Discussion Round 1, Best 22

[Squizz]

Yes, when McEvoy and Rhys were missing it was a disaster.

Even when Macca was playing we were getting spanked.

We ranked 17th for average hitouts, 33.8 per game, with the opposition averaging 45.8 against us.

I just don't think we're in a space where we can afford to give the opposition quality taps (which can translate to quick inside 50 entries and pressure on our defenders) as well as higher volumes of hitouts generally.

Other teams might be able to get away with stop-gap players - I think we need two bona-fides (out of McEvoy, Stanley and Hickey).

 

[Defacto]

McEvoy needs a chop out. If Stanley is playing KPD that rules him out. Who's our relief ruckman? Blake? No thanks... surely it's a choice between Kosi and Hickey. One might grow into the role - the other is long past that point.

most clubs play a resting ruck up fwd. why couldnt stanley tag the resting ruck. fish or dempster takes the best fwd

 

[Defacto]

So who do you play on Buddy?

fisher

 

[mysainters]

Even when Macca was playing we were getting spanked.

We ranked 17th for average hitouts, 33.8 per game, with the opposition averaging 45.8 against us.

I just don't think we're in a space where we can afford to give the opposition quality taps (which can translate to quick inside 50 entries and pressure on our defenders) as well as higher volumes of hitouts generally.

Other teams might be able to get away with stop-gap players - I think we need two bona-fides (out of McEvoy, Stanley and Hickey).

That's largely because Ben was massively thrown in the deep end so young in his career.

Already this year, though it's only preseason, he has been leaping nicely and palming the ball down to our mids regularly.

Ideally he becomes the gun we know he will be, and his hitouts to advantage significantly increase.

If not, then we definitely have to have the discussion.

 

[mysainters]

So who do you play on Buddy?

Personally I'd play Rhys on him, then probably Gwilt to take Roughy, Dempster on Bruest....Fisher whoever else they play forward...but mostly drifting around and chopping off the delivery like he does best.

 

[Squizz]

That's largely because Ben was massively thrown in the deep end so young in his career.

Already this year, though it's only preseason, he has been leaping nicely and palming the ball down to our mids regularly.

Ideally he becomes the gun we know he will be, and his hitouts to advantage significantly increase.

If not, then we definitely have to have the discussion.

A gun in terms of centre bounce taps? Not sure that's realistic. His strength will be getting to contests and taking one-grab marks around the ground.

He needs really good support to ensure that he can stay fresh enough to negate the opposition at centre bounces (rather than think we're going to start winning it consistently).

 

[Rors]

Okay, here's my question: how do you think these teams would go if we were not talking about GC first up? How would they go against:

• Hawthorn
• West Coast (here or there)
• Sydney (at full strength, not like Sunday)

Because THAT, my friends, is what's going to be the difference between top 8 and bottom 10 this year.

I'll start with Sydney. Our game style works well against the Swans as we found out last year, beating them in our first meeting, then in the 2nd meeting only going down by just under 5 goals (we were only down by 4 points with 4 minutes to go & i forget whose kick to switch play completely missed the target, went out-of-bounds & Sydney goaled from the stoppage to kill all our momentum). Im confident that we can beat Sydney as long as we get the right match-ups. My concern is Tippett, he tore us apart in our game v Adelaide last year - bonus is he will only line up against us once, that being in round 21. If Rhys is fit, he plays on Reid in round 5 ANZAC game. For round 21, he goes to Tippett as he has the height & reach to match him.

West Coast problem is different as we need to stop Cox/Nic Nat when they rest forward (think they kicked 7 goals between them last year against us?). Recruiting Hickey should help with this, but have to remember he & Macca are still young & will be up against it against the gun-veteran Cox & the freakish-Nic Nat. The other key will be stop the number of rebound 50s coming from Hurn & Waters, as their booming kicks & fast ball movement burned us.

