List Mgmt. COLLINGWOOD Trade and F/A Discussion 2023

[RobJD]

I am in the camp that this year we'll be fairly quiet in the trade/fa space. We had a huge grab last year bringing in 4 new players last year, and the pool seems to have dried up with Parish signing, the Ben King "links" vanishing, and the ever stubborn Bulldogs looking like they'll cling on to Bevo, Smith and Naughton for another year at least.

Barring something drastic popping up, I would predict we're one of the clubs only looking at taking 1-2 picks at the draft, so suspect it'll look something like:
- A low profile recruit (Frampton last year type deal) or a DFA we decide to grab. The Lewis Young alleged link would fit that sort of deal, in terms of profile.

- Navigating/packaging trades for the likes of Bianco and Ruscoe, to creep up the order as high as we can, take our 1st pick then "dump" everything else into the 2024 draft (i.e trading any pick other pick we don't want to use into 2024 picks)

We've been exceptional at drafting from the SSP, Rookie and Mid-season drafts, I'd like us to keep some spots for those drafts rather than load up on a potentially shallow National Draft.

 

[Scodog10]

They can probably move more of Whitfield's salary. If Haynes is on the rumoured contract, it's going to be tricky to find a club to help get a big amount of that contract off their books.

This then ties to my other point around us not being able to accommodate the “more” component of Whitfield’s contract. Haynes>>>Bowes so you add their own 1st Rd pick to any deal and they’ll have a suitor for Haynes. Hell I’d take him because Haynes would probably be out 3rd best defender.

 

[Apex36]

Well I can’t be 100% and I can probably adjust the language, but that’s why I added the third point re Haynes. If signing HH has compromised their salary cap I just can’t get to an outcome where Whitfield is the player moved on over Haynes.

I guess there’s the slimmest of slim chances that both Whitfield and Haynes need to be moved, but I don’t see it. Even with the Guy balls up of 2020 we weren’t moving anywhere near $2m in cap…

Treloar - $600k (us paying $300k of his 900)
Phillips - $600k
Stephenson - $500k

Unless my maths is dodgy thats $1.7m between 3 players. Would have been $2m if we’d managed to offload all of Treloars salary.

For me, the fact that GWS could offload $2m between two players who aren’t even in their best 5 players anymore should ring massive alarm bells in regards to their cap situation.

 

[Scodog10]

Weren't we? Treloar had pushed his money back so far to the point he was beginning to make $900k per year, and Stephenson and Phillips apparently had heavily incentivised contracts.

I thought Phillips salary was a more sedate $350k, but I suppose we are talking Guy so you’re probably right. Even then Covid reductions and re-signing Mihocek, Jaicos and JDG were in the mix. I don’t quite see those moving parts getting near the current GWS scenario?

 

[Scodog10]

Treloar - $600k (us paying $300k of his 900)
Phillips - $600k
Stephenson - $500k

Unless my maths is dodgy thats $1.7m between 3 players. Would have been $2m if we’d managed to offload all of Treloars salary.

For me, the fact that GWS could offload $2m between two players who aren’t even in their best 5 players anymore should ring massive alarm bells in regards to their cap situation.

Whitfield is in their best 6-8 hence why I don’t see it. Taylor/ Greene> Kelly/ Coniglio/ Green> Whitfield/ Daniels.

He’s not a $1m player, but neither is he one they’re moving and paying a significant enough chunk of salary for us to be in the mix. End of the day I’m happy to put it on the record that we’re we’re roughly between zero and no chance of bringing in Whitfield because it doesn’t work for any party.

 

[SchuPie]

Somehow use our first + something to trade into the first round next year?
This would provide us 2x firsts and give options to trade for a quality player and / or trade up in 2024

Well said

 

[KinderSmock]

Weren't we? Treloar had pushed his money back so far to the point he was beginning to make $900k per year, and Stephenson and Phillips apparently had heavily incentivised contracts.

Atu D2 was on $150k, Treloar $900k, Stepho was on $600k and Fip was on $500kish. That comes to about $2 million.

 

[KinderSmock]

They won't, he's trash.

And yeah, I dunno, I can't comment on what this board said about those other guys you listed. Not sure why that's relevant to me - I was never against any of them.

Young isn't well-like by Carlton fans but he always seems to make sides that aren't playing for the emblem.

 

[Mollythedolly]

The point is that it was not public knowledge! I find it very unlikely that we take on a top level salary player, sacrifice top end draft picks for a player that we know to be mentally broken and on the cusp of a mental breakdown. I say we were deceived and mislead.

Beams had slotted back into the team seamlessly upon his return. Things didn’t go to shit till he got injured.

 

[neilk]

I thought Phillips salary was a more sedate $350k, but I suppose we are talking Guy so you’re probably right. Even then Covid reductions and re-signing Mihocek, Jaicos and JDG were in the mix. I don’t quite see those moving parts getting near the current GWS scenario?

I think Phillips was on that much because he hit the targets in his contract to get more $$$.

