List Mgmt. 2020 Trade Thread - Part II

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gringo2011 said:
I don't think he's wrong 100% though. I reckon when we got Butler there was no way we thought he'd be as good as he was. Jones was a gamble as a rebound back who might be bale to play mid. Howard and Hill were fairly known quantities as was Ryder. I think we would have thought Butler was just another in a line of depth small forwards. Even my Richmond mate didn't even blink when Butler left. He thought he was Jack Lonie level.
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Butler showed in his first year he was a very good footballer. My richmond sources tell me he got ahead of himself and started doing the hollywood stuff which didn't go down well. It looks like he's learned from that and is back to team first high pressure footy. It didn't help that richmond had a plethora of small forwards. Shai Bolton couldn't get a game back then and he looks like he could be a serious A grader
 
SaintsSeptember said:
He improves us by the difference between Dunstan and Himself.
With reduced list sizes , injury prone players are harder to justify.
I think i'd rather keep Dunstan on moderate money and a shorter contract.
If everything goes to plan, our midfield in 2022 will be :
Bytel, Steele, Byrnes, Jones, Clark, with the likes of Ross, Gresham, Sinclair, Phillips, Hill still around.
Haneberry would still be on the books ( 3 weeks ). Do we really want Crouch on 5 years as well?
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So you'd rather keep a vastly inferior player just to save money when we're just about to enter a stage where we can contend for a flag?

What if it's a month out from finals, we're fighting for top 4 and Steele gets hurt. Do you want him replaced with Crouch or Dunstan?

List sizes aren't being reduced by that much anyway.
 

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Winmar2Lockett said:
Just to add to the Crouch discussion, who's contract $$ are we likely to shed this year?

There was some debate about whether Paddy's $ were included in this year's TPP plus we've got Robbo's big contract to consider. The 'contribution' towards Stuv's salary was only for this year too. You'd also think that a new deal for Carlisle wouldn't be on as much coin as he has been.

Assuming the Crouch offer is in vicinity of $650k, we should still have plenty of room to move both this year & next.
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Dunny, Robbo, Webster, Lonie, Carlisle would be on the block. Not all but a combo, hoping we keep Jake.

Which Eistein gave DMAC 3 years?
 
Joffaboy said:
Well I would say your Richmond mate doesn't know much about football. My Richmond mates were telling me he was an absolute beauty. Who was correct.
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stavro#4 said:
Crouch at his best is a whole different level to Gresh the mid.

there is a seriously good footballer who never quite consistently landed at that level for the crows.
But when he did you saw why he was a pre selection.

he isn’t a silky dal

he is what Luke Ball was like in 05 at his best. sh*t kicking and all at times. Accumulator with the ability to burst through packs with speed at others.
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Most true insiders don't use the ball well because they are pressured on every disposal. Oliver is a gun but he gets the ball and moves it so quickly that even he doesn't know where it will go.
 
SaintsSeptember said:
He improves us by the difference between Dunstan and Himself.
With reduced list sizes , injury prone players are harder to justify.
I think i'd rather keep Dunstan on moderate money and a shorter contract.
If everything goes to plan, our midfield in 2022 will be :
Bytel, Steele, Byrnes, Jones, Clark, with the likes of Ross, Gresham, Sinclair, Phillips, Hill still around.
Haneberry would still be on the books ( 3 weeks ). Do we really want Crouch on 5 years as well?
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Hopefully him and Hanners can time their hammy injuries not to overlap.

Between them, we might be able to get 20 games a season.
 
BrutThough said:
We have publicly said we never expected all 5 players to nominate us. And also said that we never expected all 5 players to work out as well as they did. Not even our recruiters expected these players to adapt and fit in so quickly. We picked up 5 players who we thought we help fill our needs. We didnt expect them to be as good as they were.

We picked up a VFL small forward who ended up being the best small forward in the comp this year. No one at the club expected Butler to be this good.

We picked up an ageing ruck who turned back the clock and played some of the best games of his career. No one expected Ryder to be as good as he was.

