List Mgmt. 2022 Trade Thread - Part I

[MrFoster]

Did you actually read what I wrote? I just said I'd replace him but he's safe because we don't have anyone else listed. I'd replace him in a heartbeat but you can't just throw a mid into his role. I gave him an out though suggesting a s**t structure might have caused his drop off.

Seriously, in our current poor forward setup, small forwards are playing handicapped.. Higgins and Butler still managed to kick 29 and 18 goals, both can be 30+ scorers in a better system.. King has 47, can easily be 60+

 

[MrFoster]

I agree. Things may have changed, if we lost say Hill and Naz, there are two more potential frdp's. We might wanted to package them for a very high frdp.

For shits and giggles, say we got pick 5 for both. So we had 5 and 10.
Go for the two best mids in the draft,( real mids not Clark and Coff), and use the freed up sc to get DeGoey, and maybe Amon.

Still require a lockdown FB to free up Doogs.
Will be an interesting trade and draft period.

Agree.. Clark and Coff are not mids.. they are half backs who can pinch hit in the middle but are not suited to play midfield full time, for too long we drafted flankers and hope they become mids.. Billings (pick 3), Acres(18), Mckenzie (20) Gresham(25), Clark(7), Cofffield(8), That’s 6 first round we burnt, could have fixed the midfield problem long time ago..

 

[bird_man]

I agree. Things may have changed, if we lost say Hill and Naz, there are two more potential frdp's. We might wanted to package them for a very high frdp.

For shits and giggles, say we got pick 5 for both. So we had 5 and 10.
Go for the two best mids in the draft,( real mids not Clark and Coff), and use the freed up sc to get DeGoey, and maybe Amon.

Still require a lockdown FB to free up Doogs.
Will be an interesting trade and draft period.

If that's the case 5 on a mid and 10 on a key defender would be ideal

 

[The Boar]

I think our best bet would be a straight swap for Bergman. Both similar picks, both want to go home. We could probably ask for a 4th rounder or something on top as an extra due to Nas being less developed and so a higher ceiling.

I don't like that deal much and would rather back us to win NWM over next year.

Other options:
1) Bergman + Swap of 1RPs.
2) NWM + 3rd for their 1RP this year (we sweeten the deal slightly).
3) NWM + Highmore for their 1RP + change.

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[WeedsMullet84]

If we got another really decent tall defender then clearly it changes the mix completely.

Not sure if he fits the "bill" as a decent tall defender but if we picked up a Billy Frampton type then either Wilkie or Battle would be totally surplus to needs and would be tradeable.

I'd keep Wilkie because of his leadership qualities and I'm sure a few clubs would be interested in Battle.

Billy Frampton will go down as one of the biggest list management mistakes when we let him go at the end of this season for basically nothing.

Go have a look at his numbers in the SANFL.

Plays as a hybrid KPD that intercepts and gets the ball going forward, racking up metres gained like a HB. Is currently doing things you don’t normally see a 202cm player do. Also chops out adequately in the ruck

Some of his 1-1 work is poor but he’s only just switched to defence this year.

We seem to want to play two very dour spoiling defenders in Butts and Murray, who won’t take a mark to save their life


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[gringo2011]

You wrote his pressure was a myth but today he is our best pressure forward. You seem to post conflicting views from day to day depending on who you are trying to point score off.
And realistically who are you replacing him with?

You are a bit obsessed with everything I post at the moment. Your trip must be going great.

I think his pressure is overrated as a way to justify him being in the side. I would replace him in a heartbeat but there is no-one on our list that is taking his spot, that's my point. He's the only one of his type we have. The only thing I'd say is that the way we set up this year our forward line really didn't stand much of a chance. Perhaps with a good forwards coach he could get back to the first half of 2020 Butler but right now he offers as much as Lonie.

I think my summary of his pressure earlier in the year was accurate though, Long offers frightening junkie in an alley with a shiv pressure, Butler is more like a slightly passive aggressive spouse who might make a dinner party awkward with her silent treatment.

 

[SteeleSaints]

Billy Frampton will go down as one of the biggest list management mistakes when we let him go at the end of this season for basically nothing.

Go have a look at his numbers in the SANFL.

