Preview Changes v Demons, Round 2 (upgraded to official preview)

[martinson]

Any info at the rate the opposition scored from our kick ins ?

Also could have something to do with the number of points scored against us. Port scored more points than anybody on the weekend and had already clogged up any exit routes by getting it there in the first place. We just got done all over the ground.

 

[FeastOrFamine]

According to Lachie on AFL 360 last night the players come together to rate the games, and the port game was the lowest score for a game they've given in their time under Fagan.

Crazy how much can change in one game. Went from hero to zero very quickly.

 

[3KZ is Football]

Rich was the only player that rocked up on Saturday yet is one of players questioned most by fans in the aftermath. I don’t get it.

Only runs one way. Easy to run off. Play a taller marking runner on him and then play through that player.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Any info at the rate the opposition scored from our kick ins ?

Not that I'm aware of

 

[notliondown]

As one who has questioned Richy's role I want to be 100% clear.... as probably our most dedicated, loyal player on the list, I love the guy. I cannot question his commitment or desire to see the club improve and win premierships. He's been an incredible journey man for us.

But my criticism of him is not from the Port game alone. It's been a consistent question for a fair while now.

We have changed our game plan for one that requires speed and boldness out of defense. We are demanding more defensive pressure and physicality from our players to match up on opposition.

The game is moving past Richy if I'm really blunt and it's not a personal criticism. Richy has limitations like every other player. Take away his booming kick and his cupboard is pretty bare. We question the ability of players constantly on here, thier skills, thier diversity. Rayner for running, Roberston disposal, Answerth clangers, Lyons speed - it goes on and on.

Being a loyal, fan favourite shouldn't make anyone exempt from that. And if I'm honest I think he is one player Fagan struggles to deal with for exactly that reason. He's trying to fit a square peg in a round hole now.

If Richy is to play he needs to change how he does so - the same we demand of others.

 

[martinson]

Not that I'm aware of

Didn't think so. It's all very well to say change our strategy when the opposition kicks a behind , but you've got to have someone to execute it properly and the players good enough and quick and smart enough to get into position for it ,and then able to execute the rebound. It looks great when it comes off and obviously everyone wants us to do that all the time but maybe in a game like last Saturday we just had no hope of doing it the way they were dominating the play and the ball.

 

[briztoon]

I here you but maybe Rich is being directed to do that by the coaches and hes simply following orders from Fages and defence coach.

I did mention that.

 

[Saucery]

I actually am open to this idea, Hipwood back and Fort in. Hipwood really does need to improve his defensive side and we need another tall back. Either him or Gunston back will give us the hight we need until Gardiner returns to fitness.

The damning rating that highlights why key Lion should play down back

He was quiet on the weekend.

www.sen.com.au

 

[On the quiet]

As one who has questioned Richy's role I want to be 100% clear.... as probably our most dedicated, loyal player on the list, I love the guy for it. I cannot question his commitment or desire to see the club improve and win premierships. He's been an incredible journey man for us.

But my criticism of him is not from the Port game alone. It's been a consistent question for a fair while now.

We have changed our game plan for one that requires speed and boldness out of defense. We are demanding more defensive pressure and physicality from our players to match up on opposition.

The game is moving past Richy if I'm really blunt and it's not a personal criticism. Richy has limitations like every other player. Take away his booming kick and his cupboard is pretty bare. We question the ability of players constantly on here, thier skills, thier diversity. Rayner for running, Roberston disposal, Answerth clangers, Lyons speed - it goes one and on.

Being a loyal, fan favourite shouldn't make anyone exempt from that. And if I'm honest I think he is one player Fagan struggles to deal with for exactly that reason. He's trying to fit a square peg in a round hole now.

If Richy is to play he needs to change how he does so - the same we demand of others.

I am not very good with computers so don't know how to upload the footage, but if you look closely at Ports (Marshal) first goal Payne is sprinting hard and closing (don't think he would have prevented the mark) but Butters who runs away from Rich, impedes Payne at a crucial moment. It must be terribly difficult for Fages and the coaching group with such a loyal and long standing player, BUT if we are 0-4 we have to play the kids. Everyone was poor last week so Rich is not to blame, but as you have said it does appear the game is moving past Richy.

as a footnote I think we will be 2-2, not 0-4.

 

[3KZ is Football]

As one who has questioned Richy's role I want to be 100% clear.... as probably our most dedicated, loyal player on the list, I love the guy. I cannot question his commitment or desire to see the club improve and win premierships. He's been an incredible journey man for us.

But my criticism of him is not from the Port game alone. It's been a consistent question for a fair while now.

We have changed our game plan for one that requires speed and boldness out of defense. We are demanding more defensive pressure and physicality from our players to match up on opposition.

