List Mgmt. 2020 Draft Thread

[cityslick1]

I agree I am not worried about the loss of Phillips. I just take comments that he wasn't best 22, that Rantall might be a good Trelaor replacement, that Stevo isnt a big loss because he was not much chop in the covid hub as unrealistic.

I am still pissed with how we have run the list down, bad decisions were made and it's almost because we have a lot of new players to look and and wonder about their potential that the mess is forgiven. My view is Eddie and Bucks should be on notice at a minimum but i think the anger has subsided and we will go back to "all is ok".

I don't see us as having drafted strong talent. 9 picks from the last 2 main drafts are picks 17, 19, 23, 30, 31, 40, 44, 45 and 51. That's not really strong talent to me. Teams that have done really well from 2020 draft are Dogs, Adel, Ess, Syd, NM. Next GWS, Hawks have a preferable pick up. A lot of teqams were not invested in this draft which is also a worry

We went in balls deep, have given up a lot to do so and picked out an ok hand. Just based on where they have come from I don't see why you would expect this 9 to make it hard for our fringe players to get games. Not many if any will be ready to really press in 2021. Maybe I am trying too hard not to get excited because I want the club not to keep pissing in our pocket and real change to come from 2020.

too harsh on this year's batch. Last year, maybe... but Ruscoe could be a find, Rantall has an elite attitude & tank, and Bianco wasnt a bad pick for 40s.

This year is much more advanced though, and all of the top 4 will push for selection at some stage.

Henry is already a Stevo / WHE / Thomas replacement, and has shades of Stevie J / JDG even... all class
Macrae already has a solid build, works hard and is a 24 carat mid. Will push as the Treloar replacement, battle Sier & the Brown's for a spot in year 1, and plenty have shown that they can impact straight away...
Reef is tough, skilful and quick. Just needs a tank, but didnt stop him from picking up 31 touches in the midfield as an under ager when Rowell and Anderson were absent. Should push out Hoskin Elliott / Mayne... its just when
Poulter huge upside, just needs some meat, but has loads of energy and drive. An accumulator, unlike the Browns & WHE. So knows how to find and use it. These kids will shake things up on the training field, as all have plenty of ability & look red hot to prove themselves.

I'd be pushing to play as many as possible in 2021, as Mayne, Thomas, C Brown & WHE arent in my best 22... whilst Treloar & Stevo obv need replacing

 

[Gone Critical]

I'm not sure what you were expecting leading into the draft? I feel like our mistakes had already happened. Hine managed to turn a mediocre draft hand into a much improved one with some clever live trading. Given where we started the night I think it was a big win.

It's hard to predict how these draftees will go but my read is we look to have brought in some very good midfielders. With Reef, Macrae, Poulter then Daicos next year I feel confident we get some hits in that group. And size! Key forward, the good ones were already out of the draft but I am glad we brought in a developing key forward in McMahon. Then we have some energy forward of the ball with general/small forwards with Henry who is quality and the pressure that McCreery (highest f50 tackle nos in the SANFL) and Ginnivan bring, appreciating also this position is often found later in the draft.

Then the real question is what do we do with our cap space? We won't see the fruits of that this year but when you talk of replacing A-Grade talent i'm comfortable we have a warchest to do it. I think we will look to get an established mid and key forward with that, and given the money we had walk out the door we are positioned for that.

I do appreciate the frustration, this off season has been nothing short of sh*te, but I do reckon last night went as good as we could have hoped.

Yeah its the frustration of the trade balls up and my concern now the draft is going to sweep those concerns away and get Bucks and Eddie off the hook. The draft just franked our bad decisions. In itself there were no problems
Hine did very well and I appreciate posters get excited, only concern was maybe what we got for our future 1st may not be that great in hindsight. We did very well with the hand we had but we did invest heavily and probably walked away with the sixth or seventh best crop of players compared to other teams. We were never going to match what Ess, NM, Adel, Syd were going to pick up last night.

