Coach Alastair Clarkson IV - HFC Racism Investigation Discussion

[The Warlord]

The Riolis had context and took it as such. As The Warlord said, it was the final straw for them, not a single remark that from someone else in a different context might have been seen differently.

Ironically Shannyn Ah-Sam Rioli said at the time Clarkson would come out with the odd "uneducated" comment but could never be considered racist because if his body of work.

I can actually imagine Clarko making that same comment

 

[Samsquanch]

Very good news. Basically means the extent of Clarkos involvement will be as a witness with no findings against him, Fagan or Burt. Purely against hawthorn.

Purely against hawthorn.



Bloody Jeff.

 

[giantroo]

 

[The Warlord]

Offical

 

[The Warlord]

You're a bloody good man Cyril Rioli

 

[Samsquanch]

I am checking on the ABC News web site for the full set of sordid details. By tonight this will be all over the news on every channel. Might even displace Kar-marler Harris as the lead story.

 

[Grogg]

Assumed the argument will be around lack of governance. Insufficient support and education for frontline staff along with cultural insensitivity displayed by the upper echelons of the organisation ergo systemic racism albeit it unintentional.

That would be pretty hard to refute I'd imagine.

 

[Passmore]

You're a bloody good man Cyril Rioli

He can work with our NT academy.....

Sent from my SM-A908B using Tapatalk

 

[justroyal]

But how can they not be mentioned if they were originally mentioned? Or is this saying the Rioli’s haven’t mentioned them, perhaps another family might?

 

[Makeshift Park]

I am checking on the ABC News web site for the full set of sordid details. By tonight this will be all over the news on every channel. Might even displace Kar-marler Harris as the lead story.

Somehow I suspect it won’t usurp the olympics and Washington

Former AFL premiership star Cyril Rioli launches fresh court challenge against Hawthorn Football Club over alleged racism

Rioli has lodged a racism claim in the Federal Court on behalf of his wife and other former First Nations players.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Grogg]

But how can they not be mentioned if they were originally mentioned? Or is this saying the Rioli’s haven’t mentioned them, perhaps another family might?

Rioli's claim is on behalf of himself, his wife Shannyn AhSam-Rioli and several others.

It's a joint action, so there won't be any more separate actions coming is how I read it.

 

[Hearts to hearts]

Assumed the argument will be around lack of governance. Insufficient support and education for frontline staff along with cultural insensitivity displayed by the upper echelons of the organisation ergo systemic racism albeit it unintentional.

That would be pretty hard to refute I'd imagine.

Procedurally it might be against the club but if it finds all that, it will not reflect well on people who were in leadership positions at the time - doesn’t seem like an opportunity to start gloating or pretending Clarko, Fagan and Burt are absolved by this move. It seems good that it’s targeting the bigger system and not just some individuals, but that doesn’t remove any individuals from the picture. Plus it would be better to wait and see what actually is said and found than jump to conclusions (having criticised plenty of people for doing that last time).

 

[Samsquanch]

checking on the ABC News web site

Former AFL premiership star Cyril Rioli launches fresh court challenge against Hawthorn Football Club over alleged racism

Rioli has lodged a racism claim in the Federal Court on behalf of his wife and other former First Nations players.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Grogg]

Procedurally it might be against the club but if it finds all that, it will not reflect well on people who were in leadership positions at the time - doesn’t seem like an opportunity to start gloating or pretending Clarko, Fagan and Burt are absolved by this move. It seems good that it’s targeting the bigger system and not just some individuals, but that doesn’t remove any individuals from the picture. Plus it would be better to wait and see what actually is said and found than jump to conclusions (having criticised plenty of people for doing that last time).

Agreed. Lots to play out yet and whilst today's action relieves a little more pressure on the individuals, it in no way absolves them completely of what transpired. The eventual judgement will be interesting and I'd love a Delorean to see how it plays out eventually. Either way, Hawthorn are going to need a large cheque book.

 

[Hatchy1992]

What I imagine will happen will be payouts to the applicants and orders of a do better report or similar and an order to employ an Indigenous welfare officer or similar if they don't already.

 

[BigRedRoo]

What I imagine will happen will be payouts to the applicants and orders of a do better report or similar and an order to employ an Indigenous welfare officer or similar if they don't already.

I don't think there is a snowflakes chance in Hell of that happening.
The two independent legal reports both came to the same conclusions.
There was nothing alleged that could be substantiated and their was no sub-culture of Racism at Hawthorn at the time.
The complainants will most likely be stuck will a large legal bill and little else.
Hawthorn might make another offer of a go away payment, but I highly doubt there are any apologies coming forward at this stage or they would have already occurred.