Plays as a hybrid KPD that intercepts and gets the ball going forward, racking up metres gained like a HB. Is currently doing things you don’t normally see a 202cm player do. Also chops out adequately in the ruck

Some of his 1-1 work is poor but he’s only just switched to defence this year.

We seem to want to play two very dour spoiling defenders in Butts and Murray, who won’t take a mark to save their life


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We have recently been big on players SANFL form, so hopefully our club ask the question of a Frampton trade.

 

[gringo2011]

I don't like that deal much and would rather back us to win NWM over next year.

Other options:
1) Bergman + Swap of 1RPs.
2) NWM + 3rd for their 1RP this year (we sweeten the deal slightly).
3) NWM + Highmore for their 1RP + change.

On Pixel 6a using BigFooty.com mobile app

Don't think they'd want TH to be honest, they seem to find those intercept backs easily. They are also in for a refresh in the next couple of years with guys like Gray retiring. Losing their draft capital goes against their recent strategy of using high picks.

 

[Rors]

Taranto is average. Clear as day if you watch Giants games.

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Yeah, if you’ve only watched Giants games this year. Bloke has checked out & been injured. Average players don’t win B&Fs in a year when their team makes the Grand Final.

Literally walks into our team as the 2nd best mid behind Steele, and he ain’t that far behind Steele either

 

[gringo2011]

If that's the case 5 on a mid and 10 on a key defender would be ideal

I hate spending high picks on tall defenders. I'd rather go for mids, they come on quicker and we probably have a few years to make hay before the older crew drop away. I'd look at Frampton and Ethan Phillips types if we want to get a big bodied lump defender in. The backs we have aren't bad but more lacking a gorilla minder. Once Hawk retires there won't be many big bodied bull forwards left. Most of the others are more Max King, Joe Daniher tall, athletic types who burn them on the lead and out reach the shorter guys.

 

[borderbarry]

If we were to offer both Zac Jones and Brad Hill for a draft pick, what round would we get?

 

[Mangus]

Flat no to trading NWM. He is a 1st year player who is a little bit homesick it doesn't take long for that to change. Don't panic and be forced into doing something we don't want to do. He is still playing good footy and has played most of the year probably even at times when he shouldn't have so his homesickness is not stopping him performing. Let him go back to Adelaide in his break and realise how dull it is to be a 19 year old in a oversized country town and welcome him back for preseason in November. Make it clear keeping him is a priority for us.

Hill to North seems like a strange first move for Clarko not sure I would be starting my rebuild with an ageing Hill as my centre piece. But if it is real and not some Big Footy fantasy then it makes sense for their priority pick 19# presuming they get it and what ever late picks get shuffled to make everyone happy. Anything less than that and it doesn't work. More than that and I think North ought to give up and move to Tassie.

Bytel to Essendon is interesting given they selected Hobbs last year doesn't really seem he is any more likely to play seniors for them than he is for us. There is not much leverage for us on this one I fear. Dodo will try and screw us if he still has a job after their review. Only hope is in their turmoil that make some dumb moves just for a positive news story. I am almost ready to give up on him anyway he is not going to push out Crouch or Ross in the short term and Windhager and Owens are the future. He should be looking else where. It is a shame I had high hopes for him.

I don't see too many other trade options and I wouldn't be trading anyone in unless they cost virtually nothing (free agents or 4th round picks) we need to keep our picks and hit the draft add to last years crop and build a core group of young talent that can come through together. Have a crack at DeGoey and Amon. Search the state leagues for the Wilkie style mature age rookie picks but primarily focus on the draft.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Agree.. Clark and Coff are not mids.. they are half backs who can pinch hit in the middle but are not suited to play midfield full time, for too long we drafted flankers and hope they become mids.. Billings (pick 3), Acres(18), Mckenzie (20) Gresham(25), Clark(7), Cofffield(8), That’s 6 first round we burnt, could have fixed the midfield problem long time ago..

You can only draft the players that are available in the draft.
I don't think i'd have liked us to take someone like Fiorini instead of Gresham.
It was also kind of awkward the Clark/Coffield year. Pure mids that came after them were Ling and Brandar.

Here is a pre-draft description of McKenzie.

In a nutshell, McKenzie is a classy midfielder with superb athletic traits who boasts a rare combination of top line speed, endurance and agility. His skill set is also within the top echelon. He is a balanced kick on either side of his body, rates highly in terms of his marking capabilities, whilst his defensive pressure and nous to spread and win the ball on the outside also features prominently.

