Preview 2024 Rd 19 Carlton vs North Melbourne Sunday 21st July 4:40PM AEST @ Marvel Stadium

[Aphrodite]

Final Team is in …


4 changes

UPDATE: 20th June:-

IN: SAM DURDIN
OUT: CALEB MARCHBANK (Illness)

AFL team news: Blues back speed, Boyd out through injury

Carlton has made four changes for the clash with North Melbourne.

www.carltonfc.com.au

MILESTONE: Adam Cerra 50 Carlton games

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I wouldn't mind a look at Durdin before he gets delisted. One of my bugbears is listing players for several years and then delisting without even having a proper look at the top level. Never die wondering..

1 game in 2022 right after we nabbed him in the MSD. No Weitering, no McGovern. Just Young and Plowman next to him.

 

[Blue Reaper]

If my fellow community members want to emoji troll me, I'd prefer they gave me the respect of having a discussion. Just saying. That's what we are here for.

Hear, hear ODN!

Juvenile emoji trolling and accusing posters of ‘melts’ is simple-minded obtuseness. This is meant to be a discussion community.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

If you have a loose interceptor then you want someone with great disposal skills, and Gov has that

I'm actually a fan of Gov, so I'm not having a shot at him. It's just that he plays a role where he often doesn't have to defend.

 

[Doro]

1 game in 2022 right after we nabbed him in the MSD. No Weitering, no McGovern. Just Young and Plowman next to him.

Yes, 1 game and from memory not many minutes before getting injured. Kind of my point, headed for the cut and hasn't had a look in the ones to make an informed call.

 

[WyntersGame_]

It feels like Marchbank is being every opportunity to hold down a spot. Whether thats due to him retiring at years end and wanting to give him a finals chance, or because Weitering does have a say on who he thinks is more compatible as a defensive unit.

I just hope they are not getting caught up in the romantics of that thought process (retiring after a potential medal), and that they are not chosing him based on what he could have been, if injuries hadn't damaged his career.

Unfortunately I think the game has just gone past him and his injuries have had a major play in that

In every game this year he has looked sloppy and his opponent has turned him inside out to the point he is being exposed badly

Like every time he plays I hope he excels, but so far he has fallen flat this year

Fingers this game is different

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Not unusual, being the deepest defender and most likely the organiser, he'd know who was playing their role better than most

There is no case that can be made for Marchbank playing his role better than Kemp this season. Eye test or statistically.

 

[Bundy Bear Bogan]

Marchy surviving is a act of God....
Oh wait. Was thinking of someone else........

Too soon

 

[Arr0w]

That seems quite generalised. When a high ball comes in and a pack forms, you're suggesting that he needs to stay down and body his opponent, when he is usually on the main target? You'd crucify him if he didn't go up.

Incidentally, across their careers, in contested defensive one on one losses, Kemp is 34.1%, and Marchbank's is 33.8%.

This season, Kemp is 30.8% and Marchbank is 80%. Kemp also averages 4.3 spoils per game to Marchbank 2.7%.

At some point, some stats have to make a lie of the eye test. Certain errors stand out in the memory and multiply in the mind over time.

80% in one on one defensive losses ... sheesh. Even I had no idea it was that bad.

I'm not suggesting he should stay down and body an opponent everytime, it was merely examples.

Each defensive situation is different and should be played on its merit, within and in conjunction with defensive unit

I don't think he has a natural defensive IQ

It's why I said at the start to place stats to one side

This is more about decision making, no stat for that, just vision

 

[JustOneTime]

That seems quite generalised. When a high ball comes in and a pack forms, you're suggesting that he needs to stay down and body his opponent, when he is usually on the main target? You'd crucify him if he didn't go up.

Incidentally, across their careers, in contested defensive one on one losses, Kemp is 34.1%, and Marchbank's is 33.8%.

This season, Kemp is 30.8% and Marchbank is 80%. Kemp also averages 4.3 spoils per game to Marchbank 2.7%.

At some point, some stats have to make a lie of the eye test. Certain errors stand out in the memory and multiply in the mind over time.

80% in one on one defensive losses ... sheesh. Even I had no idea it was that bad.

The defensive 1 on 1 stats are crap. If Kemp follows hogan into a pack and loses or falls over this is not considered a 1 on 1 loss.

If Kemp is standing Hogan before the high ball comes in he is accountable to stop Hogan as best he can. In any normal persons eyes. CD's version is a half useless rating that is used for different purposes of evaluation.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Yes, 1 game and from memory not many minutes before getting injured. Kind of my point, headed for the cut and hasn't had a look in the ones to make an informed call.

He played 75% so if he got injured, it would have been fairly late. I don't remember the matchups in that game. It was Richmond and Lynch kicked 3 so I assume Sam got that deeper option and Young followed Riewoldt.

 

[Arr0w]

There is no case that can be made for Marchbank playing his role better than Kemp this season. Eye test or statistically.

We all see things differently, no one is right or wrong in this case, it's an opinion

 

[Doro]

He played 75% so if he got injured, it would have been fairly late. I don't remember the matchups in that game. It was Richmond and Lynch kicked 3 so I assume Sam got that deeper option and Young followed Riewoldt.

I'd have to watch it again, but thought he went OK, got injured and that was that for seniors footy.