All clubs already employ Indigenous welfare officers full time.

 

[Hatchy1992]

I don't think there is a snowflakes chance in Hell of that happening.
The two independent legal reports both came to the same conclusions.
There was nothing alleged that could be substantiated and their was no sub-culture of Racism at Hawthorn at the time.
The complainants will most likely be stuck will a large legal bill and little else.
Hawthorn might make another offer of a go away payment, but I highly doubt there are any apologies coming forward at this stage or they would have already occurred.

All clubs already employ Indigenous welfare officers full time.

Yep, well definitely the players and partners will be left with a decent sum of money though.

 

[ChairmanZia]

Agreed. Lots to play out yet and whilst today's action relieves a little more pressure on the individuals, it in no way absolves them completely of what transpired. The eventual judgement will be interesting and I'd love a Delorean to see how it plays out eventually. Either way, Hawthorn are going to need a large cheque book.

And this comes at a time when they are on the rise but one of their past great is suing the club.

 

[Gumble Frankieton]

I’m not sure that I can give a sound legal opinion on the state of play but I did have some Dennis Denuto level issues with a printer today. But is it just me noticing that one of the applicants named is the cousin of the bloke that penned the ‘independent’ report?

 

[The Warlord]

Assumed the argument will be around lack of governance. Insufficient support and education for frontline staff along with cultural insensitivity displayed by the upper echelons of the organisation ergo systemic racism albeit it unintentional.

That would be pretty hard to refute I'd imagine.

Especially if Clarko is on the stand agreeing with it all.

 

[Colby Cheer Squad]

I’m not sure that I can give a sound legal opinion on the state of play but I did have some Dennis Denuto level issues with a printer today. But is it just me noticing that one of the applicants named is the cousin of the bloke that penned the ‘independent’ report?

It was never an independent report. That Hawthorn commissioned the cousin of their Indigenous liaison officer at the time of the events to gather this report was an ill-considered but well-meaning plan to encourage the Indigenous families to cooperate. Presumably, they were concerned that if a qualified and truly independent investigator had been engaged, the families might not have agreed to be interviewed.They were probably right about that. They just found a poor solution.

 

[Gumble Frankieton]

It was never an independent report. That Hawthorn commissioned the cousin of their Indigenous liaison officer at the time of the events to gather this report was an ill-considered but well-meaning plan to encourage the Indigenous families to cooperate. Presumably, they were concerned that if a qualified and truly independent investigator had been engaged, the families might not have agreed to be interviewed.They were probably right about that. They just found a poor solution.

Yep, pretty much agree with you there.

My comments were more of a gentle poke at the media coverage of what was an obvious conflict of interest.

But then, given how rife conflicts of interest are in the footy world perhaps people in the footy industry just prefer to ignore it.

 

[Hearts to hearts]

Yep, pretty much agree with you there.

My comments were more of a gentle poke at the media coverage of what was an obvious conflict of interest.

But then, given how rife conflicts of interest are in the footy world perhaps people in the footy industry just prefer to ignore it.

The dynamics are really interesting.

 

[The Warlord]

I had long and impassioned discussions on the bain moard about this and one poster who was always worth listening to is South of the Yarra

I reckon where we are now is about right - in a proper court, with Cyril leading things and Hawthorn the club in the gun.

That's how all this started, with Cyril pissed off at the club and how it had dealt with indigenous issues, Kennett's awful comments having been the final straw.

Its been a long and arduous process but it has ended up looking like it will do something good.

One element that is utterly telling here is that as soon as Clarko and co can front the players and talk about it face to face, the end result is the coaches are no longer in the gun.

That tells us a great deal about Jackson's original "reporting" doesn't it.

 

[Hearts to hearts]

I had long and impassioned discussions on the bain moard about this and one poster who was always worth listening to is South of the Yarra

I reckon where we are now is about right - in a proper court, with Cyril leading things and Hawthorn the club in the gun.

That's how all this started, with Cyril pissed off at the club and how it had dealt with indigenous issues, Kennett's awful comments having been the final straw.

Its been a long and arduous process but it has ended up looking like it will do something good.

One element that is utterly telling here is that as soon as Clarko and co can front the players and talk about it face to face, the end result is the coaches are no longer in the gun.

That tells us a great deal about Jackson's original "reporting" does it.

I hadn’t looked at it that way but yes, after a detour into what Kennett and some other people at Hawthorn wanted it to be about, we are back where it started.