Autopsy Rd 7 vs North. Terrible loss, poor skills, never in it.

[Aphrodite]

Attention all, Judd has tonight Vindicated some of the maligned posters on here with his comments tonight.
I alluded to some mail last week and was shot down by a couple, Gardiner Stand mentioned a few things and was shot down. I can't speak on the validity of his comments but they were similar to what I had heard.

As Judd said, growth and going on about young players are inappropriate, and we don't want a loser culture.

Wins are what matters

 

[thylacine60]

 

[blue6ers]

what?

Attention all, Judd has tonight Vindicated some of the maligned posters on here with his comments tonight.
I alluded to some mail last week and was shot down by a couple, Gardiner Stand mentioned a few things and was shot down. I can't speak on the validity of his comments but they were similar to what I had heard.

As Judd said, growth and going on about young players are inappropriate, and we don't want a loser culture.

Wins are what matters

I'm confused about this...
Juddy has a pretty methodical approach and leaves his emotions at the door and you compared him to yourself and another poster who seem to emotionally shit can everything.
good one buddy

 

[Opine]

It isn't vindication at all. Its the bleeding obvious thing to say. The difference is in the context and the length of time those maligned posters you reference have been saying this stuff from way back and long before it was appropriate.
Naturally the focus is going to shift away from talking about youth and always was going to at the right time.
Nevertheless it was the youngest side. The least experienced in my memory we ever put out on the field with three of six defenders that had been functioning well out injured and no ruck. Thats not excuses its the facts. Its also a fact that for 6 weeks we performed above expectations. Its not a losing culture its an under 23's side against a lot of backs to the wall senior shinboners. In fact the longer it goes since the final siren the less important this match is to us other than as a reminder of the hard road ahead still.

It might be fact in respect of not getting the 4 points. But youth is not an excuse for the way they lost.
Also, contrary to your view that this match will be less and less important as time goes on, I think it will serve as a turning point in immediate expectation. Youth is no longer an excuse for not being competitive. Got little to do with any long road ahead; the clubs message applies to now and onwards.

 

[Opine]

Attention all, Judd has tonight Vindicated some of the maligned posters on here with his comments tonight.
I alluded to some mail last week and was shot down by a couple, Gardiner Stand mentioned a few things and was shot down. I can't speak on the validity of his comments but they were similar to what I had heard.

As Judd said, growth and going on about young players are inappropriate, and we don't want a loser culture.

Wins are what matters

Don't think he implied that wins are all that matters; but rather that youth and improvement are not to be promoted as being enough; nor as excuses for that performance.

 

[Opine]

In the words of a political legend; that was the [loss] we had to have. I think we'll mongrel up as a result of this loss.

 

[boltsbabyblues]

what?


I'm confused about this...
Juddy has a pretty methodical approach and leaves his emotions at the door and you compared him to yourself and another poster who seem to emotionally **** can everything.
good one buddy

I pointed out cryptically, that we expected to be doing far better this year, now that Juddy has publicly said it, I can confirm that it is the case. Far better.

hence the swapping of the pick with Adelaide.

 

[thylacine60]

I pointed out cryptically, that we expected to be doing far better this year, now that Juddy has publicly said it, I can confirm that it is the case. Far better.

hence the swapping of the pick with Adelaide.

 

[boltsbabyblues]

You all want mail but you don't like what you hear so you abuse and belittle people.

I don't care, I'll keep it to myself

 

[Gavstar]

I pointed out cryptically, that we expected to be doing far better this year, now that Juddy has publicly said it, I can confirm that it is the case. Far better.

hence the swapping of the pick with Adelaide.

Did we consult fortune tellers I had us bottom 4?

 

[thylacine60]

You all want mail but you don't like what you hear so you abuse and belittle people.

I don't care, I'll keep it to myself

do you actually have any idea where you are posting at the minute?

 

[Opine]

You all want mail but you don't like what you hear so you abuse and belittle people.

I don't care, I'll keep it to myself

Don't take it personally BB, its been a trying month for everyone.

 

[boltsbabyblues]

Don't take it personally BB, its been a trying month for everyone.

I'm on his side and don't want him sacked, no point and 4 years worth of things he has learnt go up in smoke, but I'm telling you he is running out of china plates at a rate of knots

 

[thylacine60]

wow - where would we be without this jimmy olsen?

 

[Opine]

I'm on his side and don't want him sacked, no point and 4 years worth of things he has learnt go up in smoke, but I'm telling you he is running out of china plates at a rate of knots

Ok we hear you.

 

[Azzurro]

Vague statements regarding obvious realities do not a bluemour make.

What else you got?

 

[mediumsizered]

The Duchess of Sussex has been delivered of a boy.

