List Mgmt. 2023 List Management

[Dunna Heartknee]

I don't think Cripps is as gone as so many are saying. He's not what he was last yr but he's not getting any help. Kennedy, Hewett and Curnow have all been worse. Walsh has been getting more ball but his effectiveness has also been in question.

I'm not sure why it happened, but we seem to have changed his role from the attacking centre forward mid from last yr to being a 2 way stay at home mid. We know he's not that, he never has been. Last season we maximised his assets and utilised his strengths to expose other teams, now we've left him on an island. We have known for weeks what teams are doing to Cripps, if not most of the season, yet what have we done to counter it? Who blocks for Cripps so he can run through the contest? Who is handing over to track his man like we did last season? Who is his reliable first receiver? Not Curnow, Kennedy or Hewett, that's for sure, they're all limited outside players and not first receiver types.

I know everyone will say how can you have a player who needs cover and help etc. but it's not new, especially in todays AFL. Oliver, Petracca, Martin, Daicos, Fyfe (in the past), and many others are 1 way mids. But they have structure around them and set up for them to be the attackers to the ball and structure up to cover if they don't win possession. We are leaving Cripps to try and win the ball without support with taggers on him then not covering him when he doesn't win it.

Heck it was exactly the same with Judd and Ablett, both didn't track back and were easily run off. Teams did it all the time to them.

Imo Cripps' form is a symptom and not the cause. FWIW he's only averaging 1 possession fewer than last yr, is averaging more tackles, more contested possessions and only .7 fewer clearances and .07 fewer goal assists. The major difference is goals - 0.95 per game to .09 per game. He's far and away our best contested/clearance player and only 2nd in Walsh in a few other outside categories. The idea that Hewett and Kennedy can do his role just as well is laughable. Kennedy is an average player - we need to accept this now, we've had him for a long time and he's never been reliable, if anything he should be trade bait, but wouldn't get us much - and Hewett has returned to his career mean, a good average role player. Nothing wrong with that, but nowhere close to Cripps level.

Our list management got it wrong we went one way while the competition went the other and nothing to do with talent or performance.
Setterfield and Stocker are gone and you can add Dow to that list of players you mentioned we are superfluous in this area it's unbalancing our list.
The question is which of those players that you mentioned has the best trade value?
Which one creates the best cap relief to go after what we need?

 

[Michael Jezz]

There were many that wanted Cripps traded a year before he had his best season ever, yeah?

Whether it's Voss or another coach, where Cripps understands his role within the team, then he should stay and embrace those changes.

If he doesn't want to embrace those changes to make the team great, or wants out, then you facilitate a trade

This goes for any player on the list

I wanted a Cripps trade considered a year before "his" best year could not get us to finals. Why? because the market would have over paid. Cripps is a good player but half as good as the competition and our supporters thinks he is.

 

[The Bighouse]

Strong, big bodied and is easily our best extractor of the ball. If he could just focus on that and allow better runners/users of the ball that would be ideal. I see Cerra as our best runner/user of the ball out of the middle. If we could get another fast mid with good foot skills to compliment Cripps that would make us a much better balanced mid group.

Cerra’s kicking is not where it is supposed to be for a good user of the footy.

 

[bmaurizio]

If Cripps is disgruntled and would like to move, a top 10 pick in the 2023 cohort wound be a good return, my favorites are Watson, Dursma, Caddy, Lorenz all sparkling talents with a decade of exciting footy ahead of them.

 

[HarryFlashman]

Cerra’s kicking is not where it is supposed to be for a good user of the footy.

Think you’re right, it looks better than it is, in-part as everyone else is bloody woeful atm.
He’s kicking is good but after seeing what Blakey was doing to us, theres a few levels between Cerra and an elite top tier kick.

 

[Arr0w]

I wanted a Cripps trade considered a year before "his" best year could not get us to finals. Why? because the market would have over paid. Cripps is a good player but half as good as the competition and our supporters thinks he is.

I disagree. You don't pin finishing positions on one player, one that certainly played his part in trying to get us to finals last year

 

[Accidental genius]

Cerra’s kicking is not where it is supposed to be for a good user of the footy.

who is our best user of the ball from mids?

Walsh loves to bomb it long. I dont see him pinning passes into f50.

Hewetts kicks are up and unders with no real penetration.

Kennedy is probably our best kick (accuracy and penetration) but he isnt as mobile as Cerra.

Ideally we draft/trade a decent mid this off season.

