Analysis Hawthorn rebuild: are they tanking?

[Hawkk]

Be interesting to see how the hawks do next year with a top 6 draw, not sure they have the talent to compete, especially in the midfield and up forward, am particularly interested in how they react to being given some of their own medicine, they seem to enjoy trolling, but cannot handle it coming the other way, i call it #sookball

On the bright side, as bad as Hawthorn has been post the hat trick (and 4 flags in 8 years), and for a time it was the worst Hawthorn team since the early 1950s, we never wooden spooned.

That said, I do agree, it would not surprise me if Hawthorn slid next year and had a bit of a come down.

Growth is not linear. The Hawks stagnated after 2001 (and even 2008), the Dees after 2018, Pies in 2020/21 and even the Tigers took four years to kick into gear after making the 2013 finals.

There are no guarantees…

 

[RCAB]

Afl coaches do not agree with your statement

NO AFL coach would take Edwards over Rioli unless they're tanking

 

[HairyO]

On the bright side, as bad as Hawthorn has been post the hat trick (and 4 flags in 8 years), and for a time it was the worst Hawthorn team since the early 1950s, we never wooden spooned.

That said, I do agree, it would not surprise me if Hawthorn slid next year and had a bit of a come down.

Growth is not linear. The Hawks stagnated after 2001 (and even 2008), the Dees after 2018, Pies in 2020/21 and even the Tigers took four years to kick into gear after making the 2013 finals.

There are no guarantees…

Our team changed a fair bit from 2008 to 2009. Injuries and retirements.

On paper we should be considerably stronger next year.

 

[Mr Meow]

Be interesting to see how the hawks do next year with a top 6 draw, not sure they have the talent to compete, especially in the midfield and up forward, am particularly interested in how they react to being given some of their own medicine, they seem to enjoy trolling, but cannot handle it coming the other way, i call it #sookball

Now do the Cats. You've had a very quiet season mate but your opinions are constantly later deemed massive fails.

 

[blaisee]

NO AFL coach would take Edwards over Rioli unless they're tanking

This has long been resolved, do some research

 

[The 747]

Agree. Plus maybe another A grade mid. However you'd think Mackenzie and Day being fully fit could fulfil that. A fit and consistent Mitch Lewis should provide the missing forward tall.

That is optimistic based on his history.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Now do the Cats. You've had a very quiet season mate but your opinions are constantly later deemed massive fails.

Ignore list is your friend

 

[NetworkNerd]

Our team changed a fair bit from 2008 to 2009. Injuries and retirements.

On paper we should be considerably stronger next year.

Should be better on paper but a tougher draw. Easter Monday will be a Cats home game at the MCG so avoid a trip down the highway. But top 6 draw says we have 3-4 away games against Port, Giants, Sydney or Brisbane.

 

[QuietB]

This has long been resolved, do some research

Shouldn't you be playing with the North supporters these days?

 

[HairyO]

Should be better on paper but a tougher draw. Easter Monday will be a Cats home game at the MCG so avoid a trip down the highway. But top 6 draw says we have 3-4 away games against Port, Giants, Sydney or Brisbane.

Big question is, will we still get 4pm Sunday games ?

 

[sr36]

Will be an inter sting watch next year.

I have the Hawks either

A). Continue upwards and end up a top four team and contending.

Or

B). Out of the eight completely as they have a flat year due to a harder draw, being the hunted and some younger players just 'expecting it t heppen' attitude.

Either way I don't see them in the 5-8 range for some reason.

Me too.

 

[sr36]

On the bright side, as bad as Hawthorn has been post the hat trick (and 4 flags in 8 years), and for a time it was the worst Hawthorn team since the early 1950s, we never wooden spooned.

That said, I do agree, it would not surprise me if Hawthorn slid next year and had a bit of a come down.

Growth is not linear. The Hawks stagnated after 2001 (and even 2008), the Dees after 2018, Pies in 2020/21 and even the Tigers took four years to kick into gear after making the 2013 finals.

There are no guarantees…

It's really common for young teams to poke their heads up before dropping down for a bit. That great cats team poked their head up, but then dropped back down before slaying the comp in 2007 and beyond. Melbourne did it - up in 2018, then back down before getting back up for the 2021 flag.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

It's really common for young teams to poke their heads up before dropping down for a bit. That great cats team poked their head up, but then dropped back down before slaying the comp in 2007 and beyond. Melbourne did it - up in 2018, then back down before getting back up for the 2021 flag.

Do you want me to spend another summer telling you that Hawthorn isn’t other clubs?

 

[iggs_hip_2024]

I think Hawthorn will regress for three years before hitting these heights again

 

[sr36]

Do you want me to spend another summer telling you that Hawthorn isn’t other clubs?