2014 Draft Profile: Daniel McKenzie

Daniel McKenzie (Oakleigh Chargers) Height: 183 cm Weight: 77 kg Position: Midfielder/defender Player comparison: George Horlin-Smith Strengths: Speed, tackling, defensive pressure, marking, big-game player Areas needing improvement: Consistency, ability to hit the scoreboard You could be...

central.rookieme.com

 

[WRFL Indentity]

Correct. 100%. The best summation of why NWM should NOT be traded.

As a club we should back ourselves in to keep him and for him to be a 200 game player. He was a first round draft pick and will be a very fine footballer.

Stuff the SA clubs who are pursuing him. He’s our player and we will keep him. Line in the sand. He should not be going anywhere.

I understand your theory, and I don't want to let him go, but when has a club genuinely changed the mind of a player that wants out and said player stayed long term a s performed. Off the top of my head, I can't think of anyone. That's not to say it doesn't happen, but it more the exception that proves the rule.

If it comes down to it, trade him away for the best we can expect and hit the draft again.

 

[The_Steadier]

So does Wilkie or battle leave the side?

I'd back wilkie in to play on the oppositions mid sized/smaller fwd every week.

As in:

FB: Trade in a marcus adams lockdown type.

CHB: Doogs

3rd tall: Battle

Then wilkie takes the midsize fwd ie neale bullen, rohan, degoey, dusty types.

Then webster and paton take the oppositions best 2 small fwds.

(Sinclair to fulltime midfield)

Battle, wilkie and doogs (off chb) have decent enough run and carry and footskills to have us rebounding well off halfback.
Having one guy being the designated kicker off half back (sinclair or hill) is way too easy to stop via a tag.

We have 4 guys in doogs, wilkie, webster and battle who can all share the job sinclair has been doing this year off hb while still defending their opponents.

Edit- as for coffield- make him a mid or trade bait.

 

[Joffaboy]

You are a bit obsessed with everything I post at the moment. Your trip must be going great.

I think his pressure is overrated as a way to justify him being in the side. I would replace him in a heartbeat but there is no-one on our list that is taking his spot, that's my point. He's the only one of his type we have. The only thing I'd say is that the way we set up this year our forward line really didn't stand much of a chance. Perhaps with a good forwards coach he could get back to the first half of 2020 Butler but right now he offers as much as Lonie.

I think my summary of his pressure earlier in the year was accurate though, Long offers frightening junkie in an alley with a shiv pressure, Butler is more like a slightly passive aggressive spouse who might make a dinner party awkward with her silent treatment.

No not obsessed, you just said one thing one day and something totally different the next. Seems you aren't sure what you think depending on who you are trying to one up.

I would replace Butler as well if we could but we can't. His pressure is not underrated and was evident on the occasions he wasn't playing how easily the opposition defence walked it out of the 50.
Long is great for hardness but seems inconsistent. Could be because he isn't settled into a position, a but like Josh Battle for a couple of years. May be worth giving Long a six game stint in the Butler role for him to settle in and see if he can stiffen the forward defence like Butler does.

 

[borderbarry]

Steadier, You have left out Coffield. Who showed signs last year of being a very good defender.

 

[Joffaboy]

I hate spending high picks on tall defenders. I'd rather go for mids,.

Been asking for this for literally a decade.

 

[gringo2011]

No not obsessed, you just said one thing one day and something totally different the next. Seems you aren't sure what you think depending on who you are trying to one up.

I would replace Butler as well if we could but we can't. His pressure is not underrated and was evident on the occasions he wasn't playing how easily the opposition defence walked it out of the 50.
Long is great for hardness but seems inconsistent. Could be because he isn't settled into a position, a but like Josh Battle for a couple of years. May be worth giving Long a six game stint in the Butler role for him to settle in and see if he can stiffen the forward defence like Butler does.

I think I've articulated exactly what I meant, you are trying to make something out of nothing and it's not even any different to what you're saying. You are being deliberately obtuse trying to get likes from your little band of positivity cultists.

 

[Joffaboy]

If we were to offer both Zac Jones and Brad Hill for a draft pick, what round would we get?

Is this a joke?

Would get maybe a late second for Jones and Hill is on 900k.