 

[macky99]

I wanted a Cripps trade considered a year before "his" best year could not get us to finals. Why? because the market would have over paid. Cripps is a good player but half as good as the competition and our supporters thinks he is.

He was top 3 in the competition last season, he has been off this year, but most of our best players are in the same boat, as supporters we have no answers as to why this is the case, probably unfair to single out one player.

Unless Cripps wants to go back to WA this decision would do more damage than good.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

I think we have to try pay another club to take Jack Martin

21

Jack Martin

Age

29

Ht

186cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.2

4star

K

10.0

4star

HB

6.3

4star

M

4.9

5star

T

3.7

5star

G

0.9

4star

D

14.9

4star

K

7.9

3star

HB

7.0

4star

M

4.3

4star

T

3.6

4star

G

1.1

5star

D

8.2

2star

K

4.6

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.0

4star

G

0.6

3star

off our books.

Clearly now a list clogger at this point and a massive disappointment.

We have to stop paying ridiculous money for the likes of McGovern (whom I like) and Martin etc.

Our salary cap management can and should be managed better going forwards imo

I have gone cold on us getting Gresham, I think he is too injury prone for the amount of money he wants. Let Hawthorn pay a King's Ransom for him.

We have no Mid Season Draft pick this season, partly due to no cap space/flexibility on our list..

I want the whole board and Cookie to do a serious review into our Salary Cap and player payment structure over the off season, we need changes in that department (as well as the line of thinking we have to buy/recruit a big name player from another club every or every 2nd year)

 

[ray8182]

I think we have to try pay another club to take Jack Martin

21

Jack Martin

Age

29

Ht

186cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.2

4star

K

10.0

4star

HB

6.3

4star

M

4.9

5star

T

3.7

5star

G

0.9

4star

D

14.9

4star

K

7.9

3star

HB

7.0

4star

M

4.3

4star

T

3.6

4star

G

1.1

5star

D

8.2

2star

K

4.6

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.0

4star

G

0.6

3star

off our books.

Clearly now a list clogger at this point and a massive disappointment.

We have to stop paying ridiculous money for the likes of McGovern (whom I like) and Martin etc.

Our salary cap management can and should be managed better going forwards imo

I have gone cold on us getting Gresham, I think he is too injury prone for the amount of money he wants. Let Hawthorn pay a King's Ransom for him.

We have no Mid Season Draft pick this season, partly due to no cap space/flexibility on our list..

I want the whole board and Cookie to do a serious review into our Salary Cap and player payment structure over the off season, we need changes in that department (as well as the line of thinking we have to buy/recruit a big name player from another club every or every 2nd year)

Fair chance no club would take jack Martin. Doesn’t play enough football. If a club takes him it’s high risk they are just wasting a list spot. His career is nearly over.


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[Elmer_Hauser]

Fair chance no club would take jack Martin. Doesn’t play enough football. If a club takes him it’s high risk they are just wasting a list spot. His career is nearly over.


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Imagine if we gave up a first round pick for him.

One of the most disappointingly underwhelming players I have seen in Navy Blue (and I have seen plenty in the last 20 years to last a century)

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

who is our best user of the ball from mids?

Walsh loves to bomb it long. I dont see him pinning passes into f50.

Hewetts kicks are up and unders with no real penetration.

Kennedy is probably our best kick (accuracy and penetration) but he isnt as mobile as Cerra.

Ideally we draft/trade a decent mid this off season.

Id be happy to see Kennedy take the Cripps role in midfield and move Cripps up forward as a third tall, a 90/10 forward midfield split.

 

[BrisbaneCFC]

I think we have to try pay another club to take Jack Martin off our books.

Clearly now a list clogger at this point and a massive disappointment.

We have to stop paying ridiculous money for the likes of McGovern (whom I like) and Martin etc.

Our salary cap management can and should be managed better going forwards imo

I have gone cold on us getting Gresham, I think he is too injury prone for the amount of money he wants. Let Hawthorn pay a King's Ransom for him.

We have no Mid Season Draft pick this season, partly due to no cap space/flexibility on our list..

I want the whole board and Cookie to do a serious review into our Salary Cap and player payment structure over the off season, we need changes in that department (as well as the line of thinking we have to buy/recruit a big name player from another club every or every 2nd year)

Still think he's in our best 22. Played out of the goal square.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Still think he's in our best 22. Played out of the goal square.

I politely disagree.