Also with the excitement can come over expectation. These kids are late teen, 20's, 30's and 40's picks. Realistically not all will be hits. Think back to how we felt when Brody/BenKen and Broomy came on board. Stellar junior careers and the two smalls had already done well in the SANFL. Bit of caution required. Let these kids settle, people expecting 4 A graders or 4 debuts round 1 are amping up too much

FA will be interesting. We should have money available. Still not many are available each year and most are looking for success. If we tumble a bit in 2021 and after the way we dealt with our contracted players in the off season we may not be an attractive option. NM have been chased up and chasing for seasons with no takers. FA's tend to go to top sides. That may not be us next year.

 

[Gone Critical]

too harsh on this year's batch. Last year, maybe... but Ruscoe could be a find, Rantall has an elite attitude & tank, and Bianco wasnt a bad pick for 40s.

This year is much more advanced though, and all of the top 4 will push for selection at some stage.

Henry is already a Stevo / WHE / Thomas replacement, and has shades of Stevie J / JDG even... all class
Macrae already has a solid build, works hard and is a 24 carat mid. Will push as the Treloar replacement, battle Sier & the Brown's for a spot in year 1, and plenty have shown that they can impact straight away...
Reef is tough, skilful and quick. Just needs a tank, but didnt stop him from picking up 31 touches in the midfield as an under ager when Rowell and Anderson were absent. Should push out Hoskin Elliott / Mayne... its just when
Poulter huge upside, just needs some meat, but has loads of energy and drive. An accumulator, unlike the Browns & WHE. So knows how to find and use it. These kids will shake things up on the training field, as all have plenty of ability & look red hot to prove themselves.

I'd be pushing to play as many as possible in 2021, as Mayne, Thomas, C Brown & WHE arent in my best 22... whilst Treloar & Stevo need replacing replacing

Hope you are right. Not sure how you can be so confident about 4 kids who haven't played footy for 12 months, misssed the development their final year of TAC cup brings and are now going to push seasoned players out immediately. We really don't know if they were all going to come on in their final TAC year. . How can they be more advanced?

They will play when they are ready, there are 18 on the list who haven't played at all or just 1 or a handful of games.

 

[pugsville]

agree... think Bianco & Rantall may struggle to get into this team now. Have some v good young mids to compete with

A lot of this years draftees did not get much football last year. We've also cut a lot of "depth".
Outside a nominal best 22 you woudl have Cal Brown, Tyler Brown

21

Tyler Brown

Age

24

Ht

192cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.0

3star

K

4.0

2star

HB

7.0

4star

M

1.0

1star

T

1.4

3star

CL

0.6

3star

D

11.0

3star

K

4.0

1star

HB

7.0

4star

M

1.0

1star

T

1.4

2star

CL

0.6

3star

D

11.0

3star

K

4.0

2star

HB

7.0

5star

M

1.0

1star

T

1.4

4star

CL

0.6

3star

, Cameron, Murphy, Ruscoe, Kelly, Keane as the only other players to have played 1 game or more,

 

[Apex36]

recruiter mate liked chugg as a rookie...

but wish Hine would go some speculative talls like Rutugolea here. Always seems like the NQR undersized mid / FP types...

I’m still confused as to why we wouldn’t take a rookie punt on Baldwin. 1 year contracts, outside the TPP, and we’d have 3 years to see if his knee is cooked or not. For a KPF who was touted as top 10 on talent it should have been a no brainer for us to grab him in the RD as a low risk high reward project.

 

[Scodog10]

I think Poulter playing SA U18’s and Reef not playing U18’s at all, plus coming off an injury, means they may not really be round 1 propositions. Henry is a chance and Macrae a longshot.

On the flip side neither of these two really has any footy under their belt since 2019. With the short turnaround compared to a normal draft I think the only one that has a legitimate chance of breaking in is McReery because he’s that little bit older, he played league footy in 2020 and fills a need with Stephenson gone (assuming Brown isn’t just given the role...).

I'm not sure what you were expecting leading into the draft? I feel like our mistakes had already happened. Hine managed to turn a mediocre draft hand into a much improved one with some clever live trading. Given where we started the night I think it was a big win.

