Border Gavaskar Trophy, India v Australia, 4th Test 9-13 March, 1430hrs at Ahmedabad

[Jim Prideaux]

I would like to see us use Green more like a front line quick - and especially as an opening bowler because he can actually swing it, but we don't at the moment. Issue is he tends to bowl fairly poorly first up then get better as the game progresses. Needs more work.

Reckon he needs more fitness (not saying he’s unfit per se) and a some years under the belt, we forget how …… green he still is in that regard. He’ll get there, I’m fairly confident.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

Absolutely, from 8 to 11 you're only a bowler, sometimes you can get unlucky if you get 4 bunnies though, at least one can usually hold a bat.

And sometimes even with a few that can hold a bat, they’ll just get out, because they’re tail enders. Cummins, Lyon and Starc all have the ability to make runs in the tail, and I reckon Murphy will improve.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

And sometimes even with a few that can hold a bat, they’ll just get out, because they’re tail enders. Cummins, Lyon and Starc all have the ability to make runs in the tail, and I reckon Murphy will improve.

Well Murphy can’t go worse with the bat and it’s generous with Lyon. It’s a shame Jyhe can’t stay fit! One of the few bowlers that can genuinely bat. I know I sound like a broken record but we should have taken Neser

 

[Beutbrute]

I have been meaning to make a post for a while, and this talk of using Green as a front line bowler is the impetus I needed.

Green has been horribly managed as a bowler since playing test cricket for Australia. He is an outstanding swing bowler, who it being used as a battering ram instead.



Here's a compilation of his early wickets playing for WA - averaging well under 20 with the ball. You will notice just about every wicket was from pitching the ball up and getting swing. His bounce is a change up and more useful for finding an edge than bouncing people out.

Since he has been in the test team on just about every occasion he has bowled it has been once the ball is atleast 30 overs old, generally with established batsmen in the crease. The ball isn't moving and he has resorted to short pitch bowling to challenge the batsmen with his bounce. There is a time for this but it's not his forte.

I really hope they get him bowling that swing bowling soon. In England he could be a very scary prospect with his pace, swing and bounce.

 

[The 747]

I have been meaning to make a post for a while, and this talk of using Green as a front line bowler is the impetus I needed.

Green has been horribly managed as a bowler since playing test cricket for Australia. He is an outstanding swing bowler, who it being used as a battering ram instead.



Here's a compilation of his early wickets playing for WA - averaging well under 20 with the ball. You will notice just about every wicket was from pitching the ball up and getting swing. His bounce is a change up and more useful for finding an edge than bouncing people out.

Since he has been in the test team on just about every occasion he has bowled it has been once the ball is atleast 30 overs old, generally with established batsmen in the crease. The ball isn't moving and he has resorted to short pitch bowling to challenge the batsmen with his bounce. There is a time for this but it's not his forte.

I really hope they get him bowling that swing bowling soon. In England he could be a very scary prospect with his pace, swing and bounce.

Disagree he has been horribly managed, he has been used sparingly to try to avoid the constant early 20s injuries that fast bowlers get. This is because his batting is quite important now and for the future.

I agree with you about swing though, I would like him to open the bowling since aside from Starc the others don't really swing it. Also noting that the more work he gets in the better he tends to bowl from my observation.

 

[Gough]

Disagree he has been horribly managed, he has been used sparingly to try to avoid the constant early 20s injuries that fast bowlers get. This is because his batting is quite important now and for the future.

I agree with you about swing though, I would like him to open the bowling since aside from Starc the others don't really swing it. Also noting that the more work he gets in the better he tends to bowl from my observation.

I like to think we might have learned from the mistakes we made with Shane Watson.

 

[Beutbrute]

Disagree he has been horribly managed, he has been used sparingly to try to avoid the constant early 20s injuries that fast bowlers get. This is because his batting is quite important now and for the future.

I agree with you about swing though, I would like him to open the bowling since aside from Starc the others don't really swing it. Also noting that the more work he gets in the better he tends to bowl from my observation.

My comment about him being horribly managed is more about how he is being used, not his workload. I haven't had a problem with him having his workload managed, more how we use him when we do.

