List Mgmt. Trade & Free Agency talk Pt 5

[richoatthedisco]

Peanuts suggesting pick 8 for Graham are the single sole reason we have a. Bad name on BF. * me. Pick 8

Yeah, can't see us getting pick 8.

But then you remember Carltoon gave up pick 8 to get Adam ****ing Saad.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

100% Agree

When he becomes a free agent and out of contract , But for Now we want pick #8

Dreaming

 

[Rubber Hips]

So, have you asked her if he is coming to Tigerland?

Nope…she wouldn’t say. anyway but can the kid even play???

 

[Noidnadroj]

if he wants to go needs to be on our terms

I'm sick and tired of loosing our premiership players for 2 bob

its about time we put the foot down on this

I really don’t see the difference … a pick around 20 or a pick around 27…. other than ego it doesn’t really make any difference.

It will either be used as part of the GWS trade or we will take the pick to the draft. Check out the draft history of picks around 19-22 and compare them to picks around 26-29… there’s really no difference to the likelihood of a quality player… and yes, I did research this for another thread months ago.

Picks under 30 have a much better strike rate than those beyond 30. But there’s not much difference comparing 11-20 to 21-30.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Rioli2Rioli]

I really don’t see the difference … a pick around 20 or a pick around 27…. other than ego it doesn’t really make any difference.

It will either be used as part of the GWS trade or we will take the pick to the draft. Check out the draft history of picks around 19-22 and compare them to picks around 26-29… there’s really no difference to the likelihood of a quality player… and yes, I did research this for another thread months ago.

Picks under 30 have a much better strike rate than those beyond 30. But there’s not much difference comparing 11-20 to 21-30.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Pick #27 will become pick #31

 

[Meteoric Rise]

I really don’t see the difference … a pick around 20 or a pick around 27…. other than ego it doesn’t really make any difference.

It will either be used as part of the GWS trade or we will take the pick to the draft. Check out the draft history of picks around 19-22 and compare them to picks around 26-29… there’s really no difference to the likelihood of a quality player… and yes, I did research this for another thread months ago.

Picks under 30 have a much better strike rate than those beyond 30. But there’s not much difference comparing 11-20 to 21-30.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Since 2006 Richmond picks 11-20 v 21-30

This period captures all current players.


Green represents a successful pick or tracking positively for the pick.

Red represents and unsuccessful pick or tracking negatively for the pick.

Yellow represents just not enough to go on yet to make a meaningful assessment.


11-20

Riewoldt 13, Rance 18, Griffiths 19, B Ellis 15, Lennon 12, C Ellis 12, D Rioli 15, Higgins 17, Coleman-Jones 20, Collier-Dawkins 20, Brown 17



First thing here I think is remove Higgins and CCJ from the sample, as we basically traded them out for more or less picks of the same value.



So we are left with 9 selections producing:

Top class(2) - Rance, Riewoldt, both highly decorated players.

Very strong(1) - D Rioli? certainly getting there.

Good players (1) - B Ellis

Failures(3) - Griffiths, Lennon, C Ellis

Undetermined(2) - RCD(not looking great) Brown(too early to tell, some decent signs)

Overall, from 9 selections, probably tracking for 4 failures, 2 good or very strong players, and 2 champions. 1 too early to tell. So not too bad at all.



21-30

Edwards 26, Post 26, Batchelor 30, Elton 26, Bolton 29, Balta 25, Dow 21, Sonsie 28, Banks 29, Clarke 30



Top Class(2) - Bolton and Balta are both tracking that way but Balta we will get a better idea after next year.

Very Strong(1) - Edwards

Good players(0)

Failures - Post, Batchelor, Elton

Undetermined - Dow(tracking just ok, looking a little shaky) Sonsie(tracking very well) Banks, Clarke(too early to tell but both tracking ok)

Overall, from 10 selections, tracking for 4 failures and 4 successes, 2 of the successes are tracking very strongly one is too early to be too confident. And another 2 we cannot make a meaningful judgement on yet.