 

[AB_Blue]

So basically the playing group adopted that stupid cocky Carlton 2009 - 2013 attitude where they think they are much better than what they actually are.......and lose games we should preform strongly in

That’s an indictment on the leadership of the club




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Iamcarlton]

from what i can see he just lacks physicality...he has the skills and the speed...afl is a much better environment for him...it will help him get used to the physicality and pressure ....he will find his rhythm...he'll go backwards in the 2s... you mentioned harry ...he still doesn't give 100% from what i can see...he is a tall boy and can take marks but if he doesnt work hard it wont amount to much...defenders will work him out......LOB works hard

Big difference between a tall KPP such as Harry trying to find his way in our reserves as he was when playing there .
Than a mid such as O'Brien who would be in the thick of the action at reserves level .
Honestly don't why why some think playing reserves is detrimental to development especially if you are a mid .
In O'Brien's case being a physically underdeveloped mid its exactly where he should be imo .

 

[blue healer]

Big difference between a tall KPP such as Harry trying to find his way in our reserves as he was when playing there .
Than a mid such as O'Brien who would be in the thick of the action at reserves level .
Honestly don't why why some think playing reserves is detrimental to development especially if you are a mid .
In O'Brien's case being a physically underdeveloped mid its exactly where he should be imo .

Doesn't seem it's detrimental to the development of Kennedy.

 

[Iamcarlton]

It might be fact in respect of not getting the 4 points. But youth is not an excuse for the way they lost.
Also, contrary to your view that this match will be less and less important as time goes on, I think it will serve as a turning point in immediate expectation. Youth is no longer an excuse for not being competitive. Got little to do with any long road ahead; the clubs message applies to now and onwards.

I was hoping the Gold Coast loss was a turning point for this group with the way we lost that game .
One could have been left thinking after that game it would have left a bitter taste in the players mouths that lasted all season long .
And would be a driver in particular regarding effort levels going forward .
Yet here we are 3 weeks later and I'm hearing players are getting ahead of themselves is this true ?
Im shocked and quite devastated tbh with the effort levels that where displayed at the weekend .

 

[Iamcarlton]

Doesn't seem it's detrimental to the development of Kennedy.

Yeah he's a mid if a mid can't do well at reserves level most likely means they are just no good .
Our reserves are looking quite competitive this year so can't see any reason why a mid can't be dropped to work on their game or develop there until physically ready to step up .

 

[VainGlorious]

I think it’s a major need. Kruezer is awesome but is a 15 game player. Phillips is okay at best and Lobbe is done.

TDK is as much a forward as a Ruck.

If we can pick up a young Ruck and a Ruck ready to go from another club or state league that would be ideal

Weren’t we interested in that WAFL ruckman Scott Jones? On the Heave-Ho’s list. Anyone seen him play?

 

[blue healer]

Very easy to criticise - much harder to specifically explain practical achievable alternatives.

IMHO Silvagni inherited a **** sandwich and has done a great job in the circumstances.

As MEB_ noted we used to choose well in rookie drafts and completely screw up regular draft. We’ve had plenty of misses with rookies - other clubs have found some gems. Was hoping Agresta would bring some IP in this area - other than Gibbons I’m yet to see evidence of improvement.

Some people identify problems, others are employed to fix them.

My ability to see these problems is no greater nor less than anyone else on this board, just depends on what you choose to see. Obviously I also don't employ the fixers, just hope that both parties get it right.

I have had these same discussions about list management with posters who backed every decision made by our previous teams, sometimes I was right, sometimes I was wrong. The nett result, forgive me, is that I'm a bit sceptical about all things list management and don't hold the opinion that SOS can do no wrong.

On one hand, in your post you state that SOS has done a great job in the circumstances but then you quote MEB in noting that we have failed in the rookie drafts.

Whose job is this?

 

[blue healer]

I’ve posted this previously - reposting because IMO you’re being a little harsh when judging our trades.

In 2015 while we still had all these “guns” that we traded we actually finished bottom of the ladder with 4 wins and percentage of 64.78%.

“FWIW below is the status and age of “guns” we traded out.

Betts FA (worst year statistically in last 14 years) and on the serious downhill slide - 31
Henderson - played only 7 games last year and currently out injured with plantar fascia - 29
Tuohy - knee - nearly 29
Yarran - retired
Menzel - delisted
Bell - delisted
Gibbs - DROPPED - 30 (haven’t been to the Crows board yet - but the melts from Crows that posted how unhappy Gibbs was at Carlton and how he would be the icing on their beautiful cake must be delicious )

I don’t have time to list what we got in return but in 2 years time we’ll be thanking our lucky stars SOS had the balls to do what needed to be done.

I think the short list would be:
Charlie
Harry
Cuningham
Plowman
Philips
LOB
TDK

Edit - plus Marchbank/Lang/Pickett/Kennedy.


PS - very difficult to summarise this precisely as many trades had multiple moving parts.”

We’re still down the bottom- but with way more light at the end of tunnel than 4 years ago.

Betts left in days of MM.

But since you seem to be into lists, here's one you may be interested in:
Kerridge
Lamb
Sumner
Gorringe
Wright
Schmedts
Palmer
Mullet
O'Shea

All brought in by SOS and all delisted within 4 years for no return.

Edit: Sorry it's actually 3 years.