Hawthorn is different again. Last year 2 players beat us.... Buddy & Cyril.... Having them both on fire & kicking 6 goals each will never happen again, or at least thats what i hope! I would play Fisher on Buddy & have Rhys cover Roughy/Hale when they rest forward. I'd give Gears another crack at stopping Cyril, then if that doesnt work, maybe Cyril's hamstring will... I'd go with Dempster on Cyril if he rests forward, Sean always does better playing small

Feel free add your own thoughts... Im just throwing a few ideas around!

 

[sammm]

That's largely because Ben was massively thrown in the deep end so young in his career.

Already this year, though it's only preseason, he has been leaping nicely and palming the ball down to our mids regularly.

Ideally he becomes the gun we know he will be, and his hitouts to advantage significantly increase.

If not, then we definitely have to have the discussion.

He stated in the recent article that its first time in years that he has had specific training onre rucking.

 

[Defacto]

when it comes to west coast. let stanley take nic nat. big ben takes cox.almost as a run with.

fisher can take darling. gwilt takes kennedy. dempster takes lecras. gears takes masten.

 

[tim_saints]

B: James Gwilt, Sam Fisher, Sam Gilbert
HB: Aaryn Siposs, Sean Dempster, Nathan Wright
C: Leigh Montagna, Lenny Hayes, Nick Dal Santo
HF: Adam Schneider, Nick Riewoldt, TDL
F: Ahmed Saad, Beau Maister, Stephen Milne
R: Ben McEvoy, David Armitage, Jack Steven
INT: Tom Hickey, Farren Ray, Jack Newnes
SUB: Terry Milera

Roberton stiff he looked good on the weekend, Kozi out I just think we have found some better options than him at moment as much as I love the guy, Really liked Wright off half back and on the wing he looked like he could give us some really good run and set up play along with Siposs off half back. The rest sort of speaks for itself.

A tad different to other teams being posted but I think bringing in some youth and letting them start the year could do us the world of good, especially Wright, Newnes, Siposs and Hickey.

 

[Defacto]

my best 22 for round 1 if were missing montagna due to suspension and resting stanley. keep in mind that we are playing gold coast up on the gold coast, with a 6 day turn around to play richmond. for this reason i rested hayes.

B geary gilbert gwilt
HB dempster fisher siposs
C steven armitage milera
HF hyphen rewioldt schneider
F milne maister saad
R McEvoy Dal Santo Jones

I/C ray newnes hickey
Sub ross

EDIT: forgot about wright but not sure who I would take out for him. maybe swap around newnes/ross/wright a bit??

EDIT 2: second go at it:
B wright gilbert gwilt
HB dempster fisher siposs
C geary armitage milera
HF hyphen rewioldt schneider
F milne maister saad
R McEvoy Dal Santo steven

I/C ray newnes hickey
Sub ross

no jones.

 

[Saint_Dos]

So who do you play on Buddy?

Got to take a two pronged attack between fisher when deep and stanley up ground. Problem is who takes roughy or hale if fisher is on buddy. Stanley would get pushed out of way to easy.

 

[Defacto]

Got to take a two pronged attack between fisher when deep and stanley up ground. Problem is who takes roughy or hale if fisher is on buddy. Stanley would get pushed out of way to easy.

stanley on hale/roughy

fisher and dempster on buddy

geary on cyril (we know it killed us last time but i think gears needs to learn from it, maybe dempster on cyril gwilt/fish on buddy or fish/gilbert on buddy..you get the idea)

 

[stkildathunda]

How has Tom Simpkin gone from our best defenders and one first picked by Watters to appearing in about 1 out of 5 teams!!

 

[Defacto]

How has Tom Simpkin gone from our best defenders and one first picked by Watters to appearing in about 1 out of 5 teams!!

probably doesnt help you but he was never in my best 22 if all players are fit and available

happy to cop heat over it, but its just my opinion

 

[mysainters]

He stated in the recent article that its first time in years that he has had specific training onre rucking.

