- Oct 8, 2004
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St Kilda have finalised their list ahead of the 2024 Draft, delisting Jack Hayes, Ben Paton and Olli Hotton.
List Mgmt. List Management 2024-25
- Thread starter Long live PAFC
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DaTBird187
What D Farke?
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Hinkley was jealous of his luscious hair.
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Need him to have an AA calibre year.
His stupid move to the wing for half a season, really lowered his currency. Get him firing for 22 rounds, intercepting everything and hopefully we can get his value right back up where it feels like it belongs.
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Bulldust, we tried to develop a promising player. For all of Ken’s knocks, this ain’t one of them. If he played 200 games in a Back Pocket and left end of 2025 for more opportunities or midfield minutes we would all blow up for that…
- Oct 8, 2004
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Pies: 2023 premiership player Oleg Markov and forward Ash Johnson were delisted ‘with a commitment’ from the Pies to be re-listed through the rookie draft.
- Mar 26, 2007
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100% it is. It was stupid then, and stupid now. He has never done anything other than fail on the wing every time he's played there. That was fact at the start of the year and still is. He is an elite intercepting defender, it's so god damn obvious.
My problem isn't that he's leaving, it is that, he was so bad in the first half of last season, on a wing, that we know him as a hugely valuable, first round pick. But opposition sides when trading for him won't be valuing him as highly. He needs a big year for his currency to be clearly very high, if we are to lose him and maximise the trade return we get for him.
Scodges
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- Sep 22, 2023
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He doesn’t look fit or interested, he’s extremely lucky to be on the list tbh.
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He doesn’t look fit or interested, he’s extremely lucky to be on the list tbh.
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Scodges
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Needs a Boak trip to the US if he’s remotely serious.
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I don’t disagree there, needs to be the fittest bloke on the list!
With Dunkley you make a good point against my argument- he’s bigger than I thought.
With Rowbottom you prove my point- he is smaller than Drew and only 2cm bigger than JHF.
The point is, you need tough contested ball winners, not necessarily big bodied midfielders.
Schulzenfest
TheBrownDog
If Jack Hayes could stay fit he's twice the player of Ratugolea. Big if though.
- Aug 4, 2015
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Theyre going with our physios. Having our younger players head to the states to learn more about their bodies and injury prevention is a great outcome isn't it? If anything it's a win for Davies. I understand that you don't like Koch, Richardson, Hinkley, Cripps, Davies, Cornes etc etc etc but getting peeved about our fitness team accompanying young players to the states seems like you're just looking for things to be grumpy about.
If I had to name one thing that Davies has done well (since you asked) I like our recruiting team. I think up until Houston we've done well at keeping who we've wanted to keep while getting a few stars like JHF, Rozee, Butters, Bergman, Rioli etc.
FishingRick04
Brownlow Medallist
Isn’t next years draft crapola? Serves no purpose. Anchor him here
Kane Farrell a free agent next year
Haggas
All Australian
Next year is crap it's just not as deep
As fans, we look at list management with a focus on individuals, always hoping to get the best player possible in every position.
I don’t think that’s how Port see it. I suspect that Cripps and Davies look at where they want to spend the salary cap. They have made a conscious effort to use it on classy mids, key forwards and one key back. This explains:
The reality is you cannot have A-Graders in every position on the field because of the salary cap. You need to pick where you spend your big bucks. Classic error is Adelaide with Rankine- top end money on a forward. If he was a full time mid, ok but they get slightly more out of Rankine than we do Rioli for about $300,000 more per year. That means they are short changed elsewhere.
Other examples- Collingwood with Grundy, Melbourne with Grundy (especially as a second ruck) and Fremantle with Jackson/Darcy- one of them is justified but paying high end wages for two rucks when they could have had one of them and spent the rest on a star tall forward would've been much more judicious.
I don’t think that’s how Port see it. I suspect that Cripps and Davies look at where they want to spend the salary cap. They have made a conscious effort to use it on classy mids, key forwards and one key back. This explains:
- being prepared to trade Wingard (a forward) once it was clear he wouldn't put in the work to be a FT midfielder
- being prepared to trade Houston rather than pay a half back an inside mid's wage
- recruiting B Grade rucks (Soldo, Sweet), supporting tall backs (Rat, BZT) and a supporting small forward (Richards)
The reality is you cannot have A-Graders in every position on the field because of the salary cap. You need to pick where you spend your big bucks. Classic error is Adelaide with Rankine- top end money on a forward. If he was a full time mid, ok but they get slightly more out of Rankine than we do Rioli for about $300,000 more per year. That means they are short changed elsewhere.
Other examples- Collingwood with Grundy, Melbourne with Grundy (especially as a second ruck) and Fremantle with Jackson/Darcy- one of them is justified but paying high end wages for two rucks when they could have had one of them and spent the rest on a star tall forward would've been much more judicious.
Amazing when you get a good honest footballer and put him in a better system with a better coach, he was never going to make it at the Ken Hinkley football Club.
Haggas
All Australian
Narkle is not a good AFL footballer
Maybe but Hinkley is not a good coach either.
Haggas
All Australian
Agree Hinkley is a worse AFL coach than Narkle is an AFL footballer
I agree except for 3 points.
