Mega Thread All things Heritier Lumumba (Good luck H. Thread closed)

[domin8tors]

If no trade for the GWS is possible perhaps Gartlett for Harry O, straight swap ?

 

[morgoth]

After what happened with Jonathon Hay I can't see anyone taking him.

If they do, it will be for a very late pick and we will pay a large part of his contract. Worth it to get him out of the joint. Must be hell having to deal with his bullshit.

 

[morgoth]

I can't help but be disappointed with the posts in this thread. HL is a man who has strong principles, and when people engage in conduct that offends those principles he feels compelled to make a stand. I see nothing wrong in that. I also see the benefit in blanket opposition to anything that is even remotely homophobic. It is only be challenging, and marginalising, those with homophobic, racist, sexist etc views that we can have a society where homophobia, racism and sexism are a thing of the past.

While I agree the defacing of the poster is at the low end of the scale in terms of homophobic behaviour, it does not mean it is acceptable, or that HL should not be acting against it. He is saying that no displays of homophobia are acceptable. I agree with him on this, and agree with him wanting the Club to do something about it. I think threatening to resign over it was going too far, but I also think he acknowledged that both by withdrawing from the resignation and via the carefully chosen words used by his manager.

I would like HL to stay, and I would like him to focus more of his passion on his football. When he was getting in the face of Barry Hall, running hard out of the backline, shutting down both smalls and talls in defence, he was an absolutely vital component of our success.

But its OK for gays to parody nuns, priests etc in the Mardi Gra? You give it, you take it. Remember when footy was about the actual game?

 

[psychosaints]

Why are we so quick to dump it on one of our own so quick? Not all football players are just that, H obviously has some issues outside of football. If the club and H think it's time to part ways then let's respect both parties. Until then to diss on of our own & allowing opposition supporters to take pot shots is pretty damn weak IMO.

What happened to sidebyside?

Again, not trolling. Your motto is 'side by side' but H beats to his own drum. He's only side by side when it suits him. Let him go.

 

[Buckley is my hero]

A key difference between Shaw and Lumumba is that Shaw had currency. Not sure Lumumba has that.

Both were contracted, and IIRC Shaw's trade required us to continue paying a portion of his salary.

If we can't find a trade for Lumumba, what happens then? Do we try to reconcile, or do we pay him out?

I would have thought that Lumumba has reached the point of no return and wouldn't imagine that there would be a reconcileration.
But on the bright side, he hasn't stuffed up with the law, he talks well, is highly emotionally charged and is still capable of playing good footy at 27.
There are 17 other coaches out there. It only takes one who sees Lumumba as a challenge and willing to take him on. His trade value depends on what that one willing coach is prepared to give up to to get Lumumba.

 

[DaVe86]

Clearly H has bigger issues than just footy and it is a situation we need to tread very carefully. Depression etc is a huge problem and you can't just cut a guy loose if he is suffering.

However, on the face of it H is a bigger problem than what he's worth. He had an ordinary year, and for the second year running has had a falling out with the coach.

If a player is a superstar, then you bend a bit for him. That's natural. But H is giving us little on field and problems off it.

It can't be healthy for the playing group.

Unfortunately, no one would want him, so we are probably going to keep him or he will walk. The only hope of facilitating a trade would be to Carlton. But can't even see he blues been interested to be honest.

 

[ipswichpies]

Good question. Back in the day Eddie would lock everyone who was potentially the leak in the boardroom and not let anyone out until the one who actually leaked the story owned up to it.

We leak like a sieve nowadays.

You are right we are leaking like a sieve and it is one of the most damaging and destabilizing things that can happen to a club,it makes you wonder who you can trust and whom you cannot.
It is bloody terrible how just about anything gets out about the club,I am all for openess but there has to be a limit I think.

 

[DaVe86]

Clearly H has bigger issues than just footy and it is a situation we need to tread very carefully. Depression etc is a huge problem and you can't just cut a guy loose if he is suffering.

However, on the face of it H is a bigger problem than what he's worth. He had an ordinary year, and for the second year running has had a falling out with the coach.

If a player is a superstar, then you bend a bit for him. That's natural. But H is giving us little on field and problems off it.

It can't be healthy for the playing group.

Unfortunately, no one would want him, so we are probably going to keep him or he will walk. The only hope of facilitating a trade would be to Carlton. But can't even see he blues been interested to be honest.

 

[Collingwood 4 eternity]

There is something going on , I think all of these recent issues are a cry for help from him , that we are not hearing.

