List Mgmt. 2021 List Management: Draft, Trade, Free Agency and Academy

[E Shed]

Darling was a shocker no doubt but gee I’d love to have seen what Pitt could have been. Just about never seen a player who could pin it off either leg off a single step or around his body


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[salim malik]

Maybe I’m being generous giving our drafiting an A grade but there are so many factors that go into winning a flag outside drafting and personally our drafting has been the best aspect. We’ve had one decent coach in our history which I think is evident in more than just on-field success of them all, I’ll stick to my guns that trading has been the worst in the comp, that’s a big handicap Tom over come and aside from Port we were given the worst assets to start a club from of any in the AFLs history.

Despite all that, since 2000, our win/loss record is pretty close to 50/50 if I’m not mistaken, a decidedly middle of the road club. Isnt like only 6 clubs have won a flag in 15 years? They aren’t easy to win, not winning win doesn’t make us an abysmal club, there is a scale from 1-10 here, sure, not successful, but not abysmal.

And let’s be real here, your major gripe and issue with drafting is and always has been not focusing on local talent almost exclusively and while I’ve softened to preferring local if possible, I don’t think applying like a 50% loading to local talent is the way to build success or we wouldn’t have two of the greatest legends of the game (yet alone our club), run out in purple

I love having legends of the game in purple , in our case it's been a Croweater and a WA country lad. But you can't argue that having Naughton or Allen who were available to us would have set up the forward line for years and Darling might have made a difference in 013.
We wouldn't have Cerra If we took Naughton or Allen but a couple of local rookies who we missed out on twice in Ryan and Kelly might have compensated in missing Cerra..
I hate bringing up WC but they are a successful club and doing their homework on local talent has certainly set them up since day one.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

I love having legends of the game in purple , in our case it's been a Croweater and a WA country lad. But you can't argue that having Naughton or Allen who were available to us would have set up the forward line for years and Darling might have made a difference in 013.
We wouldn't have Cerra If we took Naughton or Allen but a couple of local rookies who we missed out on twice in Ryan and Kelly might have compensated in missing Cerra..
I hate bringing up WC but they are a successful club and doing their homework on local talent has certainly set them up since day one.

Darling is the killer one IMO (as much as peeps like to shit on him in here). That one is an absolute head scratcher. Two sliding doors moments probably cost us a flag or two IMO, picking Pitt and the footy Gods robbing us of watching a centre square combo of Morabito & Fyfe terrorise the competition

 

[salim malik]

Naughton was playing defense at Peel. We had defenders. It's wasn't obvious he'd be a gun forward.

Naughton was a freak and could play forward or back. I had witnessed him nailing goals from outside 50
Mundy was a full back, Fyfe a half forward. Imagine if they had been pigeonholed in their drafted positions.
Having a blinkered vision of a 17/ 18 year olds future position is so short sighted.

 

[Dockeroo]

The non selection of Yeo and subsequent unwillingness to trade for him as a 20 yo in 2013 is a good example of why drafting and trading of young talent specifically for “needs” is stupid.
The “needs” of an AFL club can change dramatically in the space of as little as 2 years.
Yet a quality players career can last for 15 years.
Bringing a 26 year old Rory Lobb to the club was a piece of list management based on needs. He comes in and he theoretically fills the need immediately (debatable whether that has actually happened but beside the point).
With a potentially elite 19 or 20 year old talent like Yeo, you don’t look at the list in late 2013 and only say - do we need him next year? You ask yourself, will we need this guy between now and 2025?
Not a hard concept to fathom is it?

 

[Purple Jesus]

Darling is the killer one IMO (as much as peeps like to sh*t on him in here). That one is an absolute head scratcher. Two sliding doors moments probably cost us a flag or two IMO, picking Pitt and the footy Gods robbing us of watching a centre square combo of Morabito & Fyfe terrorise the competition

Even if one of those had worked out, we'd have had a better night that September in Melbourne. Had ticks to the players after party and all. Couldn't bring myself to go. Had a quiet italian somewhere and then flew home the next day.

 

[blue shark]

The non selection of Yeo and subsequent unwillingness to trade for him as a 20 yo in 2013 is a good example of why drafting and trading of young talent specifically for “needs” is stupid.
The “needs” of an AFL club can change dramatically in the space of as little as 2 years.
Yet a quality players career can last for 15 years.
Bringing a 26 year old Rory Lobb to the club was a piece of list management based on needs. He comes in and he theoretically fills the need immediately (debatable whether that has actually happened but beside the point).
With a potentially elite 19 or 20 year old talent like Yeo, you don’t look at the list in late 2013 and only say - do we need him next year? You ask yourself, will we need this guy between now and 2025?
Not a hard concept to fathom is it?

That is why you need experience in the decision making. People who have done it before.
Not Ex- players just out of the game, learn on the job or one for the boys.
Also WC know when to go local, they have 27 out of 44 players from here.
But what would they know about winning?
The truth is that even when the old boys retire their spine will still be strong, and all that will be required is a mini rebuild.

 

[Docker82]

The non selection of Yeo and subsequent unwillingness to trade for him as a 20 yo in 2013 is a good example of why drafting and trading of young talent specifically for “needs” is stupid.
The “needs” of an AFL club can change dramatically in the space of as little as 2 years.
Yet a quality players career can last for 15 years.
Bringing a 26 year old Rory Lobb to the club was a piece of list management based on needs. He comes in and he theoretically fills the need immediately (debatable whether that has actually happened but beside the point).
With a potentially elite 19 or 20 year old talent like Yeo, you don’t look at the list in late 2013 and only say - do we need him next year? You ask yourself, will we need this guy between now and 2025?
Not a hard concept to fathom is it?

I think the greater issue with Yeo was years of neglect for our KPP stocks at either end.