1. We didn't have to pay Houston more, he was contracted until the end of 2027 (opting out of free agency for long-term security apparently).
2. I think you are off on your assessment of Rankine, he's played 5 games above 40% CBA's this year and would have been considered an elite mid-forward if he didn't have the interruptions through suspension and concussion.
3. While you can't have A-Graders in every position, immediately capitulating when you finally have an A-grader on a beneficial contract is a laughable list strategy. Even if our first-round pick ends up as good as Dan Houston, we'll have to pay him like an A-Grader because clubs will be circling to offer a former first-rounder a big contract if we don't stump up. You don't have the 90s Chicago Bulls without that Pippen contract.
The list management team is currently paying the debt for poor drafting and development of tall players.
Our spine this year was almost entirely trade-ins (Dixon, Soldo/Sweet, Aliir, Zerk-Thatcher), not to mention Ratugolea. This is the most of any top 8 team, all the others have at least 2, most have at least 3.
Since 2012 we have drafted 19 talls (Georgiades/McKenzie and taller). Every other top 8 team this year has drafted more despite most of them already having better Tall players on their list throughout this period.
We have targeted 15 talls through trade/free agents. This is equal first of all teams, alongside Hawthorn (Who have attempted to recruit some absolute piss blasters in Vickery, Patton, and Hartigan and recruited back Gunston) and Carlton (who couldn't stop themselves when it came to GWS rejects). We don't rate drafting talls as much as other clubs, so we pay up for them in draft capital and salary.
Each of the other clubs has had late draft picks give value because they keep going back to the well.
Payne (54), Aliir (44), Stewart (40), Kolodjashnij (41), Riccardi (51), Sweet (R23), Sicily (56), Silvagni (53)
Our best late-drafted contributors are Clurey who was ok but we've put a line through, as well as Howard and Ladhams, who we traded and aren't best 22 at their new clubs. Lord might come good, we'll see.
The numbers I've worked off using draft guru and a bit of adjusting on the fly (Tom Green, Finn Callaghan are not talls but James Sicily is depsite being shorter). There are certainly some mistakes, but the difference between the other clubs and us is so stark that I think my point stands.
The question is what came first the chicken or the egg? Did we decide to not focus on drafting talls because we can't develop them, or can we not develop them because we don't draft enough?
Our spine this year was almost entirely trade-ins (Dixon, Soldo/Sweet, Aliir, Zerk-Thatcher), not to mention Ratugolea. This is the most of any top 8 team, all the others have at least 2, most have at least 3.
Since 2012 we have drafted 19 talls (Georgiades/McKenzie and taller). Every other top 8 team this year has drafted more despite most of them already having better Tall players on their list throughout this period.
We have targeted 15 talls through trade/free agents. This is equal first of all teams, alongside Hawthorn (Who have attempted to recruit some absolute piss blasters in Vickery, Patton, and Hartigan and recruited back Gunston) and Carlton (who couldn't stop themselves when it came to GWS rejects). We don't rate drafting talls as much as other clubs, so we pay up for them in draft capital and salary.
Each of the other clubs has had late draft picks give value because they keep going back to the well.
Payne (54), Aliir (44), Stewart (40), Kolodjashnij (41), Riccardi (51), Sweet (R23), Sicily (56), Silvagni (53)
Our best late-drafted contributors are Clurey who was ok but we've put a line through, as well as Howard and Ladhams, who we traded and aren't best 22 at their new clubs. Lord might come good, we'll see.
The numbers I've worked off using draft guru and a bit of adjusting on the fly (Tom Green, Finn Callaghan are not talls but James Sicily is depsite being shorter). There are certainly some mistakes, but the difference between the other clubs and us is so stark that I think my point stands.
| Clubs | Drafted Players in 2024 Spine | Talls Drafted since 2012 (191cm + ish) | Tall Free Agents/Trades (191cm + ish) in since 2012 |
| Brisbane | 4 | 25 | 13 |
| Bulldogs | 3 | 22 | 14 |
| Carlton | 3 | 23 | 15 |
| Geelong | 3 | 27 | 12 |
| GWS | 4 | 27 | 9 |
| Hawthorn | 2 | 31 | 15 |
| Port | 1 | 19 | 15 |
| Sydney | 4 | 27 | 11 |
The question is what came first the chicken or the egg? Did we decide to not focus on drafting talls because we can't develop them, or can we not develop them because we don't draft enough?
You see, this is the same bullsh!t fed to us by the likes of Kornes and the Hinkley-loving media ... Just another form of "but who else will we get" piece of rubbish!!
And yes, I am angry. Because it just keeps happening under the sickening administration at this club!
So to reply to your comment ... yes, you are right, they did have a lack of immediate options. But why the hell go back to doing the same thing over, and over again, when it was patently clear it was not working!
Try something different! Be bold with some changing positions! Put the out-of-form Rozee back as a forward! Or throw William in as a forward again! Blood some new younger players! Get some games into Lorenz and Anasta!
For God's sake try ANYTHING! That's what a good coach would do, rather than doing "the same thing over, and over again, expecting a different result!"
Insanity!
This was your fundamental flaw!
The Facebook Port supporters also love Hinkley, and think he is a great coach!
