List Mgmt. 2024 List Mismanagement and Trading

[119others]

Circumstances are very very different but.

very true and I dont think Dees will get a second rounder straight up (either returning theirs from last years McAdam trade OR our own for 2025). I was saying his relative value IMO would be higher than McAdam - and both are similar age - but as you say things are different re some personal issues needing a homecoming (the one time teams generally helping loyal long standing players out to achieve their family goals and often means trading for unders).

I like the idea of Gollant being part of the trade. Probably not a straight swap though and we may need to slightly upgrade one of their other picks or chuck in a third rounder (ideally next years when we dont need points for Welsh). We dont need Gollant with Welsh and probably Luko joining us. Berg is actually a more needed back up player as TT replacement.

 

[Vader]

Not playing for the future is shit list management. Hell, Lukosius can spend all of 2025 in the SANFL and go on Thilthorpe's strength program provided he only cost us a F2.

Why on Earth would he agree to be traded to Adelaide, if that was the plan? This is one of the dumbest ideas posted on BF in a long time.

 

[Crow till I die]

very true and I dont think Dees will get a second rounder straight up (either returning theirs from last years McAdam trade OR our own for 2025). I was saying his relative value IMO would be higher than McAdam - and both are similar age - but as you say things are different re some personal issues needing a homecoming (the one time teams generally helping loyal long standing players out to achieve their family goals and often means trading for unders).

I like the idea of Gollant being part of the trade. Probably not a straight swap though and we may need to slightly upgrade one of their other picks or chuck in a third rounder (ideally next years when we dont need points for Welsh). We dont need Gollant with Welsh and probably Luko joining us. Berg is actually a more needed back up player as TT replacement.

Gollant + F3 for ANB? It would work for us and may suit them as they get a forward half player that they need and might thrive in a different organisation

 

[Vader]

Young Gallagher must be under some pressure to retain his spot for any more than his current contract.

I have seen little improvement and his AFL skills have not improved much since seasons start.

His handball technique is poor and needs considerable work.. Is he willing to do this? I thought this would be something he could get under control within a season.

His kicking is OK but not at AFL level. Very loopy and soft shoe.

He runs to the wrong positions on the ground to get the ball and is struggling to get more than 4-8 possessions per game.

He looks totally foreign when he is out on the field.

He needs to work bloody hard over the summer and if he is not prepared to do this the club and he should think of parting ways.

He's a Cat B rookie, so he's not fighting with anyone else for a position on the list - and his salary is outside the cap.

In his case, it all depends on whether they can see an AFL future for him, having had a good 12 months to see what he's capable of (or not). The other list management forces, which are at play for every other player, are not relevant where he is concerned.

 

[ABAB]

Why on Earth would he agree to be traded to Adelaide, if that was the plan? This is one of the dumbest ideas posted on BF in a long time.

Because Lukosius can see he will be in the VFL for more than a year until his contract end and why a F2 is being reported in the media.

 

[Vader]

If Luko does nominate us (which I'm still not confident on) I reckon it takes pick 27 and a F2. Which probably means we need to fork out some extra trade value for ANB, Berry being the obvious candidate. Would people be willing to essentially straight swap Berry for ANB?

I'm not convinced, still think we're lacking a defensive midfielder in our future mids setup with Bez. His form to end the season is going to be very indicative of what we do with him.

On what basis do you think Luko is worth 2x 2nd round picks?

He's a flaky, soft, player who is on the outer with his current coach, and GC need to get rid of his salary for other inbound trades. I don't see any reason why he should cost us more than 1x 2nd round pick, and I'd be pushing hard for a Bowes-like trade if we agree to take his whole salary off their hands.

 

[Vader]

Because Lukosius can see he will be in the VFL for more than a year until his contract end and why a F2 is being reported in the media.

That's a reason for him to want out of GC. It's not a reason for him to choose Adelaide.

 

[skam85]

If Keane or Berry leave, what we get for them is what we will send over for ANB

If we can flip them both plus change and we end up with ANB and Luko, start the car.

 

[Hodgy]

On what basis do you think Luko is worth 2x 2nd round picks?

He's a flaky, soft, player who is on the outer with his current coach, and GC need to get rid of his salary for other inbound trades. I don't see any reason why he should cost us more than 1x 2nd round pick, and I'd be pushing hard for a Bowes-like trade if we agree to take his whole salary off their hands.

If they are desperate to free up his salary then why wouldn’t this be like Jack Bowes. Coincidently they have pick 8ish this year as well which they will have to move in case of a bid coming earlier.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

If Walker is going to retire mid-season, then he should be retiring NOW. If we re-sign him, it has to be on the assumption (and his agreement) that he will play the entirety of the 2025 season.

We can't go into 2025 assuming that players will be injured, or retire early. That's just plain stupid. We can (and should) plan for contingencies where those things happen, but those contingencies should never be our Plan A.

The simple fact is that 4 into 3 doesn't go, and we would face serious problems if players don't get injured. That's not good list management.

Disagree

Good clubs have competition for spots and also aren’t shy of playing guys with big reputations in the 2s

As long as everyone is on board with the direction then it’s very good for the club

Not just talking about tex either , if anyone is seriously out of form or carrying injuries inhibiting them then they don’t play

 

[Jeffcrowe]

If Keane or Berry leave, what we get for them is what we will send over for ANB

If we can flip them both plus change and we end up with ANB and Luko, start the car.