It's hard to predict how these draftees will go but my read is we look to have brought in some very good midfielders. With Reef, Macrae, Poulter then Daicos next year I feel confident we get some hits in that group. And size! Key forward, the good ones were already out of the draft but I am glad we brought in a developing key forward in McMahon. Then we have some energy forward of the ball with general/small forwards with Henry who is quality and the pressure that McCreery (highest f50 tackle nos in the SANFL) and Ginnivan bring, appreciating also this position is often found later in the draft.

Then the real question is what do we do with our cap space? We won't see the fruits of that this year but when you talk of replacing A-Grade talent i'm comfortable we have a warchest to do it. I think we will look to get an established mid and key forward with that, and given the money we had walk out the door we are positioned for that.

I do appreciate the frustration, this off season has been nothing short of sh*te, but I do reckon last night went as good as we could have hoped.

That’s the key to the success of this off-season. Any acquisition next year will be judged at the time, but the foundation was put in place this year. The club will never retrospectively achieve a tick for their work during trade week, but it would go some way toward writing the wrongs.

The names I’d have on our white board are Balta (cap squeeze Richmond), S Taylor, B Cox, Kelly and Bont (cap squeeze Bulldogs). I don’t see the quality of KPF we need being available so I think I’d prefer the club take a more progressive path with the forward line by trying to go with more general forwards and focus on how we bring it in. For instance Kelly (Cox as backup) and Mihocek as the targets with Henry/ WHE/ Elliott/ Wilson/ JT/ McReery/ Murphy/ Ruscoe/ JDG rolling through and the emphasis on quick ball movement further afield.

IMO, that mix is no worse than the group we had to work with in 2018 and I think our chances are dependent on our strongest lines standing up.

 

[unplugged]

I’m still confused as to why we wouldn’t take a rookie punt on Baldwin. 1 year contracts, outside the TPP, and we’d have 3 years to see if his knee is cooked or not. For a KPF who was touted as top 10 on talent it should have been a no brainer for us to grab him in the RD as a low risk high reward project.

Was it Baldwin which had torn an ACL even as recently as this year? Perhaps he's a good example of a supplementary selection whom you'd have train at your club over summer to see where he's at. Alternatively he could be a good mid-season draft candidate for next season.

It has seemingly taken a pandemic and reduced list sizes but it does seem like we've finally realised that having injury prone players on the list serves no one well. We might be shy on his type due to this reason.

 

[Apex36]

Was it Baldwin which had torn an ACL even as recently as this year? Perhaps he's a good example of a supplementary selection whom you'd have train at your club over summer to see where he's at. Alternatively he could be a good mid-season draft candidate for next season.

It has seemingly taken a pandemic and reduced list sizes but it does seem like we've finally realised that having injury prone players on the list serves no one well. We might be shy on his type due to this reason.

As I said, I understand why we wouldn’t commit a senior spot, but a rookie position seems like a risk free no brainer, regardless of injury.

 

[TradeDraft]

I’m still confused as to why we wouldn’t take a rookie punt on Baldwin. 1 year contracts, outside the TPP, and we’d have 3 years to see if his knee is cooked or not. For a KPF who was touted as top 10 on talent it should have been a no brainer for us to grab him in the RD as a low risk high reward project.

Guess we think his Knees are F**ked though he could be someone we hope to take as a Mid-Season Pick IF he plays footy though that be a Very Risky Move IF we are Interested in him

 

[neilk]

Was it Baldwin which had torn an ACL even as recently as this year? Perhaps he's a good example of a supplementary selection whom you'd have train at your club over summer to see where he's at. Alternatively he could be a good mid-season draft candidate for next season.

It has seemingly taken a pandemic and reduced list sizes but it does seem like we've finally realised that having injury prone players on the list serves no one well. We might be shy on his type due to this reason.

Was he the one who is on his second ACL after tearing the graft from the first reco?

 

[TradeDraft]

 

[Apex36]

Was he the one who is on his second ACL after tearing the graft from the first reco?

