Nick Maxwell: The next Richie Vandenberg / Kane Johnson

[THRILLHOU]

Touted as one of the most likely to get the top job at the pies, but honeslty... Are they setting themselves up with a captain everyone loves to hang shit on?

He is never going to be one of the greats of the game. He has shown heart, but he is definately not the most skilled player going around and they could find themselves in a position (with their good youth coming through) that their captain doesnt necessarily always fit into their best 22.

 

[The Final Word]

Food for thought.

I reckon a straw poll of BF members wouldn't have Tom Harley in the top 50% of captains in the comp. But he was lifting the premiership cup last September.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Its an interesting dilemma. He's a better player and has fewer injuries than Vandenburg and Johnson, and he's definitely in our best 22 in season 2008. But whether that remains the case in 2010 or beyond is the question.

He could be the next Bruce Monteith - if he leads us to a premiership I dont give a rats clacker if he leads us to a flag from the interchange bench!!!

Richmond's not a great example anyway. Wayne Campbell was a great player and a useless captain.

 

[MarkT]

This has been done to death here and on the Collingwood board.

I wouldn’t make Maxwell captain. He is a good leader, a handy player and gives a great example of endeavour and courage. They are all qualities you want from your captain but he is not quite a good enough footballer and isn’t a standout in any one position. He is the ideal VC IMO.

Scott Burns is the standout leader and by the length of the Flemington straight. Make the best captain your captain and then buy a year or two for Heath Shaw to cement his status as a player and his leadership credentials. If someone usurps him in that time then well and good but Shaw is the man I hope to see leading us long term.


PS Johnson has to premiership medals and has been a good contributor in both years his side won the flag. He is on another plane to Vandenberg. The similarity is that both men were made captains due to a lack of leadership at their clubs. If Maxwell is made captain at Collingwood I think you can apply the same analysis to Collingwood.

 

[THRILLHOU]

This has been done to death here and on the Collingwood board.

I wouldn’t make Maxwell captain. He is a good leader, a handy player and gives a great example of endeavour and courage. They are all qualities you want from your captain but he is not quite a good enough footballer and isn’t a standout in any one position. He is the ideal VC IMO.

Scott Burns is the standout leader and by the length of the Flemington straight. Make the best captain your captain and then buy a year or two for Heath Shaw to cement his status as a player and his leadership credentials. If someone usurps him in that time then well and good but Shaw is the man I hope to see leading us long term.


PS Johnson has to premiership medals and has been a good contributor in both years his side won the flag. He is on another plane to Vandenberg. The similarity is that both men were made captains due to a lack of leadership at their clubs. If Maxwell is made captain at Collingwood I think you can apply the same analysis to Collingwood.

I should say this was sparked from an article in todays sun which said that fraser and maxwell were seated either side of malthouse for the team photo... Which holland suggested it meant they could be the two front runners for the position.

 

[LeFtBehinD]

You would have to say it will be

C: Fraser
VC: Maxwell

 

[Hawkamania!]

Food for thought.

I reckon a straw poll of BF members wouldn't have Tom Harley in the top 50% of captains in the comp. But he was lifting the premiership cup last September.

Good post. Most posters believe that the best player should be captain. IMHO, the best leader of the club should be captain. He doesn't have to be a star, he needs to get the best out of everyone else on and off the field.

 

[SirJimi05]

Nah their is no way anyone could be as bad as Richie Vanders. Biggest spud the game has seen in terms of skippers.

 

[Grimreepah]

IMO a big part of captaincy is about leading by example. If you are only a so so player then it makes it harder to do that. So the best captains tend to be the very good players.

Tom Harley is the exception that proves the rule.

 

[mollyfud]

I think Collingwood can only hope that he will be the next Vanders as far as being a great Captain.

And as far as people STILL bagging Vanders playing ability, have a look at the Hawks v Crows Final from last year!

Molly

 

[THRILLHOU]

Nah their is no way anyone could be as bad as Richie Vanders. Biggest spud the game has seen in terms of skippers.

David Hille was captain for a season

But yes as far as on field displays, i can think of much greater captains that vanders...

 

[SirJimi05]

David Hille was captain for a season

But yes as far as on field displays, i can think of much greater captains that vanders...

I assume that was not a serious comment?

David Hille was chosen as skipper for one season only because our captain was injured for the season. There would have been 6 or 7 players who would be chosen as skipper before Hille even got a look in under normal circumstances but the club saw it as an opportunity to build his leadership skills and confidence.

 

[Grimreepah]

There would have been 6 or 7 players who would be chosen as skipper before Hille even got a look in under normal circumstances

Who were those 6 or 7 players?

 

[boncer34]

Who were those 6 or 7 players?

At the time?

Hird, Lucas, Fletcher, JJ, MJ, McPhee. Off the top of my head theres 6.

