Europe War in Ukraine - Thread 4 - thread rules updated

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This is the thread for discussing the War in Ukraine. Should you want to discuss the geopolitics, the history, or an interesting tangent, head over here:


If a post isn't directly concerning the events of the war or starts to derail the thread, report the post to us and we'll move it over there.

Seeing as multiple people seem to have forgotten, abuse is against the rules of BF. Continuous, page long attacks directed at a single poster in this thread will result in threadbans for a week from this point; doing so again once you have returned will make the bans permanent and will be escalated to infractions.

This thread still has misinformation rules, and occasionally you will be asked to demonstrate a claim you have made by moderation. If you cannot, you will be offered the opportunity to amend the post to reflect that it's opinion, to remove the post, or you will be threadbanned and infracted for sharing misinformation.

Addendum: from this point, use of any variant of the word 'orc' to describe combatants, politicians or russians in general will be deleted and the poster will receive a warning. If the behaviour continues, it will be escalated. Consider this fair warning.

Finally: If I see the word Nazi or Hitler being flung around, there had better have a good faith basis as to how it's applicable to the Russian invasion - as in, video/photographic evidence of POW camps designed to remove another ethnic group - or to the current Ukrainian army. If this does not occur, you will be threadbanned for posting off topic

This is a sensitive area, and I understand that this makes for fairly incensed conversation sometimes. This does not mean the rules do not apply, whether to a poster positing a Pro-Ukraine stance or a poster positing an alternative view.

Behave, people.
 
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Ummmm are we changing wars now?

No it didn't, are you retracting your original argument?
Why change wars?
Wars are all the same.
A country doesn't have to have it's capital taken to be forced to the negotiation table.
Russia will be eventually forced to the negotiation table to unconditionally surrender it's Ukrainian territories.
I'm sure you'll misunderstand this post, but that's not my problem m8.
 
Why change wars?
Wars are all the same.
A country doesn't have to have it's capital taken to be forced to the negotiation table.
Russia will be eventually forced to the negotiation table to unconditionally surrender it's Ukrainian territories.
I'm sure you'll misunderstand this post, but that's not my problem m8.
You literally changed wars on me when the point was refuted, I don't know how else to read it

Russia can't win this war (oh sorry, special military ****up).
The same way Germany lost the the Second World War, Russia also will be forced to the eventual negotiation table with an ultimatum of unconditional surrender, of occupied territories.


Russia was at the negotiating table in mid 2022 and Ukraine left, this is common knowledge
 

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You literally changed wars on me when the point was refuted, I don't know how else to read it

Russia can't win this war (oh sorry, special military ****up).
The same way Germany lost the the Second World War, Russia also will be forced to the eventual negotiation table with an ultimatum of unconditional surrender, of occupied territories.


Russia was at the negotiating table in mid 2022 and Ukraine left, this is common knowledge
What was on the negotiating table, from Russia, is common knowledge.
 
Did you read it?
I did.
Nothing surprised me.
Ukraine wants Crimea back.
Ukraine wants to be a part of the EU and join NATO.
**** Putin.
Ok, so you didn't

Ukraine’s negotiators offered to forgo NATO membership, and to accept Russian occupation of parts of their territory. But they refused to recognize Russian sovereignty over them.

“We managed to find a very real compromise,” Oleksandr Chalyi, a member of the Ukrainian negotiating team, said at a panel discussion in Geneva last December. “We were very close in the middle of April, in the end of April, to finalize our war with some peaceful settlement.”


Then Ukraine left the negotiating table and Zelensky decreed it was illegal to negotiate with Putin
https://www.brusselstimes.com/300580/zelenskyy-signs-decree-rejecting-negotiations-with-putin
 
Ok, so you didn't

Ukraine’s negotiators offered to forgo NATO membership, and to accept Russian occupation of parts of their territory. But they refused to recognize Russian sovereignty over them.

“We managed to find a very real compromise,” Oleksandr Chalyi, a member of the Ukrainian negotiating team, said at a panel discussion in Geneva last December. “We were very close in the middle of April, in the end of April, to finalize our war with some peaceful settlement.”