Yes. And in all likelihood his knee won’t hold up to the rigours of AFL. But 12 months ago he was regarded as the most talented KPF prospect after JUH in this draft. The kid is the real deal, it just feels odd that we wouldn’t take the punt on a rookie spot for him given the potential payoff.

 

[stormskye]

After this big draft I hope we continue this rejuvenation, accept we aren’t a contender next season and spend the year developing all of the kids including Murphy, Rantall, and co.

Hit 2022 having used 2021 as best we can to start a good 5 years of challenging, with an added bonus of daicos. We need to focus on development!

 

[Chrispiesssss]

Poulter looks about the same height as Reef.


I’m truely excited about all these tall midfielders!

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I think those 2 boys in particular would be pretty safe in the fact they're clearly solid citizens and both have a brother in the system, so they'd have seen first hand what it takes and whether they've got what's required. Sometimes it'd take just one interview to know they're a safe bet.

The minute you interview someone 2, 3 plus times you're either very interested or you're using a kid's life as a puppet to create a smokescreen. Generally I'd suggest multiple interviews makes for strong interest.

Very happy with how last night panned out, and the answer to your question may lay within (sorry, this will end up quite long-winded):



With our first pick in Pick 16, we bid on Jones as the only NGA/FS player remaining from the top 15. No chance of getting him, not a list need whatsoever. Port had positioned themself to match a bid knowing it was coming, so they were always going to. The bid basically costs them 38 & 39.

Immediately our picks from Hawthorn which were originally 41 & 42 both come in two spots each. That's a pick upgrade for free! Genius, and happens solely due to our bid coming when it did.

We take Henry with 17, GWS take Angwin and we take Macrae.

We seemed to know GWS weren't keen on Reef McInnes with their first couple of picks. Now, did we tell them if they didn't bid on Reef with their first few selections, we would then trade them our future first? I bet we did.

And were we ever going to trade out our future first for some decent 2020 picks before a Reef bid? Definitely not.

The speculation on here that we told GWS to bid with their pick before they trade it to us makes perfect sense to me. Post-bid, we trade up and get Pick 24, 30 and a Future Fourth from GWS for our Future First.

Straight away we bid on Coleman, which is win/win because we either get Coleman (unlikely, but would've been awesome) or Brisbane's pick gets swallowed up and our pick 30 moves forward a pick (the Coleman pick cost them 29). Again, free pick upgrade, our doing.

Now it gets a little bit more risky, but the draft has really opened up by this point:

We trade back 25 to 27 and a Future Third from Adelaide. Now, either we psyched Adelaide out and told them we were going to take Cook (he was probably the best SA lad available at the time), or they suspected that St Kilda were going to. Maybe St Kilda had spoke to Cook multiple times? Maybe we had spoken to Cook multiple times and they thought we'd take him? We may have also promised not to take Sam Berry.

At this stage we realise we don't need pick 59 and it has points for Fremantle, and we know they'll take O'Driscoll, so we again trade back a few spots whilst gaining 2021 points. Fremantle jump at the opportunity as it moves them up 3 spots and gets them the points.

The big risk at this point was St Kilda or Hawthorn taking Poulter. Either way, unless we were going to take Matthew Allison (St Kilda's pick at 26) or Seamus Mitchell (Hawthorn's pick at 29), I'd say they were two very calculated switch back which gained us two future selections.

Again, maybe the Saints or Hawks hadn't even spoken to Poulter, or had only spoken to him once and hadn't shown the player anything to suggest they'd take him.

Maybe I'm over-analysing the sh*t out of this whole thing but gee I'm happy with the way last night played out.

I'd love to know if Henry was our top selection draft-board wise and if so, where did we have him? I meant to put it towards the member forum

Just on this.........

Hawthorn, after taking DGB without issues trade us 41 & 42 for 62, 69 and a future second.

Add in the fact that Collingwood originally traded Phillips to Hawthorn for 65.

The picks in the 60s were not taken to the draft so effectively worth nil.