 

[corbies]

I think if you have the ability to bowl 3 of Hazlewood, Cummins, Starc, Boland, Neser, Richardson (whichever 3 are playing) you'd be absolutely insane to bowl Cameron Green in front of any of them if they're fit to bowl inside the first 15 overs.

 

[doggies ftw]

Agree Cams first over or two are usually pretty all over the shop so it makes it hard to justify using him very very early when you need to be doing as much damage as you can with the brand new ball

 

[Beutbrute]

I think if you have the ability to bowl 3 of Hazlewood, Cummins, Starc, Boland, Neser, Richardson (whichever 3 are playing) you'd be absolutely insane to bowl Cameron Green in front of any of them if they're fit to bowl inside the first 15 overs.

There's at least 4 bowlers used inside the first 15 overs. Generally 4-5 overs each opening bowler (9-10 overs) then the next unit comes on. Australia never uses Green as this second unit. Always seems to be Cummins (agree) and Lyon. There are times Green can come in at this point instead of Lyon.

Edit: having watched a fair amount of shield cricket - Green was a genuine strike bowler when he was first used with a better average and strike rate than any of the guys you mentioned. I think some people don't realise how good he can be as a bowler.

 

[corbies]

There's at least 4 bowlers used inside the first 15 overs. Generally 4-5 overs each opening bowler (9-10 overs) then the next unit comes on. Australia never uses Green as this second unit. Always seems to be Cummins (agree) and Lyon. There are times Green can come in at this point instead of Lyon.

Edit: having watched a fair amount of shield cricket - Green was a genuine strike bowler when he was first used with a better average and strike rate than any of the guys you mentioned. I think some people don't realise how good he can be as a bowler.

Green has been used in the first 4 bowlers 13 times for 7 wickets @ 40.86.

He's been used as the 5th bowler or later 16 times for 16 wickets @ 25.81.

If we take out Asia where it doesn't suit his bowling its:

First 4: 10 times for 7 wickets @ 30.71.
5th or later: 11 times for 13 wickets @ 21.46.

 

[FredLeDeux]

Green has been used in the first 4 bowlers 13 times for 7 wickets @ 40.86.

He's been used as the 5th bowler or later 16 times for 16 wickets @ 25.81.

If we take out Asia where it doesn't suit his bowling its:

First 4: 10 times for 7 wickets @ 30.71.
5th or later: 11 times for 13 wickets @ 21.46.

You would normally expect RpW to decrease the further you go into the innings

 

[corbies]

You would normally expect RpW to decrease the further you go into the innings

Only if he was bowling at the tail more by bowling 5th choice or later. But his percentage of wickets being top 6 batsman is barely different between when he bowls in the first 4 (71%) to when he bowls 5th or later (69%).

 

[The 747]

Some talk that this Test may break the MCG all time Test match attendance record for a single day.

 

[Gough]

Bharat Sundaresan said it looks like a cricket match is going to be played during a political rally.

 

[The 747]

I like to think we might have learned from the mistakes we made with Shane Watson.

Saw Watto bowling in a domestic OD game before he made it to the Aus team, he was a beast of a bowler before injuries hit.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

Watering Cans!!!! WTF!!!

More water than some pitches see

 

[Kram]

Saw Watto bowling in a domestic OD game before he made it to the Aus team, he was a beast of a bowler before injuries hit.

Lightening quick too apparently.

 

[The 747]

Lightening quick too apparently.

Can only go on the game I saw but he got it up to 145kph and was swinging it as well. At one stage he was the quickest bowler going round IIRC.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

Can only go on the game I saw but he got it up to 145kph and was swinging it as well. At one stage he was the quickest bowler going round IIRC.

Yup, he was an absolute gun, crueller by injuries in his younger years. I’ll be very happy if the same doesn’t happen to Green

 

[freddy mercury]

Surely the Indians aren't gonna give us a green top?

 

[grumbleguts]

Again, why can't we have an international panel of neutral curators.

 

[Westend]

so how are the pitches looking ?

expecting another bunsen to be honest....will they have the balls to change things up ?

 

[Ohitsthatguy]

Didn't Green have to slightly modify his action after an injury and his bowling hasn't quite reached the heights of when he first came on to the scene?

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Surely the Indians aren't gonna give us a green top?

They have as good a quick bowling unit you know and their best one is out. Shami will be back in for this test though