So I think what you are saying holds up ok regarding the value of these picks to us based on our track record. But they are quite small samples and if your recruiters are any good(ours are) then logically say a pick 15 would have to be worth more than a pick 25. At 15 you can still take the same guy you take at 25 but you also have 9 other choices from the players other clubs take at 16-24.

Even from our selections, we need to ask ourselves whether we prefer

Rance Riewoldt B Ellis D Rioli and Brown from 9 selections, or

Bolton, Balta, Edwards, Sonsie, Banks, Clarke from 10 selections.

What a choice to have to make. Certainly you can see why the club might have traded pick 15(Zac Bailey) for picks 20(CCJ) and 25(Balta) in the 2017 draft, you would back us to do better from 2 picks in the 20’s than 1 pick in the teens.

As for Graham, I wouldn’t be too keen on seeing him go for below about the value of pick 20 unless there is some sort of necessary salary dumping element to it.

 

[NZ_Tiger]

There has clearly been something amiss with McAsey at Adelaide. Who knows if it could be corrected elsewhere, but if he wasn’t too pricey, he might be worth a punt if the cost is low. I watched him in his early games for Adelaide, in the COVID affected 2020 season. The Crows were incredibly weak then and he was a first year KPP, and got smashed of course. But I didn’t think he looked any worse than what you would expect of a first year kpp exposed to such difficulties. I think he has had some injury troubles but there is obviously something Nicks was not happy with for him not to get a run this year whilst Murray and Butts were conceding goals on a regular basis. Nicks clearly has zero tolerance of players not fitting the game plan. But you would have to wonder if Hardwick would be any more tolerant.

But he’s not even at SANFL level. He’s playing SANFL twos. You don’t drop pick 6 on a player and play him the Magoos’ magoos out of spite.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[GoTigers2015]

Pick #27 will become pick #31

Ashcroft, Davey, Fletcher and who else?

 

[Meteoric Rise]

But he’s not even at SANFL level. He’s playing SANFL twos. You don’t drop pick 6 on a player and play him the Magoos’ magoos out of spite.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I agree. Something has clearly gone very wrong. So to recruit him you would have to think either you could help him correct it, or, given his overall profile that it is a punt worth taking at the wage and draft pick cost. It would seem unfathomable that he is playing SANFL reserves just based on not having sufficient talent to do better.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Ashcroft, Davey, Fletcher and who else?

Any free agents attracting compo, like McStay, Amon to name two possibilities.

 

[Calcium Man]

Since 2006 Richmond picks 11-20 v 21-30

This period captures all current players.


Green represents a successful pick or tracking positively for the pick.

Red represents and unsuccessful pick or tracking negatively for the pick.

Yellow represents just not enough to go on yet to make a meaningful assessment.


11-20

Riewoldt 13, Rance 18, Griffiths 19, B Ellis 15, Lennon 12, C Ellis 12, D Rioli 15, Higgins 17, Coleman-Jones 20, Collier-Dawkins 20, Brown 17



First thing here I think is remove Higgins and CCJ from the sample, as we basically traded them out for more or less picks of the same value.



So we are left with 9 selections producing:

Top class(2) - Rance, Riewoldt, both highly decorated players.

Very strong(1) - D Rioli? certainly getting there.

Good players (1) - B Ellis

Failures(3) - Griffiths, Lennon, C Ellis

Undetermined(2) - RCD(not looking great) Brown(too early to tell, some decent signs)

Overall, from 9 selections, probably tracking for 4 failures, 2 good or very strong players, and 2 champions. 1 too early to tell. So not too bad at all.



21-30

Edwards 26, Post 26, Batchelor 30, Elton 26, Bolton 29, Balta 25, Dow 21, Sonsie 28, Banks 29, Clarke 30



Top Class(2) - Bolton and Balta are both tracking that way but Balta we will get a better idea after next year.