And all of this sounds to me like someone contemplating escaping from life , if you know what I mean

His step father took his own life a few years ago , I just hope that H doesn't do the same.

I fear for H and his own safety , from himself mostly.

 

[Scodog10]

A key difference between Shaw and Lumumba is that Shaw had currency. Not sure Lumumba has that.

Both were contracted, and IIRC Shaw's trade required us to continue paying a portion of his salary.

If we can't find a trade for Lumumba, what happens then? Do we try to reconcile, or do we pay him out?

I agree Lumumba has little currency in my eyes, but I hadn't actually considered the possibility of no one taking him on (I'd be surprised if he wasn't thrown a lifeline).

In that situation I'd accept either scenario, but I would prefer we cut our losses. That is so long as it wasn't a token effort to move him on (which I doubt we'd get).

 

[Anzacday]

I can't help but be disappointed with the posts in this thread. HL is a man who has strong principles, and when people engage in conduct that offends those principles he feels compelled to make a stand. I see nothing wrong in that. I also see the benefit in blanket opposition to anything that is even remotely homophobic. It is only be challenging, and marginalising, those with homophobic, racist, sexist etc views that we can have a society where homophobia, racism and sexism are a thing of the past.
While I agree the defacing of the poster is at the low end of the scale in terms of homophobic behaviour, it does not mean it is acceptable, or that HL should not be acting against it. He is saying that no displays of homophobia are acceptable. I agree with him on this, and agree with him wanting the Club to do something about it. I think threatening to resign over it was going too far, but I also think he acknowledged that both by withdrawing from the resignation and via the carefully chosen words used by his manager.
I would like HL to stay, and I would like him to focus more of his passion on his football. When he was getting in the face of Barry Hall, running hard out of the backline, shutting down both smalls and talls in defence, he was an absolutely vital component of our success.

Fair call on all of that.
However, from a team perspective what message does it send if "H" is allowed all these outbursts; only for them to be resolved and then another one happens again next year?
I'm not sure of the timing of all this, appears to have been a number of weeks before the end of the season.
We beat Port Adelaide and then we had two particularly poor performances; West Coast and Brisbane and we were hopeless in both games.
Now whilst not levelling blame on "H" it poses the question as to whether it happened then and if so what impact it had on the group.
I say times up "H" and I will forever remember you for your dash and in particular the goal from outside 50 in the 2010 GF.

 

[MarkT2]

As a player he's expendible. I'd have happily traded him a few years ago. Every time he gets it I shudder. He either gets caught trying to do too much or turns it over on disposal far too often. If you add his hysterical intollerance to what he sees as intollerance then he should go IMO. I'm not sure he has any currency. Maybe Mick likes him.

My only issue with this is that he's another who wants out and I hope we don't ignore that aspect. I nearly threw up when aI saw Buckley's comment abouty needing to be on board with the leaduing teams approach. FMD that's half the bloody problem. Lots of different reasons why people leave an organisation but good clubs don't have players wanting to leave. The right result for the wrong reasons isn't always a win. We really don't look like a quality club any more.

 

[dubber]

Clearly H has bigger issues than just footy and it is a situation we need to tread very carefully. Depression etc is a huge problem and you can't just cut a guy loose if he is suffering.

However, on the face of it H is a bigger problem than what he's worth. He had an ordinary year, and for the second year running has had a falling out with the coach.

If a player is a superstar, then you bend a bit for him. That's natural. But H is giving us little on field and problems off it.

It can't be healthy for the playing group.

Unfortunately, no one would want him, so we are probably going to keep him or he will walk. The only hope of facilitating a trade would be to Carlton. But can't even see he blues been interested to be honest.

So you are saying that at a workplace a senior manager can get away with an inappropriate remark as he has 'earnt his stripes'? Completely disagree with your post. I am not sure about your work but at ours each and every employee must do compliance training & adhere to the minimum standards the organisation enforces. If something similar happened at ours i can guarantee you that the offenders would be sacked immediately.

Do we not want our football clubs to be a professional outfit? Is this not year 2014 & not 1965?

Harry was racially abused against Hawthorn, what did the AFL or the club do about it? Not much.

It's pretty sad state of affairs when you are implying that if it was Pendles in H's shoes we would be a lot more lenient & understanding about it. This is the problem with our society, this acceptance of in-direct discrimination.