Really?

I reckon it's evident personally.

His timing is in sync, he is winning taps...most importantly to advantage.

Kind of backs up the comment earlier about being thrown in the deep end doesn't it, hope he flourishes with some one on one coaching.

 

[stkildathunda]

probably doesnt help you but he was never in my best 22 if all players are fit and available

happy to cop heat over it, but its just my opinion

Fair enough mate, how come u dont think he's best 22?

 

[mysainters]

How has Tom Simpkin gone from our best defenders and one first picked by Watters to appearing in about 1 out of 5 teams!!

Two words.

Rhys Stanley.

Scott clearly indicated he sees him in the defensive six, so you'd assume it's Rhys/Dempster/Fisher/Gwilt/Geary and I think the last spot (grams old role) is down to Newnes/Ray/Roberton/Simpkin/Siposs?

That's not to say there's not a spot for Simpkin, even Ferguson in the near future...it's transition years, and Fisher/Dempster are older guys on the list now so they'll get their turn at times this year you'd think.

 

[Defacto]

Fair enough mate, how come u dont think he's best 22?

my knock on him was that was not quite a mover of the ball and not quite a KPD. didnt offer much in terms of flexibility either. early on he struggled to run out games. the one game i saw live against west coast over here, simpkin was a liability. constantly caught out of position and was really struggling with the pace of the game. dempster was constantly barking at him to man up. kid is hard at it though and is still very young

rated a fit and firing gwilt better than simpkin in a similar role. also had gilbert ahead of him due to his flexibility to go through the wing/HBF/and if need be fwd. both gwilt and gilbert have more in their legs

geary has legs and can play small, run though the midfield.

dempster/fisher are obviously ahead of him.

siposs ahead of him due to his disposal and can push fwd.

 

[Saint_Dos]

Two words.

Rhys Stanley.

Scott clearly indicated he sees him in the defensive six, so you'd assume it's Rhys/Dempster/Fisher/Gwilt/Geary and I think the last spot (grams old role) is down to Newnes/Ray/Roberton/Simpkin/Siposs?

That's not to say there's not a spot for Simpkin, even Ferguson in the near future...it's transition years, and Fisher/Dempster are older guys on the list now so they'll get their turn at times this year you'd think.

Part of Simpkins spot could hinge on where geary and gilbert play. If gilbert and geary end up in the middle alot then a spot opens up but until then hard to squeeze him in unless it is as backup to Stanley if he gets taken to the cleaners but that is one less rotation through the middle.

 

[Saint Bostriots]

How has Tom Simpkin gone from our best defenders and one first picked by Watters to appearing in about 1 out of 5 teams!!

maybe because he hasn't played NAB?
i put him in my 22 in the best 22 thread. the way i see it is alot of our drive usually come from defensive runners.
simpkin can cover for players when they're on a run. as long as his not covering buddy/cloke/the real big guys by himself he rarely gets beaten. just makes sense IMO.

 

[stkildathunda]

maybe because he hasn't played NAB?
i put him in my 22 in the best 22 thread. the way i see it is alot of our drive usually come from defensive runners.
simpkin can cover for players when they're on a run. as long as his not covering buddy/cloke/the real big guys by himself he rarely gets beaten. just makes sense IMO.

He played first week didnt he?

 

[Manimal_Dunstan]

He played first week didnt he?

Nah he didn't. (Simpkin).

 

[hayes]

Part of Simpkins spot could hinge on where geary and gilbert play. If gilbert and geary end up in the middle alot then a spot opens up but until then hard to squeeze him in unless it is as backup to Stanley if he gets taken to the cleaners but that is one less rotation through the middle.

A spot would open up for a similiar type, I wouldn't say for Simpkin.

 

[stkildathunda]

Nah he didn't. (Simpkin).

Well there you go, i thought he did!! He played the full intra club week before....