He just doesn't work hard enough or get enough of the ball, and we should back our younger, more dedicated and hard working small forwards we have now (even if sometimes they struggle which they have been lately, at least they apply themselves and keep chasing and tackling etc)

 

[Sin City]

Still think he's in our best 22. Played out of the goal square.

Best 22 easily when he’s healthy. That’s hardly ever though and less and less each year.

 

[DangerousD]

I would rather have JH-F (on this year's form) at Carlton, than all of the 3 players the Crows got with those picks they offered North (including Rachele)

Despite some controversial off field stuff and his transfer to Port, Horne-Francis is a winner type of player who does actually contribute to significant scoreboard damage to opposition teams too (his goal assist ability is outstanding)

Just so everyone is clear Elmer.

You think JHF alone is better than Rachele, Dawson and Rankine?

Rankine 21 goals this year.
Rachele 14 goals and 18 possessions per game this year
Dawson averaging 28 possessions

JHF 20 possessions and 0.5 goals per game

If I had a red card, I’d show it to you.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Just so everyone is clear Elmer.

You think JHF alone is better than Rachele, Dawson and Rankine?

If I had a red card, I’d show it to you.

The Crows gave up their 2nd round pick for Dawson, not one of the first picks they offered North for JH-F FWIW

BTW, I still believe in hindsight (and given what we have seen of JH-F this season) the Crows would still do that trade

 

[DangerousD]

Don’t know how accurate it is but Dawson went to crows on a five-year deal worth $650,000 per year back in 2021. Where can we get one of those and at that price? Kid is a gun.

For a pick in the teens

 

[DangerousD]

The Crows gave up their 2nd round pick for Dawson, not one of the first picks they offered North for JH-F FWIW

BTW, I still believe in hindsight (and given what we have seen of JH-F this season) the Crows would still do that trade

Dawson was traded for a future first tied to melb, not a second rounder

Adelaide made the enormous bid this week, putting pick 4 on the table along with their 2022 first-round pick and Melbourne’s 2022 first-round pick, acquired this week.

Quote from fox footy

 

[Bletch]

5pm deadline today for any changes to list prior to MSD. Currently, we do not have a pick. If we make a change (player on to LTI list, or retirement), we'll have pick 6. Seems unlikely at this stage.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Dawson was traded for a future first tied to melb, not a second rounder

Adelaide made the enormous bid this week, putting pick 4 on the table along with their 2022 first-round pick and Melbourne’s 2022 first-round pick, acquired this week.

Quote from fox footy

Ah okay, happy to concede that you were right and I was wrong

Still rate JH-F very highly though and Port will have no regrets what they gave up for him (which quite possibly could be unders)

Horne-Francis is an interesting cat, but no doubt has a winning mentality/strong desire to win, which I wish most of our players had ...

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

We have no Mid Season Draft pick this season, partly due to no cap space/flexibility on our list..

You do realise that base rookie contracts are paid outside the salary cap under the current CBA? Only match payments and incentives fall within the cap.

No idea what you mean by 'flexibility on our list'.....the reality is that if we had a spot on our list due to an LTI, we would have a pick in the mid season draft. And it's just our 'luck' that this year we have pick #6 in the draft, and all of our perpetually injured players are off the injury list, so we have no spots available. Bloody Russell should be sacked!!

Possibly the one saving grace this year is that apart from Maric - who should go at pick #1 - there doesn't appear to be many clear stand outs compared to previous years....if you go by media reports and discussion on the main board.

 

[The Bighouse]

who is our best user of the ball from mids?

Walsh loves to bomb it long. I dont see him pinning passes into f50.

Hewetts kicks are up and unders with no real penetration.

Kennedy is probably our best kick (accuracy and penetration) but he isnt as mobile as Cerra.

Ideally we draft/trade a decent mid this off season.

It certainly ain’t Acres…

We’re bereft of foot skills throughout.
Boyd is the best kick in the side but doesn’t get it enough. Charlie & Durds (failing this year) are reasonable kicks along with MK.

LOB is more miss than hit with his left peg.

 

[4flagsin5yrs]

Imagine if we gave up a first round pick for him.

One of the most disappointingly underwhelming players I have seen in Navy Blue (and I have seen plenty in the last 20 years to last a century)

I'm ok that Martin has no trade value - he needs to get fit and play good footy for us as he's taken a lot of money so far for zilch output.

 

[Accidental genius]

I'm ok that Martin has no trade value - he needs to get fit and play good footy for us as he's taken a lot of money so far for zilch output.

Chances of that happening is??