 

[gab213]

I'm less concerned with Kemp being omitted than I am with him continually being played in a position that doesn't suit him.

I think that he is possibly a star of the future but that isn't as a backman. I think it's damaging to his development. He's better off getting some games into him as a third tall forward in the reserves and getting some confidence in his own abilities.

What all this talk tells me is that we are still in desperate need of a quality second KPD and none of those currently on our list fill that need.

This has to be a major target for us in the coming off season.

 

[JustOneTime]

Do you like any carlton player?

Walsh, Weitering, Cerra (rate highly), Hewett, Saad (love), Acres, Williams, Charlie (love), Mackay, Martin, Motlop, E Hollands, O Hollands.

Above are my favourites. When we win I talk about them. When we lose, I talk about the others.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I'm not suggesting he should stay down and body an opponent everytime, it was merely examples.

Each defensive situation is different and should be played on its merit, within and in conjunction with defensive unit

I don't think he has a natural defensive IQ

It's why I said at the start to place stats to one side

This is more about decision making, no stat for that, just vision

I agree that he's not a perfect option and if he is going to be known as a key defender, he is open to criticism as a key defender. I just can't abide by Marchbank being considered better on recent performance. He has been failing to impact contests, pushed off the line just as easily and has dropped way more marks. The reason Kemp hangs off his opponent is that his leap is an attribute and because he is giving away height so often, he needs room to leap and impact. Unfortunately, that looks bad if he is buffeted on the way through or the pack collapses under him.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I'm less concerned with Kemp being omitted than I am with him continually being played in a position that doesn't suit him.

I think that he is possibly a star of the future but that isn't as a backman. I think it's damaging to his development. He's better off getting some games into him as a third tall forward in the reserves and getting some confidence in his own abilities.

What all this talk tells me is that we are still in desperate need of a quality second KPD and none of those currently on our list fill that need.

This has to be a major target for us in the coming off season.

100% this. Kemp is a utility and we have pigeon holed him as an undersized key defender.

As I said, I hope he gets a fit for purpose gig elsewhere. We are diminishing his value.

 

[F_therest]

Wouldnt be surprised if Durdin played, and the coaches want a look at Weiters, Marchy and Durds. Maybe to free Weiters up a little bit? Kemp has been really poor the last few weeks, so I sort of get the omission. Could also just be us trying a different look

We've had a problem with the 2nd tall for a while now.

Would be huge if Durdin is good enough to just do a lock down role.

Free up Weitering to intercept more and not be dragged as a decoy.

The Gov as fit the 3rd tall.

That way we arent relying on Kemp or Marchy to defend a tall, strong forward. Both have shown to be a weakness in our defence.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I'd have to watch it again, but thought he went OK, got injured and that was that for seniors footy.

That was my memory too. He went okay considering how weak our defense was generally with all the outs.

Sort of reminded me of the role Oscar McDonald played for us in his 1 full game with us. He played 5 officially, 2 he was injured in, and as a sub who never got used.

A solid dour tall that enabled Weitering to get creative.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

We've had a problem with the 2nd tall for a while now.

Would be huge if Durdin is good enough to just do a lock down role.

Free up Weitering to intercept more and not be dragged as a decoy.

The Gov as fit the 3rd tall.

That way we arent relying on Kemp or Marchy to defend a tall, strong forward. Both have shown to be a weakness in our defence.

Agreed. I'd like to see Kemp on a medium forward or an undersized key forward more often. He has the pace and athleticism, and also aggression to make a fist of it.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

We all see things differently, no one is right or wrong in this case, it's an opinion

Yeah, but I'm happy to flesh our my opinions with what my eyes tell me and what the statistics tell me. I love the cut and thrust.

 

[DEliades]

Pitto, Cotts and Carroll drop out.

Cunningham sub. Final bench of Hewett, Boyd, Durdin and Owies

 

[LanceRomance]

When have we last lost a game vs 17th?

in fact - this is precisely the kind of game we win...

What were Adelaide when they beat us?

 

[GoBlues!]

That seems quite generalised. When a high ball comes in and a pack forms, you're suggesting that he needs to stay down and body his opponent, when he is usually on the main target? You'd crucify him if he didn't go up.

Incidentally, across their careers, in contested defensive one on one losses, Kemp is 34.1%, and Marchbank's is 33.8%.

This season, Kemp is 30.8% and Marchbank is 80%. Kemp also averages 4.3 spoils per game to Marchbank 2.7%.

At some point, some stats have to make a lie of the eye test. Certain errors stand out in the memory and multiply in the mind over time.

80% in one on one defensive losses ... sheesh. Even I had no idea it was that bad.

I never understood the high regard Marchbank had with selectors and some supporters. A lot of references to how well he played in the prelim last year - but not a lot since then or before tbh.

Based on current form feels like Voss and MC wanting to prove something by giving him another go. Maybe they want to see Sam Durdin and Weiters as the KPD anchors and Marchbank to play a roaming interceptor role which might suit him better than one on one defending.

 

[gab213]

What were Adelaide when they beat us?

That was early in the season, you cant really compare that to a team that is clearly bottom 2 after 18 rounds.

 

[carlton_99]

Pitto, Cotts and Carroll drop out.

Cunningham sub. Final bench of Hewett, Boyd, Durdin and Owies

Is this your opinion or what you have heard - because this would mean 4 changes overall not 3