Very Strong(1) - Edwards

Good players(0)

Failures - Post, Batchelor, Elton

Undetermined - Dow(tracking just ok, looking a little shaky) Sonsie(tracking very well) Banks, Clarke(too early to tell but both tracking ok)

Overall, from 10 selections, tracking for 4 failures and 4 successes, 2 of the successes are tracking very strongly one is too early to be too confident. And another 2 we cannot make a meaningful judgement on yet.


So I think what you are saying holds up ok regarding the value of these picks to us based on our track record. But they are quite small samples and if your recruiters are any good(ours are) then logically say a pick 15 would have to be worth more than a pick 25. At 15 you can still take the same guy you take at 25 but you also have 9 other choices from the players other clubs take at 16-24.

Even from our selections, we need to ask ourselves whether we prefer

Rance Riewoldt B Ellis D Rioli and Brown from 9 selections, or

Bolton, Balta, Edwards, Sonsie, Banks, Clarke from 10 selections.

What a choice to have to make. Certainly you can see why the club might have traded pick 15(Zac Bailey) for picks 20(CCJ) and 25(Balta) in the 2017 draft, you would back us to do better from 2 picks in the 20’s than 1 pick in the teens.

As for Graham, I wouldn’t be too keen on seeing him go for below about the value of pick 20 unless there is some sort of necessary salary dumping element to it.

Post was going really well until Edwards as very strong.

 

[blaisee]

Hes looked s**t at afl level

only a pup, and well worth the risk

 

[blaisee]

Im not saying it's anything concrete. I'm basing it all off of a like from a Richmond staffer that may not have any knowledge of our list management strategy.
But it is very curious.
Let's see what happens.

no doubt just a rumour, makes alot of sense though

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Post was going really well until Edwards as very strong.

You don’t think Edwards had a very strong career? AA, 3 flags, 300+ games, Norm Smith votes amongst other things.

 

[Calcium Man]

You don’t think Edwards had a very strong career? AA, 3 flags, 300+ games, Norm Smith votes amongst other things.

He’s top class. There are only 98 people to play 300 games, out of how many 1000s to play the game.

 

[Bird Man]

could well possibly go JG and pick 19 for pick 8 and a 3rd rounder ( still think power wont go for it)

pick 8,12 and future first ----> Hopper, Toranto


Also why not throw in Bowens and pick 7..

OUT: picks 8,12,19, future first, Graham

IN: Hopper, TT, Bowens, Pick 7

 

[Meteoric Rise]

He’s top class. There are only 98 people to play 300 games, out of how many 1000s to play the game.

I see. I rate him just below the truly elite players. Had a fantastic career, and there just aren’t any 300 gamers who are not really good players, but for me he is there with a lot of other 300+ gamers that were not highly decorated. This is why I had the extra category in between top class and good players, to accomodate this level of player.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

could well possibly go JG and pick 19 for pick 8 and a 3rd rounder ( still think power wont go for it)

pick 8,12 and future first ----> Hopper, Toranto


Also why not throw in Bowes and pick 7..

OUT: picks 8,12,19, future first, Graham

IN: Hopper, TT, Bowens, Pick 7

This is just not within our cap budget surely. And then it isn’t just a matter of placing a call to the Suns and it is done. There are other clubs in a bidding war already. They want a useful pick back. So you are probably looking at upgrading a pick around 20 to pick 7. Is that worth it to a contending team to pay a marquee wage to a a non-marquee layer for 2 years?

And on top of all of that there is the player himself. He is not going to want to move just for the sake of helping the Suns. He will require some sort of decent contract offer beyond the 2 years. So he’d probably expect a further 2 years at $450k as a bare minimum.

This is a deal to leave to clubs with more cap space and for whom Bowes would be a useful player that adds to their team immediately.