 

[whiskeytown]

If the club likely ends up with pick 19-20 after expected academy selections, F/S etc… selections inside the first 15 picks

Better off having a crack at someone like Hunter Clarke with that pick

He was keen to leave last year. And we need some younger legs as Pendles, Sidebottom, Mitchell, Adams finish up over the next year or so

 

[sr36]

Treloar - $600k (us paying $300k of his 900)
Phillips - $600k
Stephenson - $500k

Unless my maths is dodgy thats $1.7m between 3 players. Would have been $2m if we’d managed to offload all of Treloars salary.

Two million when you factor in that we also had all of these retirees and delistings too - replaced with draftees at the bottom of the wage pool:

Tim Broomhead (delisted), Lynden Dunn (retired), Tom Langdon (retired), Ben Reid (retired), Matthew Scharenberg (delisted), Travis Varcoe (retired), Rupert Wills (delisted)

 

[Mollythedolly]

Our future first won't work for them, because they need points for this year.
We would have to trade our 2024 1st to another club for 2023 picks, then on-trade to GC.
I'm not sure that's very likely.

They could ontrade our 2024 1st back into 2023. Would potentially give them some 2023 points flexibility in timing when the points are available rather than allowing 2x 2023 1st’s to get swallowed up just matching their 1st and/or 2nd academy option.

 

[sr36]

Atu D2 was on $150k, Treloar $900k, Stepho was on $600k and Fip was on $500kish. That comes to about $2 million.

Not a $2 million saving though as you've got to pay the bloke who replaces them on the list. With retirees though it would have been comfortably a $2 million I think.

 

[magpies42]

Beams had slotted back into the team seamlessly upon his return. Things didn’t go to s**t till he got injured.

He slotted in because we paid a high price, he was average at best. Return on investment incredibly low

 

[magpies42]

Treloar - $600k (us paying $300k of his 900)
Phillips - $600k
Stephenson - $500k

Unless my maths is dodgy thats $1.7m between 3 players. Would have been $2m if we’d managed to offload all of Treloars salary.

For me, the fact that GWS could offload $2m between two players who aren’t even in their best 5 players anymore should ring massive alarm bells in regards to their cap situation.

Would we bring on an over paid player if it came with an early pick, similar to the Gold Coast and Geelong deal last year? I’d be keen to get back to the pointy end of the draft.

 

[sr36]

Would we bring on an over paid player if it came with an early pick, similar to the Gold Coast and Geelong deal last year? I’d be keen to get back to the pointy end of the draft.

If we're in a position to, it would be great. If you had enough salary cap space to get Whitfield and a top 10 pick, you'd do it. It'd stop you getting a really targetted gun FA over the next couple of years, but you'd be getting a bloody good footballer and an early pick.

 

[RobJD]

If we're in a position to, it would be great. If you had enough salary cap space to get Whitfield and a top 10 pick, you'd do it. It'd stop you getting a really targetted gun FA over the next couple of years, but you'd be getting a bloody good footballer and an early pick.

Not sure it makes sense for us to be looking for opportunistic recruits. Last year the Pies recruited for need whilst the Cat's followed an opportunistic approach. Whilst I understand that there's many factors that contribute to this year's results, recruiting for need whilst a team is in the premiership window certainly paid dividends for the Pies whereas the Cats ignored their needs and suffered from a lack of depth in area's where they had weaknesses (that were exposed this year through injury).

 

[Mick F]

If we're in a position to, it would be great. If you had enough salary cap space to get Whitfield and a top 10 pick, you'd do it. It'd stop you getting a really targetted gun FA over the next couple of years, but you'd be getting a bloody good footballer and an early pick.

Astute. We need good young players from the draft PLUS bloody good footballers through other means.

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

Hey Mods,

Any chance we can get the Draft picks spreadsheet that Lore has done added as a sticky to this thread?
(and future trade threads).

I think it would be really handy for people who are suggesting trades / picks etc to have it as a reference.
Especially through trade week as it gets updated.

Probably a moot point for us this year.....but still an awesome resource.

 

[Buena]

The bold move I'm looking for is nabbing Gold Coast's pick 4. We could really do with another potential elite young player. Think we need to be going hard for that pick.

I'd love to see us on the end of one of these bargain moves. Or anyone other than Geelong for that matter

 

[Gymnorhina tibic]

I don't know much about cap space, trade capitol etc but Liam Henry is a yes please for mine.

 

[Jen2310]

 

[Jen2310]

Hey Mods,

Any chance we can get the Draft picks spreadsheet that Lore has done added as a sticky to this thread?
(and future trade threads).

I think it would be really handy for people who are suggesting trades / picks etc to have it as a reference.
Especially through trade week as it gets updated.

Probably a moot point for us this year.....but still an awesome resource.

Done.

 

[KinderSmock]

Not a $2 million saving though as you've got to pay the bloke who replaces them on the list. With retirees though it would have been comfortably a $2 million I think.

Varcoe, Reid, Dunn, Langdon and Greenwood all retired as well as a few more delistings and trades. Beams went as well but we still had to pay him out which I think caused some of the issues with the salary.

We replaced it all with first year contracts which are worth $80k (rookies) - $120k with incentives for each senior game (usually $5k).