The game is moving past Richy if I'm really blunt and it's not a personal criticism. Richy has limitations like every other player. Take away his booming kick and his cupboard is pretty bare. We question the ability of players constantly on here, thier skills, thier diversity. Rayner for running, Roberston disposal, Answerth clangers, Lyons speed - it goes on and on.

Being a loyal, fan favourite shouldn't make anyone exempt from that. And if I'm honest I think he is one player Fagan struggles to deal with for exactly that reason. He's trying to fit a square peg in a round hole now.

If Richy is to play he needs to change how he does so - the same we demand of others.

It’s 11.39 in my world, but I just read the most sensible post I’m going to read on BF today. Well done. 100% agree.

 

[lioninthesand]

I would like to see the stat for Dan’s kick ins, they get distance but do we end up

That’s game plan though. Wouldn’t have mattered who was kicking them in. We we were flat footed, our bigs were avoiding body contact in the air and our confidence was complete shot.

 

[Section 5]

I think most would agree our Lions players were just awful in round 1.
When the media & BF discussion is
Rich was our best, Rich was our worst, Rich was okay.

As a team if all of the above are close to correct then that is why we got thumped

 

[Berrygood]

I actually am open to this idea, Hipwood back and Fort in. Hipwood really does need to improve his defensive side and we need another tall back. Either him or Gunston back will give us the hight we need until Gardiner returns to fitness.

The damning rating that highlights why key Lion should play down back

He was quiet on the weekend.

www.sen.com.au

As a tall gangly kid against other tall gangly kids I can see how Hippy was successful as a swing man playing back as a junior. He's not playing kids now, he up against big bodied men. He gets pushed off the ball easy enough fwd, I wouldn't want to see that in defense. Hippy is best when he's roaming up the ground, getting space and using his athleticism to beat his opponent running fwd, either dishing off deep into the fwd 50 or having a crack from 50 himself. Mobility is his strength not marking in a pack be it fwd 50 or def 50.

Gunston on the other hand has played back in the recent past and was pretty good at it. At this point I'd have more confidence in him as the third tall defender than Hippy ever or Joyce atm. He has the smarts to know when to leave his man, intercept or spoil. Being a bit more mobile than Andrews he could match up on MacDonald allowing Harris to concentrate on the fwd ruckman, Gawn mostly or Grundy at times. Payne on Brown.

Fort in for Kiddy, Gunston back. Fort or Big O when fwd play deep, allowing Hippy and Joe to roam fwd taking May and or Lever with them opening up space in the fwd 50 instead of it being a congested pack getting in each other's road.

Prior in for Tunstill. Jax better on the wing than Dev, giving Dev and Berry more time inside. I do think Clugg needs to take a wing role atm. His run both ways and his disposal when in space is much more needed than him in the middle at the moment. AA squad in that role, makes sense to keep him there. Still getting some time in the middle as was the case then.

Zorko if deemed fit, in for Linc. I like McCarthy a lot but his output has dropped off. Zorks fwd pressure can be inspirational. Bailey on the wing or in the middle is a waste and should just stay at h/f. Whether it's Zorks n Bailey or McCarthy n Bailey along with Charlie, they need a rocket up them to make that fwd pressure count.

Rayner I'm putting on the bench, with relief stints fwd, back and in the middle. No Pickett allows Starce to take Fritsch, relief at times from Rayner or Prior.

So only 2 definite changes for me, 3 if Zorko is ready. And a rocket up everyone to perform.

 

[Dalions]

As a tall gangly kid against other tall gangly kids I can see how Hippy was successful as a swing man playing back as a junior. He's not playing kids now, he up against big bodied men. He gets pushed off the ball easy enough fwd, I wouldn't want to see that in defense. Hippy is best when he's roaming up the ground, getting space and using his athleticism to beat his opponent running fwd, either dishing off deep into the fwd 50 or having a crack from 50 himself. Mobility is his strength not marking in a pack be it fwd 50 or def 50.

Gunston on the other hand has played back in the recent past and was pretty good at it. At this point I'd have more confidence in him as the third tall defender than Hippy ever or Joyce atm. He has the smarts to know when to leave his man, intercept or spoil. Being a bit more mobile than Andrews he could match up on MacDonald allowing Harris to concentrate on the fwd ruckman, Gawn mostly or Grundy at times. Payne on Brown.

Fort in for Kiddy, Gunston back. Fort or Big O when fwd play deep, allowing Hippy and Joe to roam fwd taking May and or Lever with them opening up space in the fwd 50 instead of it being a congested pack getting in each other's road.

Prior in for Tunstill. Jax better on the wing than Dev, giving Dev and Berry more time inside. I do think Clugg needs to take a wing role atm. His run both ways and his disposal when in space is much more needed than him in the middle at the moment. AA squad in that role, makes sense to keep him there. Still getting some time in the middle as was the case then.