Effectively we have traded a future second rounder for 41 and Phillips for 42.

Hawthorn effectively improved the Phillips trade for us and allowed us to convert Phillips into Mccreery

 

[TradeDraft]

Yes. And in all likelihood his knee won’t hold up to the rigours of AFL. But 12 months ago he was regarded as the most talented KPF prospect after JUH in this draft. The kid is the real deal, it just feels odd that we wouldn’t take the punt on a rookie spot for him given the potential payoff.

We have not Really Taken any KPP in the Rookie Draft Recently so not just Baldwin

 

[TradeDraft]

Just on this.........

Hawthorn, after taking DGB without issues trade us 41 & 42 for 62, 69 and a future second.

Add in the fact that Collingwood originally traded Phillips to Hawthorn for 65.

The picks in the 60s were not taken to the draft so effectively worth nil.

Effectively we have traded a future second rounder for 41 and Phillips for 42.

Hawthorn effectively improved the Phillips trade for us and allowed us to convert Phillips into Mccreery

Actually I think we did the Trade before they Picked DBG

 

[TradeDraft]

Just on this.........

Hawthorn, after taking DGB without issues trade us 41 & 42 for 62, 69 and a future second.

Add in the fact that Collingwood originally traded Phillips to Hawthorn for 65.

The picks in the 60s were not taken to the draft so effectively worth nil.

Effectively we have traded a future second rounder for 41 and Phillips for 42.

Hawthorn effectively improved the Phillips trade for us and allowed us to convert Phillips into Mccreery

We Turned 41 and 42 into McInnis

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Actually I think we did the Trade before they Picked DBG

Yeah I was quoting that bit. But that swap pick with Hawthorn seemed to be to our benefit, partially reducing the pain of giving Phillips to them for nothing ( pick 65 in a draft that only went to 58)

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

We Turned 41 and 42 into McInnis

Even better ( of course.... that’s where all our picks in the 40s went... doh!!!!)

 

[TradeDraft]

Yeah I was quoting that bit. But that swap pick with Hawthorn seemed to be to our benefit, partially reducing the pain of giving Phillips to them for nothing ( pick 65 in a draft that only went to 58)

and We hear that Reef was getting no High Bids from Crows and Bombers

 

[manicmagpie]

Anyone got any non-paywalled links to the handful of Herald Sun articles about the draft?

The Draft Report Card
Secret Scout verdict
Have Pies won back angry fans

 

[jackcass]

After this big draft I hope we continue this rejuvenation, accept we aren’t a contender next season and spend the year developing all of the kids including Murphy, Rantall, and co.

Hit 2022 having used 2021 as best we can to start a good 5 years of challenging, with an added bonus of daicos. We need to focus on development!

We currently have something like 26 of the 42 on our list under 25 years old. I expect it to grow to 28 throughout the year as we fill the remaining 2 spots. 18 of the 26 have less than 10 games experience. Of that group, only Moore, JDG, Maynard, Noble, Daicos and IQ look anything like best 22. We need others to bridge that gap. Sier, Murphy, Kelly and Tyler Brown

21

Tyler Brown

Age

24

Ht

192cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.0

3star

K

4.0

2star

HB

7.0

4star

M

1.0

1star

T

1.4

3star

CL

0.6

3star

D

11.0

3star

K

4.0

1star

HB

7.0

4star

M

1.0

1star

T

1.4

2star

CL

0.6

3star

D

11.0

3star

K

4.0

2star

HB

7.0

5star

M

1.0

1star

T

1.4

4star

CL

0.6

3star

look the most promising at this stage. Big summer for a few of these lads.

 

[jackcass]

Poulter looks about the same height as Reef.


I’m truely excited about all these tall midfielders!

My God, what is Ed doing wasting time talking to these kids! Doesn't he have important decisions to be made somewhere?

 

[TradeDraft]

My God, what is Ed doing wasting time talking to these kids! Doesn't he have important decisions to be made somewhere?

Telling them Who is Boss at Collingwood