 

[daics cousin]

You would have to say it will be

C: Fraser
VC: Maxwell

Looks that way.
Burns for mine would be the obvious choice,although if he struggles over the year say with injuries,being possibly his last year,he may get overlooked.
Fraser and heath shaw would have been the combination i would have hoped get it after burns.Maxwell,well thre jury is still out on him,unless he completely reinvents himself this year.

 

[Grimreepah]

From an outsider's perspective I think Heath Shaw looks the best candidate. Burns is past his best, Lockyer and Fraser don't seem like strong leaders, Maxwell isn't good enough and Pendlebury is too young.

 

[SirJimi05]

Who were those 6 or 7 players?

At the time?

Hird, Lucas, Fletcher, JJ, MJ, McPhee. Off the top of my head theres 6.

What he said.

There are also a few more who probably would have been in fron of Hille also.

I am pretty sure that Hille was only entered into the leadership group at the beginning of 2006.

 

[The Final Word]

From an outsider's perspective I think Heath Shaw looks the best candidate. Burns is past his best, Lockyer and Fraser don't seem like strong leaders, Maxwell isn't good enough and Pendlebury is too young.

Not necessarily sure that that statement is true.

Collingwood believe (rightly so on their 2007 form) that they have a premiership window now. That means they select the best captain now, whoever it is and whatever their age. They have a massive responsibility as the Pies get greater media coverage and scrutiny than anyone in Melbourne. Don't give it to the guy you project to be the best captain in 3 years.

The question can be solved by a simple hypothetical to choose the captain.

A fully fit Collingwood is playing in a neck and neck Anzac Day contest with the Dons. A see-sawing affair, the Pies have turned a 10 point lead in at the final change into a 10 point deficit 18min into the 4th quarter. A young player (lets say Goldsack) is stretchered off after a heavy collision causing an extended break of 8 min (unrealistic but stay with me).

Collingwood huddles, who takes charge? Fraser? Maxwell? Burns? Rocca? Shaw? Lockyer?

I don't know the answer, but if Collingwood are serious about winning the 2008 premiership, they better not be worrying about who the 2011 captain will be at this point in time.

 

[privatopia]

Are they setting themselves up with a captain everyone loves to hang shit on?

Don't think it matters who's captain, you're all gonna hang shit on whoever it is, right?

 

[privatopia]

Not necessarily sure that that is true. Collingwood believe (rightly so on their 2007 form) that they have a premiership window now. That means they select the best captain now, whoever it is and whatever their age. They have a massive responsibility as the Pies get greater media coverage and scrutiny than anyone in Melbourne. Don't give it to the guy you project to be the best captain in 3 years.

The question can be solved by a simple hypothetical to choose the captain.

A fully fit Collingwood is playing in a neck and neck Anzac Day contest with the Dons. A see-sawing affair, the Pies have turned a 10 point lead in at the final change into a 10 point deficit 18min into the 4th quarter. A young player (lets say Goldsack) is stretchered off after a heavy collision causing an extended break of 8 min (unrealistic but stay with me).

Collingwood huddles, who takes charge? Fraser? Maxwell? Burns? Rocca? Shaw? Lockyer?

I don't know the answer, but if Collingwood are serious about winning the 2008 premiership, they better not be worrying about who the 2011 captain will be at this point in time.

OMG don't leave me hanging!!!! WHO WON???

 

[Grimreepah]

Not necessarily sure that that statement is true.

Collingwood believe (rightly so on their 2007 form) that they have a premiership window now. That means they select the best captain now, whoever it is and whatever their age. They have a massive responsibility as the Pies get greater media coverage and scrutiny than anyone in Melbourne. Don't give it to the guy you project to be the best captain in 3 years.

The question can be solved by a simple hypothetical to choose the captain.

A fully fit Collingwood is playing in a neck and neck Anzac Day contest with the Dons. A see-sawing affair, the Pies have turned a 10 point lead in at the final change into a 10 point deficit 18min into the 4th quarter. A young player (lets say Goldsack) is stretchered off after a heavy collision causing an extended break of 8 min (unrealistic but stay with me).

Collingwood huddles, who takes charge? Fraser? Maxwell? Burns? Rocca? Shaw? Lockyer?

I don't know the answer, but if Collingwood are serious about winning the 2008 premiership, they better not be worrying about who the 2011 captain will be at this point in time.

Fair enough, I understand what you're saying. But I don't think, even if your premiership cycle is now, that you should ignore the future and just focus on the now. All things must be considered. Also it depends how ready you think Shaw is. To me he seems a very strong leader already, and I can see him taking Collingwood further than a declining Burns in 2008. Of course these things are a matter of judgement and I can see why people may think otherwise.

 

[fraser25]

or The Next Tom Harley Ffs!

 

[BIGBEZ]

Id rather go to war alongside Maxwell, than the other two!