never been convinced of that trade.

Anyways, i think the balance of 2005/6 was right...the wings would drop back to help out and then provide rebound. So a 6 man defence with the wings usually playing between half-back to a usual max of the forward part of the square. Obviously on-ballers can tend to follow the ball a bit also so they occassionally get caught in defence but essentially they shouldn't be too deep cos then you got no-one to attack.

Where the 06 plan eventually fell down was when our rebound was choked by a huge wall of opposition numbers across the middle and half-back and we didn't have the big forwards to get thru there with confidence or keep the ball in the forward half. Then after gaining the ball, the opposition didn't fall into the same trap of allowing us to rebound back from half-back so easily. Either they went more man-on-man which we have often struggled with or began running the ball forward with handball and short kicks instead of the long bomb (the teams that were good enough in the midfield to do this well enough beat us eg WCE). The big difference come 2011ish will be the confidence we will have in the abilities of Tippett, McKernan, Davis and Walker up forward at various times (along with the support cast of smalls).

The loose man tactic not working at present imo as we dont have the game style to utilise. Why have a loose man who just handballs/kicks short to a man covered? If we did want a loose man, then I'd only wanna sacrifice one winger/on-baller as the defensive one to keep the dynamic 8 man defence (rather than any more). Still need numbers thru the middle to assist on the rebound (and actually win the ball in the middle!).

The HFF's then push up to the wing area and run down to half-forward, either as the ball-carrier or in readiness for the contest/crumb at HF.

The mids play in the midfield area of zone or man-on-man depending on requirements. No point all going behind the ball and not having the 'frontal pressure' Craig wants as we dont have enough defensive pace/grunt to stop teams easily slicing through our zone. Love to know what areas of the ground our mids get possessions in. Also, a return to a balanced game plan will allow our mids to actually get close enough to goals to threaten the scoreboard with more options.

 

[chadleverington]

we are about 50 games away from having a potent side.

The problem is in 50 games time, you would probably lose McLeod, Edwards and Goodwin. Will the team still be potent without those 3 champions?

but right now, we are mediocre.

I think mediocre is going too far. Still a well drilled side that can make the 8. There are a few teams that are "around the mark" for 8th (Sydney, Brisbane, Essendon, North Melbourne) that the crows are infront of. Looking at the current 8

saints
cats
port
carlton
pies
dogs
sydney
hawks

I expect the swans to drop out of the 8 and the crows to go in (obviously the order will change as well).

But I honestly think if Rowdy was playing tonight, result could have been very different.

I think if Shaun Burgoyne was playing we would have had more clearances (and the result would have been better).

Best
Port Adelaide: Dean Brogan, Chad Cornes, Steven Salopek, Daniel Motlop, Warren Tredrea, Tom Logan, Kane Cornes

Port on the other hand reflect why in a few years they are going to be in trouble.

Think that if it helps you. The spine and the midfield are very much long term.
Motlop, Westhoff and Ebert long term, Shaun burgoyne, Kornes, Cassisi, Pearce, Boak, Hartlett are very much long term and the defense is built around Chaplin, Carlile and Krakouer all very young.

Things I also noticed were that Kane Cornes doesn't impress me at all and I think Salopek is over rated IMHO.

Kane had a great game, sure he racked up his normal 37 disposals, but he used the ball quite well. He is an all australian for a reason, and if needed can completely shut down a player. Salopek is still very much under rated, magnificent delivery of the ball.

We will see how good their youth is once Brogan/Lade/Tredders/Chad/P Burger retire in the next 2-3 years. We got a glimpse last year when they went missing at times. They beat us due to dominance in ruck and Chad being allowed to float around on his own.

Think Chad might still be around, he is 29 now. P burger is easily replaced with the likes of Hartlett getting more time, Lade will retire and we will get our first round pick Matt Lobbe come in and get some experience, not worried there. Tredders, well as all the crows fans say he is old and crap so we don't need to replace him I am sure someone like Justin Westhoff will have shoulders by the time tredders retires.

I'll say this, I always see Surjan getting a bum wrap from people - Port themselves don't seem to rate him, but I think he's a brilliant player and have said so for years. Fearless attack on the ball and always seems to find a way to clear it out of his area.