 

[CasuallyDressed]

My thoughts of H were to seek a trade for him before this all happened.

I still stand by my thoughts on putting him on the market to see what we can get. It's nothing to do with this mess, I thought all season that tossing Harry/Blair etc into the trade mix could be good for us and I stand by that.

 

[Bring_Back_Brad]

Would love to know who leaked this story to the press.

 

[sthmelb_dimmies]

I would like HL to stay, and I would like him to focus more of his passion on his football. When he was getting in the face of Barry Hall, running hard out of the backline, shutting down both smalls and talls in defence, he was an absolutely vital component of our success.

I think the key point of this post is the past tense usage of the third person singular. Time for this chameleon to reincarnate, again.

Good luck Harry.

 

[Piestration]

I agree Maggie. Losing another experienced player will hurt in the short term but we cannot afford any more dramas. I respect H and those posters who are sticking up for him but we are in this business to win premierships. These sort of distractions have to end.

Wut. That's bad form Jmac. I didn't think you resorted to this sort of thing.

 

[76woodenspooners]

It only takes one who sees Lumumba as a challenge and willing to take him on.

Agree

Hope for H and Collingwood's sake that there is a club of there.

His trade value depends on what that one willing coach is prepared to give up to to get Lumumba.

It needs two clubs wanting him to get any value.

If only one club wanted him, what's to stop them simply offering us a packet of Twisties to take him off our hands, if we continue to pay his salary?

 

[mattys123]

Ed's taking the diplomatic role it seems;

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-09-05/theres-no-friction

"Sometimes it might be better for both to split. [It] doesn't mean you don't love each other, marriages break up every other day, sometimes amicably, sometimes the other way. This is one that is very amicable at the moment," McGuire said on Triple M on Friday.

"[We're] working through some situations to get the best opportunity for both club and player.

"There's no hatred, there's no friction, or anything else like that. There's different points of view, it's as simple as that.

"You never know, maybe we can get things sorted out."

McGuire said it would be a "mutual decision" between the player and Magpies as to whether Lumumba stays at the club or seeks a trade.

"You don't want to be fighting with people all the time, particularly people who you love and respect," McGuire said.

"We'll either work out whether there's a better option for everybody, or whether we can come together."

I guess there's no rush, his decision won't effect the club until the trade period starts, or even finishes.

 

[Maggie5]

I wonder how Leading Teams fits into this? If as I think it encourages people to speak openly, how would H feel if some players thought he was 'precious' about the situation and that it makes them feel uncomfortable or unable to speak freely in front of him. How would they deal with a)Harry being 'offended' by the graffiti and b)the players being intimidated by H's reaction to it?

 

[loki04]

In all honesty you would be lucky to get a pick better than 50. TBH I hope my club doesn't even take him for nothing.

Your club will be better (and importantly more unified) without him.



Sounds much more likely. Or Garlett if you would be prepared to throw in a dud pick - and he's playing in the seconds...

I think you are going to be in for a shock.

 

[loki04]

I agree Lumumba has little currency in my eyes, but I hadn't actually considered the possibility of no one taking him on (I'd be surprised if he wasn't thrown a lifeline).

In that situation I'd accept either scenario, but I would prefer we cut our losses. That is so long as it wasn't a token effort to move him on (which I doubt we'd get).

Will get a pick between 25 and 35 for him imo, people are underselling what he can offer certain sides.

 

[rustyg70]

Send him to GWS.
Josh Hunt has just retired, so hopefully they will want another experienced player down back.
Pay part of his salary as we did for Shaw.
Hopefully we ask for McCarthy.

 

[ppoiter]

I'm not on here to troll, as my best mate is a pies fan and he said cut him loose when he flared up last time. I just wanted to see what you guys thought about this and generally, i think your comment sums it up perfectly. I believe he thinks hes above everyone else. H can be good at times but the down side is not worth the distraction to your club. 2 things that really irk me about H in the past was once on SEN he said 'everyone has to be educated' (this was a few years ago and I think he was referring to racism), it's not what he said that but how he said it. Who is he to expect everyone to be non judgemental but then come across like that? Then he 'requested' a sit down the Dalai Lama. Seriously, who does he think he is. Pies can only benefit from getting rid of him.

I thought it was Obama he requested a meeting with. Dont tell me it was both

Got Carlton written all over this one. Back with Mick etc, etc

Pick 8 and Harry for pick 6

 

[Unknown Identity]

Harry met with Paul Roos this morning in Elwood.