Zorko if deemed fit, in for Linc. I like McCarthy a lot but his output has dropped off. Zorks fwd pressure can be inspirational. Bailey on the wing or in the middle is a waste and should just stay at h/f. Whether it's Zorks n Bailey or McCarthy n Bailey along with Charlie, they need a rocket up them to make that fwd pressure count.

Rayner I'm putting on the bench, with relief stints fwd, back and in the middle. No Pickett allows Starce to take Fritsch, relief at times from Rayner or Prior.

So only 2 definite changes for me, 3 if Zorko is ready. And a rocket up everyone to perform.

I would definitely be tempted to bring in Fort for Kiddy for atleast 1 change.
Both O and Fort need to be given a strict role to play and not to detour from the role.
O to follow Gawn where ever he goes and Fort to do the same with Grundy.
If they go forward then they stick with them and become the 3rd tall effectively, in defence and go head to head with their man in the ruck, Oscar needs help in this area after the Port game.
The midfield need to lift and I would consider Lyons to come in and basically play on ball for 75-80% of game time.
But I don’t think the coaching staff will make that change, I think they will go with the same group to let them redeem.
Zorko in for McCarthy (just not offering enough) was beginning to slip last year I reckon.
And I would love to get Answerth back In the side for a lockdown role on one of the smalls or to play wing or both depending on other match ups, probably at the expense of Jimmy.

 

[T Rick]

According to Lachie on AFL 360 last night the players come together to rate the games, and the port game was the lowest score for a game they've given in their time under Fagan.

Crazy how much can change in one game. Went from hero to zero very quickly.

I wonder how that works - do players rate each other's games with some sort of score?

 

[Nuggo]

I wonder how that works - do players rate each other's games with some sort of score?

 

[Mr Ripper]

I wonder how that works - do players rate each other's games with some sort of score?

 

[p4p1]

How many genuine A-graders vs guys who can inconsistently put in A-grade performance a few times a year do we have. Based on that are guys like Daniher, Cameron, Bailey etc A-graders or just guys who can put in A-grade level performances but not be relied to do so consistently?

 

[M Malice]

How many genuine A-graders vs guys who can inconsistently put in A-grade performance a few times a year do we have. Based on that are guys like Daniher, Cameron, Bailey etc A-graders or just guys who can put in A-grade level performances but not be relied to do so consistently?

Consistent A graders (play to a high level 9 times out of 10 2021-22)- Lachie Neale, Josh Dunkley, Hugh McCluggage, Brandon Starcevich.

 

[Quigley]

Consistent A graders (play to a high level 9 times out of 10 2021-22)- Lachie Neale, Josh Dunkley, Hugh McCluggage, Brandon Starcevich.

I would have agreed with Starcevich until about half way through last year. He has dropped away and since that time would very much just be a middle of the pack defender who doesn't get a heap of the ball and regularly loses his match-ups. He is definitely not an A grader.

 

[BuntonRules]

Maybe it is for Rich but if that were the case I would be inclined to try and make Rich the second kick so that way we can gain an extra 30m or so

Watch Port's kickins. 25 - 30 metres to a loose player. Player kicking in runs past, takes the handball and kicks long from close to the 50 - clearing our zone and setting them off to goal. 40 metres more gained than Rich.

WE NEVER DID THAT ONCE.

 

[Quigley]

Watch Port's kickins. 25 - 30 metres to a loose player. Player kicking in runs past, takes the handball and kicks long from close to the 50 - clearing our zone and setting them off to goal. 40 metres more gained than Rich.

WE NEVER DID THAT ONCE.

Kick ins are a set play. That is the coaching and not Rich.

 

[p4p1]

Watch Port's kickins. 25 - 30 metres to a loose player. Player kicking in runs past, takes the handball and kicks long from close to the 50 - clearing our zone and setting them off to goal. 40 metres more gained than Rich.

WE NEVER DID THAT ONCE.

I'm not sure Rich has the speed to do that consistently, I would back Kiddy, Zorks and Rayner (probably with brute strength rather than speed) could do that though. Starce as well but I can't recall him being a great kick.

Could you beat the zone by having all of your players on one side? Either out numbering the oppo to an extent that you're almost guaranteed to win the contest or if the oppo players follow, could you have your quickest player break to the other side and kick it into space for him?

 

[p4p1]

Kick ins are a set play. That is the coaching and not Rich.

So our coaching is for Rich to take the full time to assess his options, the players to be somewhat stagnant, not create space for a potential kick in receive and always kick to a 50/50 sometimes worse contest?
Then we really need to get rid of the coaches quick smart.

 

[M Malice]

Kick ins are a set play. That is the coaching and not Rich.

Can not be a hard and set directive, he must have licence to go for a slightly riskier high reward type kick in if he senses it surely.