We picked up Jones, who primarily a wing/half back and started playing him in the middle. He was top 10 in the coaches votes mid way through the season. No one would have expected that.


It was magnificent. But if we tried that again 10 times, it wouldnt work out as perfectly as it did this year. It was a perfect storm and not something we should be expecting to ever happen again.
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We recruited for needs last year and got the players we wanted.
We are once again this year going with the same process,with Mids our number one priority.
While 5 Trades in 1 trade period is unique it was not a fluke.
Dan Butler played in a Premiership with Richmond before going back to VFL due to other players being preferred before him.
We may have got lucky with Dan,as he was only a 2nd option for Carlton after Papley,but that's how the Trade system works.
Ryder has been a very good player for a long period of time and was recruited to help teach Marshall to be even better than he is,and he got fitter and trained harder and proved to be more valuable to us than expected,but no fluke there.
Hill was always coming to us when his Fiance decided to move back to Victoria.
Jones was always coming to us if a trade got done.
Howard was a 2nd option after Keath knocked us back,and being good mates with Ryder did help.
All 5 players that came to us had proven that they are AFL standard.
Superb Recruiting in my opinion and far from a FLUKE

.
 
kernelT said:
This was my concern in chasing a 27 YO Hill at such a huge cost, after we did that we need to be having a real crack.

If the plan is a 2025 tilt then we should have hit the draft and held onto steak knives Acres.

I think we can make a charge earlier though, there's some pretty average sides making the top 4 and winning flags.
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I tried to argue it was more about trying to stay competitive while building a side than hit a premiership. We could do a Dogs or even a Hawks 2008 but our list doesn't look like a premiership side yet. It will be a bit harder next year with double ups against top 8 sides. Improving the playing list as you go keeps players keen to come from other clubs.
 
BrutThough said:
Hopefully him and Hanners can time their hammy injuries not to overlap.

Between them, we might be able to get 20 games a season.
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This is my main concern. Once bitten, twice shy. Although Hanners final v the Dogs, showed his worth when fit.
 

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saintscott said:
Butler showed in his first year he was a very good footballer. My richmond sources tell me he got ahead of himself and started doing the hollywood stuff which didn't go down well. It looks like he's learned from that and is back to team first high pressure footy. It didn't help that richmond had a plethora of small forwards. Shai Bolton couldn't get a game back then and he looks like he could be a serious A grader
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Yeah, my mate reckons Shai pushed Butler out but since moved to mids and could have had a spot over some others not performing.
 
Can’t get complacent, we should be looking to finish top 4 next year and a 27 year old contested ball winner will help get us there and keep us there while some others develop. If we rely solely on natural progression we may never get there. In 2017 Crouch had 17 contested possessions in the prelim final and grand final, please try and convince me that we don’t need that.
 
Saint Hendy said:
I've been vocal about how little I rate Brouch, mainly due to his kick in hope style (that we lament Gresh for); however, I can see the value in bringing him in for the reduced amount.

He would be an improvement, as he would enable Gresh/Billings to play forward more, and this would enable Kent to never play again.
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A concern to an extent. The Ace in our hand is our King. He will get bigger and harder to handle, even this year he was hardly out marked just brought it to ground.

So a mongrel kick into the fifty isn't as vital as it usually is. With our small forwards at his feet and if we brought in another bigger forward to combine with King, Crouch's less than perfect kicking wouldn't matter quite as much.
 
saintscott said:
Butler showed in his first year he was a very good footballer. My richmond sources tell me he got ahead of himself and started doing the hollywood stuff which didn't go down well. It looks like he's learned from that and is back to team first high pressure footy. It didn't help that richmond had a plethora of small forwards. Shai Bolton couldn't get a game back then and he looks like he could be a serious A grader
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The Hollywood stuff sounds like a variation on Lonedog's issues. He just tends to go away from the little stuff that goes largely unnoticed and starts to flop for easy frees.

Maybe a fresh start and the kick up the arse that goes along with it is what he needs. I'd be sad to see the little pest go though.
 
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