I think he should be a "depth player". Only in the side if injuries happen. Yes he goes in after the footy, but he is a defender that cant defend. Watch him closely and you will see he gets beaten every time. You want him? how is Symes going in the sanfl?

 

[cmndstab]

I think he should be a "depth player". Only in the side if injuries happen. Yes he goes in after the footy, but he is a defender that cant defend. Watch him closely and you will see he gets beaten every time. You want him? how is Symes going in the sanfl?

Symes was clearly a starting 22 player before he foolishly fell off the back of a car and smashed up both arms and lost two months of ballwork.

 

[chadleverington]

Symes was clearly a starting 22 player before he foolishly fell off the back of a car and smashed up both arms and lost two months of ballwork.

I was talking about Surjan being a depth player Surprised Symes has been in the SANFL for so long.

 

[Geoffa32]

The problem is in 50 games time, you would probably lose McLeod, Edwards and Goodwin. Will the team still be potent without those 3 champions?



I think mediocre is going too far. Still a well drilled side that can make the 8. There are a few teams that are "around the mark" for 8th (Sydney, Brisbane, Essendon, North Melbourne) that the crows are infront of. Looking at the current 8

saints
cats
port
carlton
pies
dogs
sydney
hawks

I expect the swans to drop out of the 8 and the crows to go in (obviously the order will change as well).



I think if Shaun Burgoyne was playing we would have had more clearances (and the result would have been better).

[/b]

Think that if it helps you. The spine and the midfield are very much long term.
Motlop, Westhoff and Ebert long term, Shaun burgoyne, Kornes, Cassisi, Pearce, Boak, Hartlett are very much long term and the defense is built around Chaplin, Carlile and Krakouer all very young.



Kane had a great game, sure he racked up his normal 37 disposals, but he used the ball quite well. He is an all australian for a reason, and if needed can completely shut down a player. Salopek is still very much under rated, magnificent delivery of the ball.



Think Chad might still be around, he is 29 now. P burger is easily replaced with the likes of Hartlett getting more time, Lade will retire and we will get our first round pick Matt Lobbe come in and get some experience, not worried there. Tredders, well as all the crows fans say he is old and crap so we don't need to replace him I am sure someone like Justin Westhoff will have shoulders by the time tredders retires.



I think he should be a "depth player". Only in the side if injuries happen. Yes he goes in after the footy, but he is a defender that cant defend. Watch him closely and you will see he gets beaten every time. You want him? how is Symes going in the sanfl?

Not this Crowie. Tredrea is one of the best players this state has produced in the AFL era. You dont have a player on the list that is the potential of Tredders quality or even Chad, who is only 29 but is an old 29. Nor Lade or Brogan. This pair has been the dominant ruck duo of this decade. To suggest Lobbe and Giles are their equal is laughable.

 

[wapower]

Seems to clock out at 40 meters, not confident in his kick at all.

He'll learn though, exciting youngster,

I thin Gray's kicking depth is affected by a groin condition. I'm not quite sure what it is, but it's visibly ******ing his kicking distance.

 

[Geoffa32]

I thin Gray's kicking depth is affected by a groin condition. I'm not quite sure what it is, but it's visibly ******ing his kicking distance.

Bad luck then. You put yourself up to play you are match fit.

Maybe that is why he is the "next Ablett". Some say Ablett has some groin problems this year.

 

[chadleverington]

Nor Lade or Brogan. This pair has been the dominant ruck duo of this decade. To suggest Lobbe and Giles are their equal is laughable.

Lade in 2008 and 2009 hasn't been overly dominant, and i think Lobbe could have a similar impact (and certainly a much larger impact around the ground). Brogan will still have 2 years which gives Giles and Lobbe time to develop. Not worried about the ruck department.

 

[Cap]

Lade in 2008 and 2009 hasn't been overly dominant, and i think Lobbe could have a similar impact (and certainly a much larger impact around the ground). Brogan will still have 2 years which gives Giles and Lobbe time to develop. Not worried about the ruck department.

I think you major problem is your assuming Lobbe and Giles will infact be any good.

I'm not saying they are going to be bad, I'm just saying there is a chance they will be not up to it.

 

[Geoffa32]

Giles should be dominating the SANFL now if he is going to be any good.