We had only Tanner Smith and Matt Taberner on the list under 25 at the time. Let’s be honest Taberner looked like a spud we were only keeping because we were desperate until about 2018 as well.

Drafting Apeness and Pearce with our first two picks and trading in Gumbleton showed how desperate the situation was becoming. Some would say it’s similar now but our oldest KPP is 28, whilst 2013 our only decent ones were 30+.

Tbh the Yeo decision imo is an example of how past poor list management decisions can force you to make desperate decisions. I’m honestly convinced we would’ve found room for Yeo if the ability to trade future picks had existed at the time as we could’ve brought in two 18 year old KPPs and Gumbleton and still had assets we could’ve traded for Yeo.

 

[sumavich]

The non selection of Yeo and subsequent unwillingness to trade for him as a 20 yo in 2013 is a good example of why drafting and trading of young talent specifically for “needs” is stupid.
The “needs” of an AFL club can change dramatically in the space of as little as 2 years.

That was inexcusable, it was Bond IIRC.
He was from a Freo supporting family, heavy duty one.
****ing pathetic, even Harvs was saying this kid was going to be a very good player.
He was his coach at Brisbane

 

[Dockeroo]

I could easily see Jordan Clark being the 2021 version of Elliot Yeo in 2013. I don’t think he will be as good as Yeo but will still be a very good player.
If he is available for a second rounder I’d happily pull the trigger.

 

[Dockeroo]

List of KPP at Fremantle in 2021

Joel Hamling - 28
Alex Pearce - 25
Griffin Logue - 23
Heath Chapman - 19
Brennan Cox - 23

Sean Darcy - 23
Lloyd Meek - 23

Rory Lobb - 28
Matt Taberner - 27
Josh Treacy - 18

It’s clear there’s a space for another key forward. I don’t count the likes of Sturt, Luke Ryan, Duman, or even Fyfe as genuine KPP even though the can and have played tall at times. If we happens to take two more KPP this year and both made it as serviceable or better AFL players we would be well placed for the next decade IMO.
We would then need to just keep building and adding Key position players like a normal club would - eg maybe one selection every year, and let them develop without any pressure.

 

[mightymouse75]

Dude literally just one of those players was a first round pick by West Coast. Two were trades. This is not an argument in favouring local with early picks.

I'm talking about good players. The fact first round picks tend to be good players once drafted could also be relevant if cerra goes or if we overpay him.

 

[blue shark]

List of KPP at Fremantle in 2021

Joel Hamling - 28
Alex Pearce - 25
Griffin Logue - 23
Heath Chapman - 19
Brennan Cox - 23

Sean Darcy - 23
Lloyd Meek - 23

Rory Lobb - 28
Matt Taberner - 27
Josh Treacy - 18

It’s clear there’s a space for another key forward. I don’t count the likes of Sturt, Luke Ryan, Duman, or even Fyfe as genuine KPP even though the can and have played tall at times. If we happens to take two more KPP this year and both made it as serviceable or better AFL players we would be well placed for the next decade IMO.
We would then need to just keep building and adding Key position players like a normal club would - eg maybe one selection every year, and let them develop without any pressure.

Take out the players 27 and over and it’s starting to look like boys against the men.
What we don’t need are skinny flanker types.
God knows how we replace Mundy?

 

[Swiggy]

Take out the players 27 and over and it’s starting to look like boys against the men.
What we don’t need are skinny flanker types.
God knows how we replace Mundy?

Hopefully Valente

 

[Taylor]

What we don’t need are skinny flanker types.
God knows how we replace Mundy?

I think your best chance is to draft a skinny flanker type with clean hands and elite kick - then bulk him up to play inside.

I hope we don't have the picks to select the elite kicking, big bodied, inside mid at U18s. That guy either comes with serious baggage like Valente or is picked up by #5. If he has any pace he is gone by pick #3

 

[Swiggy]

If we do lose Cerra jeremy sharp should be a target need a proper winger, wouldnt cost much

 

[yakamoto]

Mundy was once a skinny flanker type.

 

[theGav56]

If we do lose Cerra jeremy sharp should be a target need a proper winger, wouldnt cost much

Do you think he is doing well?

 

[Parrots78]

Off field I think he would be doing very well on the Gold Coast

 

[Swiggy]

Do you think he is doing well?

Think hes going ok. Wing is one stop the suns have pretty well covered

 

[Paracleet]

Just to clarify, if you believe that 'missing' home state players is bad because they are 'right under our noses' as if every club in the country does not have more less the same amount of paid resources watching them you are genuinely an idiot.

 

[blue shark]

Mundy was once a skinny flanker type.

That was Fyfe, Mundy was 190cm 85 kg in 2004.

 

[salim malik]

Just to clarify, if you believe that 'missing' home state players is bad because they are 'right under our noses' as if every club in the country does not have more less the same amount of paid resources watching them you are genuinely an idiot.

Missing local players that are performing well and are available at our picks is poor list management.
Any one who can't work that out is genuinely an idiot.

 

[Taylor]

Missing local players that are performing well and are available at our picks is poor list management.
Any one who can't work that out is genuinely an idiot.

I'd argue that selecting well performing local players of elite performing non locals is poor list management.
We need to get the best talent in the team possible.

Arguably two of our best ever five players aren't local. That's a list featuring McPharlin, Sandilands, Fyfe, Pavlich and Mundy.

 

[blue shark]

I'd argue that selecting well performing local players of elite performing non locals is poor list management.
We need to get the best talent in the team possible.

Arguably two of our best ever five players aren't local. That's a list featuring McPharlin, Sandilands, Fyfe, Pavlich and Mundy.

So we all agree then 60 percent local, 40 percent interstate.
That’s the best list management and similar to WC model