Then Ukraine left the negotiating table and Zelensky decreed it was illegal to negotiate with Putin
https://www.brusselstimes.com/300580/zelenskyy-signs-decree-rejecting-negotiations-with-putin
I did read it.
President Zelensky said "**** Putin".
 
I did read it.
President Zelensky said "**** Putin".
Yeh, I don't think that was a great move

But all those things were on the negotiating table, which was your original point(question? idk the phrasing was strange)

What was on the negotiating table, from Russia, is common knowledge.
Ukraine wants Crimea back.
Ukraine wants to be a part of the EU and join NATO.
 

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The founder of Telegram, Pavel Durov, has been arrested in France. Telegram is a highly unregulated platform, with no infrastructure in place to protect its use from predators etc. Durov has arrest warrants in a small number of countries because it is expected (quite rightly) that there should be something in place to regulate it and he provided nothing. He merely coded the concept and enjoyed the profits.

Telegram is that great double edged sword - both the good and the bad can be communicated there. The RF has already attempted to nerf its use through litigating that channels with 10k plus followings must be registered so they can monitor for their content. We all know its motives here - just like VK and other platforms which are now (as one ex-Russian youtuber put it) "FSB sinks" where the population is scoured for any anti-empire acticity and SIZO invites follow.

But they're not wrong to arrest the guy. If he didn't want the responsibilty that comes with the platform's growth, then he should have on-sold it earlier.

However, it could lead to an end to Telegram, and that will further censor Russian patriots who desire to defend their country from Putin's destructive policies.

(its easy to find in media, can't be arsed sharing links. Commentary above is my own)
This ones a weird one. Durov knowing he is a wanted man knowingly enters a country where he can be arrested?

The Kremlin and all its sycophants have rallied and are up in arms about it, much more so than the invasion of Kursk.

Kremlin also want access to him (probably to kill him).

Considering he and Telegram weren’t the most popular thing going around with Putin, and with these other things in play, l’m suggesting he is looking to defect.
 
Young bloke conscripted via Spring intake, took the oath August 24, then moved from Kostromo to Ivanovo, where he is now informed he's off to training and then on to Kursk. Committed to front line duty within 2 days of oathtaking. A conscript.
Details on Siberian Express Tg. Can share link when home.

On SM-A146P using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
Young bloke conscripted via Spring intake, took the oath August 24, then moved from Kostromo to Ivanovo, where he is now informed he's off to training and then on to Kursk. Committed to front line duty within 2 days of oathtaking. A conscript.
Details on Siberian Express Tg. Can share link when home.

On SM-A146P using BigFooty.com mobile app
Hope he gets chance to safely surrender.
 
It's got under 6 months before Ukraine pulls the pin
6 weeks ago it was this….

Ukraine won't last out this year, Zelensky has signalised as much

Now its gone into next year.

You’re like my brother in law who has had one too many bongs in his life who at Easter this year was ripping into Zelensky for killing half a million of his own troops, and telling me that the entire eastern frontline was collapsing and it was all over.
 
6 weeks ago it was this….



Now its gone into next year.
I mean it's not a great deal of difference for a three year war(2 months from some random charlatan sprouting shit on an Australian footy forum). We'll see I guess, my predictions have remained pretty similar
You’re like my brother in law who has had one too many bongs in his life who at Easter this year was ripping into Zelensky for killing half a million of his own troops, and telling me that the entire eastern frontline was collapsing and it was all over.
Yeh I do agree with him, this has been a massive waste of life.

So what's your prediction?
 
Talking about military supply situation in NATO, particularly artillery shells. Keep up

From taking Kyiv in 3 days to not being able to retake Kursk in 3 days 2 and a half years later.


What a stunning success this war has been for Putin, the masterful genius.
 



Russians doing the same things after suffering embarrassment on the military airfields.


barreness why do you think it is Ukranian soldiers are able to avoid murdering, torturing and raping Russian civilians upon invading Russian territory while also somehow resisting the impulse to thieve and loot?


Pretty stark differences between the way both armies conduct themselves on enemy territory.
 

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Europe War in Ukraine - Thread 4 - thread rules updated

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