If Clarkson want Hill he will need to give something like the PP North may get and take most of the contract. We may take say 200k but it frees up about 1.4 mill over 2 seasons.

Balls deep into DeGoey, so in isolation we could offer DeGoey what Hill is getting, get a second frdp and redraft GOAT from Freo on medium coin (last bit is facetious but could do a Croad or a Jayson Daniels)

 

[Joffaboy]

I think I've articulated exactly what I meant, you are trying to make something out of nothing and it's not even any different to what you're saying. You are being deliberately obtuse trying to get likes from your little band of positivity cultists.

And the snark and bitchy replies start. You didn't articluate at all, you were trying your snark yesterday saying Butlers pressure was a myth, and completely changed your opinion today. Don't get pissy because you have been caught out. Trying to get likes lol. As stated I am doing something about the woeful state of our club, soooooo positive.
It's like saying all your posts are to get likes from the misery merchants who whinge and moan but won't put their money where their mouth is. As I said yesterday true colours, you think you are busier than a President that runs an 8 billion dollar company. lulz .

 

[Veer Right]

Battle goes forward, and form a 3 probe attack with King and Membrey

Did you miss the years where Battle was not much good playing anywhere but CHB? If you do remember then i am lost for words.

 

[bird_man]

I hate spending high picks on tall defenders. I'd rather go for mids, they come on quicker and we probably have a few years to make hay before the older crew drop away. I'd look at Frampton and Ethan Phillips types if we want to get a big bodied lump defender in. The backs we have aren't bad but more lacking a gorilla minder. Once Hawk retires there won't be many big bodied bull forwards left. Most of the others are more Max King, Joe Daniher tall, athletic types who burn them on the lead and out reach the shorter guys.

I've got no issue with it if they look quality. Gibcus last year would have been great.

If we were to somehow manage to get 2 top 10 picks I think there are some good mids high in the draft we could use the first one on.

Don't mind the look of the kid from WA with the next pick.

I'm not interested in bringing in below average key defenders from other clubs.

Pretty happy with Windhager so far which helps the midfield dilemma but we still definitely need to find an elite mid somewhere. It looks like they are in the top 6 or so in the draft as usual.

 

[#gosaintas]

I'd back wilkie in to play on the oppositions mid sized/smaller fwd every week.

As in:

FB: Trade in a marcus adams lockdown type.

CHB: Doogs

3rd tall: Battle

Then wilkie takes the midsize fwd ie neale bullen, rohan, degoey, dusty types.

Then webster and paton take the oppositions best 2 small fwds.

(Sinclair to fulltime midfield)

Battle, wilkie and doogs (off chb) have decent enough run and carry and footskills to have us rebounding well off halfback.
Having one guy being the designated kicker off half back (sinclair or hill) is way too easy to stop via a tag.

We have 4 guys in doogs, wilkie, webster and battle who can all share the job sinclair has been doing this year off hb while still defending their opponents.

Edit- as for coffield- make him a mid or trade bait.

Webster or Paton
Don't need both most weeks with Wilkie able to play small

 

[ScrappyDo]

I'd back wilkie in to play on the oppositions mid sized/smaller fwd every week.

As in:

FB: Trade in a marcus adams lockdown type.

CHB: Doogs

3rd tall: Battle

Then wilkie takes the midsize fwd ie neale bullen, rohan, degoey, dusty types.

Then webster and paton take the oppositions best 2 small fwds.

(Sinclair to fulltime midfield)

Battle, wilkie and doogs (off chb) have decent enough run and carry and footskills to have us rebounding well off halfback.
Having one guy being the designated kicker off half back (sinclair or hill) is way too easy to stop via a tag.

We have 4 guys in doogs, wilkie, webster and battle who can all share the job sinclair has been doing this year off hb while still defending their opponents.

Edit- as for coffield- make him a mid or trade bait.

I think we can do a better outcome.
Webby is getting on so it's reasonable to start succession planning.

Get a FB
Doogs to CHB
Batts to 3rd tall
Wilkie
Coff
Pato

This group rates very highly for intercepts and are generally very good kicks and much better as a defensive outfit.

7th defender out of Clark, Webby and Leo

Sinclair moves to mid. Or a hybrid mid/def rotating with Hunter.

This means we shift more to kicking out of defense rather than running it with Hill and Sincs. I'm very in favor of that myself.