 

[austyn08]

Port send pick 8 and future 3rd for Graham and pick 19
We send 8, 12, 30 and Soldo for Taranto and Hopper
Peachy

If we want 8 in that deal we would have to swap it with 12

 

[GoTigers2015]

Any free agents attracting compo, like McStay, Amon to name two possibilities.

Already counted Amon (27) and McStay likely to be a second rounder (35).

 

[roacheee]

Yep, Graham’s apparently worth pick 8 meanwhile GWS should give us Taranto and Hopper for just 12 & 19.

Sometimes this place hurts my head

Say it with me.....salary cap dump

No one here would've thought the pies would do the trelol deal with the dogs.......but they did

 

[Morro]

Yeah, can't see us getting pick 8.

But then you remember Carltoon gave up pick 8 to get Adam ******* Saad.

Haha

Who is actually a much better player than Graham and one of the best half backs in the game.

 

[Hoos]

Top Class(2) - Bolton and Balta are both tracking that way but Balta we will get a better idea after next year.

Very Strong(1) - Edwards

I would have Edwards and Balta the other way around. Edwards is much, much better than very strong.

 

[Toadvine]

The fridge is still running with us

 

[TiggyTig]

Since 2006 Richmond picks 11-20 v 21-30

This period captures all current players.


Green represents a successful pick or tracking positively for the pick.

Red represents and unsuccessful pick or tracking negatively for the pick.

Yellow represents just not enough to go on yet to make a meaningful assessment.


11-20

Riewoldt 13, Rance 18, Griffiths 19, B Ellis 15, Lennon 12, C Ellis 12, D Rioli 15, Higgins 17, Coleman-Jones 20, Collier-Dawkins 20, Brown 17



First thing here I think is remove Higgins and CCJ from the sample, as we basically traded them out for more or less picks of the same value.



So we are left with 9 selections producing:

Top class(2) - Rance, Riewoldt, both highly decorated players.

Very strong(1) - D Rioli? certainly getting there.

Good players (1) - B Ellis

Failures(3) - Griffiths, Lennon, C Ellis

Undetermined(2) - RCD(not looking great) Brown(too early to tell, some decent signs)

Overall, from 9 selections, probably tracking for 4 failures, 2 good or very strong players, and 2 champions. 1 too early to tell. So not too bad at all.



21-30

Edwards 26, Post 26, Batchelor 30, Elton 26, Bolton 29, Balta 25, Dow 21, Sonsie 28, Banks 29, Clarke 30



Top Class(2) - Bolton and Balta are both tracking that way but Balta we will get a better idea after next year.

Very Strong(1) - Edwards

Good players(0)

Failures - Post, Batchelor, Elton

Undetermined - Dow(tracking just ok, looking a little shaky) Sonsie(tracking very well) Banks, Clarke(too early to tell but both tracking ok)

Overall, from 10 selections, tracking for 4 failures and 4 successes, 2 of the successes are tracking very strongly one is too early to be too confident. And another 2 we cannot make a meaningful judgement on yet.


So I think what you are saying holds up ok regarding the value of these picks to us based on our track record. But they are quite small samples and if your recruiters are any good(ours are) then logically say a pick 15 would have to be worth more than a pick 25. At 15 you can still take the same guy you take at 25 but you also have 9 other choices from the players other clubs take at 16-24.

Even from our selections, we need to ask ourselves whether we prefer

Rance Riewoldt B Ellis D Rioli and Brown from 9 selections, or

Bolton, Balta, Edwards, Sonsie, Banks, Clarke from 10 selections.

What a choice to have to make. Certainly you can see why the club might have traded pick 15(Zac Bailey) for picks 20(CCJ) and 25(Balta) in the 2017 draft, you would back us to do better from 2 picks in the 20’s than 1 pick in the teens.

As for Graham, I wouldn’t be too keen on seeing him go for below about the value of pick 20 unless there is some sort of necessary salary dumping element to it.

How is Edwards not a top class pick here?