Prefer to keep at least one of those and I’d be looking at Gollant and / or Jones instead

 

[skam85]

Prefer to keep at least one of those and I’d be looking at Gollant and / or Jones instead

Absolutely, but they're the two most likely to leave.
Gollant I doubt gets much at all at the trade table, if anything. Clubs would more likely take him as a DFA

 

[George Kramer]

Sid Draper
Alex Dodson
Jack Lukosius
Alex Neal-Bullen
Isaac Cumming




Make it happen.

What’s more likely, these ins or Murphy dropped for Rankine?

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Absolutely, but they're the two most likely to leave.
Gollant I doubt gets much at all at the trade table, if anything. Clubs would more likely take him as a DFA

Agree

 

[Vader]

Disagree

Good clubs have competition for spots and also aren’t shy of playing guys with big reputations in the 2s

As long as everyone is on board with the direction then it’s very good for the club

Not just talking about tex either , if anyone is seriously out of form or carrying injuries inhibiting them then they don’t play

We certainly have players who exist on our list as depth coverage - Strachan & Himmelberg are perfect examples. Both are competent, without threatening to become AFL regulars, but who can step up and perform at AFL level if the need arises.

Fog, Thilthorpe, Walker & Luko are not this type of player.

One of Luko's main reasons for wanting out of GC is because he can see himself spending a lot more time in the VFL, while Hardwick remains coach at GC. Why on earth would he agree to a trade to Adelaide, if there's an expectation that he'll be spending a lot of time in the SANFL? This just makes no sense whatsoever. It's a complete logic fail.

 

[ABAB]

That's a reason for him to want out of GC. It's not a reason for him to choose Adelaide.

Why not? He is from Adelaide and also a Crows supporter, same as Rankine.

 

[Mutineer]

Because Lukosius can see he will be in the VFL for more than a year until his contract end and why a F2 is being reported in the media.

You're reading way too much into it I think.

Wasnt it reported somewhere that Lukosius dropped himself by mutual agreement with Hardwick to "re-focus" hence why he didn't play at either level on the weekend?

 

[Vader]

Why not? He is from Adelaide and also a Crows supporter, same as Rankine.

Why TF would he do it? Just because he's a Crows supporter isn't a reason.

He wants out of GC because he doesn't want to spend large chunks of the season playing in the VFL. Why then would he move to a club where he's likely to spend large chunks of the season playing in the SANFL? It's an epic logic failure.

Surely he'd opt instead for a club where he's likely to spend the entire season playing in the AFL.

 

[ABAB]

You're reading way too much into it I think.

Wasnt it reported somewhere that Lukosius dropped himself by mutual agreement with Hardwick to "re-focus" hence why he didn't play at either level on the weekend?

Hardwick said it in his press conference after the Essendon game when questioned by a reporter, maybe Lukosius did after meeting with Nicks on the same week.

 

[BRL121]

You're reading way too much into it I think.

Wasnt it reported somewhere that Lukosius dropped himself by mutual agreement with Hardwick to "re-focus" hence why he didn't play at either level on the weekend?

Yes, but Luko dropped himself to the seconds, while Hardwick suggested he not play at all.

 

[ABAB]

Why TF would he do it? Just because he's a Crows supporter isn't a reason.

He wants out of GC because he doesn't want to spend large chunks of the season playing in the VFL. Why then would he move to a club where he's likely to spend large chunks of the season playing in the SANFL? It's an epic logic failure.

Surely he'd opt instead for a club where he's likely to spend the entire season playing in the AFL.

I also said he is from Adelaide as the main reason and being a Crow supporter secondary and he probably does see a better future here than at GCS after Walker retire.

 

[ABAB]

Yes, but Luko dropped himself to the seconds, while Hardwick suggested he not play at all.

Definitely a very passive aggressive move by Hardwick, before saying that he was talking about players pushing for spot in the VFL.

 

[Vader]

I also said he is from Adelaide as the main reason and being a Crow supporter secondary and he probably does see a better future here than at GCS after Walker retire.

Yes, he's from Adelaide... but once again, he's not going to sign for the AFC unless we're able/willing to tell him that he'll be playing every game in the AFL.

... and he's not going to be willing to put his AFL career on hold for 12 months, while the AFC waits for Walker to retire.

 

[ClaudeCurlsCrow]

Sid Draper
Alex Dodson
Jack Lukosius
Alex Neal-Bullen
Isaac Cumming




Make it happen.

5 players in... who are we delisting or trading...
berry - trade
himmelberg - trade
gollant - trade/ delist
mchenry - trade/ delist
keane - trade

parnell, hamill and borlase are rookies

burgess? walker? bond?

 

[Mutineer]

Why TF would he do it? Just because he's a Crows supporter isn't a reason.

He wants out of GC because he doesn't want to spend large chunks of the season playing in the VFL. Why then would he move to a club where he's likely to spend large chunks of the season playing in the SANFL? It's an epic logic failure.

Surely he'd opt instead for a club where he's likely to spend the entire season playing in the AFL.

I think you're reading too much into it as well, in his whole time at the Suns Lukosius has played 1 VFL/NEAFL game in 2022 when returning from a PCL injury that saw him miss 8 weeks of AFL.