True.

Calrko has left his legacy.

The only club where emotional dysregulation and losing your shit is an admirable leadership trait. Pretty funny:

"I’m proud of our captain ... He was able to stand up and lead in a way that he can be proud of" - Sam Mitchell

"I think what I do as a leader is I always have my teammates’ back and I will stick up for them regardless of who is in the right or the wrong. It is something I pride myself on" - James Sicily

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

True.

Calrko has left his legacy.

The only club where emotional dysregulation and losing your shit is an admirable leadership trait. Pretty funny:

"I’m proud of our captain ... He was able to stand up and lead in a way that he can be proud of" - Sam Mitchell

"I think what I do as a leader is I always have my teammates’ back and I will stick up for them regardless of who is in the right or the wrong. It is something I pride myself on" - James Sicily

Get a clue.

Sicily had every right to go back at Ken after he’d targeted one of our players after the siren.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Ignore list is your friend

In a sea of dross, that poster is the only one I've ever put on ignore

 

[Vindicater]

Get a clue.

Sicily had every right to go back at Ken after he’d targeted one of our players after the siren.

Of course he had the right and at first he was fine doing it too.

Ken talked shit.
Sicily told him to shut it.
Ken then did shut it.
Sicily came back for more.

The last line is the dumb moment from Sicily.

 

[sr36]

Get a clue.

Sicily had every right to go back at Ken after he’d targeted one of our players after the siren.

Yeah. I've got no issues withGinni's smartarse tweet, or Kenny's smartarse comeback - a bit of banter is good - or Sicily having words. But he wasn't just having words, Sicily had lost his shit. He kept going whilst chairing Bruest off and nearly dropped him. Losing your shit seems to have become a thing of great pride for the Hawks leaders. It's all very Clarko.

 

[hawkman]

Should be better on paper but a tougher draw. Easter Monday will be a Cats home game at the MCG so avoid a trip down the highway. But top 6 draw says we have 3-4 away games against Port, Giants, Sydney or Brisbane.

After last night you can lock the AFL giving us 2 matches against Port next season

 

[RCAB]

Yeah. I've got no issues withGinni's smartarse tweet, or Kenny's smartarse comeback - a bit of banter is good - or Sicily having words. But he wasn't just having words, Sicily had lost his shit. He kept going whilst chairing Bruest off and nearly dropped him. Losing your shit seems to have become a thing of great pride for the Hawks leaders. It's all very Clarko.

There are no players at Collingwood right now or before who are or acted like flogs? No? Hmm, none at all?

 

[Hawkk]

True.

Calrko has left his legacy.

The only club where emotional dysregulation and losing your shit is an admirable leadership trait. Pretty funny:

"I’m proud of our captain ... He was able to stand up and lead in a way that he can be proud of" - Sam Mitchell

"I think what I do as a leader is I always have my teammates’ back and I will stick up for them regardless of who is in the right or the wrong. It is something I pride myself on" - James Sicily

Hawthorn is so far from the finished article that it would not surprise me if they entered 2025 with a completely different spine and system.

This year reminded me so much of Hawthorn circa 2006 - that team had an extremely raw Franklin, Roughead, and Lewis but tapped into players like Boyle, Barker, Brennan, Dawson, Smith, Everett and Jacobs, who weren’t around for 2008.

The real growth of that flag came from Hodge, Mitchell, Croad, Ladson, Campbell, Brown, and Osborne, who built up 50 to 100 games under Peter Schwab, plus Crawford and Dew.

My take is that the 2024 surge saw Hawthorn break through the bubble (using a system that other teams couldn’t crack) and mirror the 2007 season.

It will be interesting to see if Mitchell can replicate the Clarkson 2007-08 growth over the coming 12-24 months (who dipped back in 2009-11) before going again in 2012-15.

2006 v 2024



Edit: Hawthorn actually went into 2007 with a younger team than 2006!



Hawthorn’s current build is quite similar to the early Clarkson years (albeit with access to high draft picks)

 

[NetworkNerd]

After last night you can lock the AFL giving us 2 matches against Port next season

With our luck it will be a gather round 'home game' against Port and an away game against Port

 

[hawkman]

With our luck it will be a gather round 'home game' against Port and an away game against Port

Pretty sure the AFL can't do that

 

[sr36]

There are no players at Collingwood right now or before who are or acted like flogs? No? Hmm, none at all?

Of course there have been and probably still are. I wasn't actually saying they're flogs. Although I think you'd have to be a Hawks fan to like Mitchell.

Just wondering how Sicily losing it can be viewed as great leadership. Hawks is a different planet to where I live