Analysis The rebuild of Carlton and Brisbane and their future prospects

[a mayes ing]

Is it that hard to google?

St Kilda and Essendon great Brendon Goddard reveals Carlton offered him an AFL lifeline.



He knocked Carlton back. Probably best to read articles you are referencing.

Did you actually read the article you quoted? They were semi interested, but nothing eventuated. They didn't atually ofer him anything

My team made lots of mistakes, getting Goddard would have been another one.

Your team is in desperate need of senior players. It wouldn't have been a mistake. You don't need A graders for senior players

 

[LoungeLizard]

I have a very good memory, so i'll be reading what you post here with interest.

So if you read the article, then you would know that Carlton knocked Goddard back?

 

[Robertio]

So if you read the article, then you would know that Carlton knocked Goddard back?

I know as much as you do.

 

[btdg]

Did you actually read the article you quoted? They were semi interested, but nothing eventuated. They didn't atually ofer him anything

Your team is in desperate need of senior players. It wouldn't have been a mistake. You don't need A graders for senior players

I think Carlton has shied away from recruiting the Goddard, Hodge senior players for list profile reasons.

We already have a bunch of 30 year olds on the list - Murphy, Kreuzer, Simpson, Thomas.

All are still best 22, but probably only have a year or two left, and you never really know when Father Time will come calling. Kreuzer, for example, could go another 3 years, or cop another knee injury and end this year.

I guess we could have pushed those guys out and replaced them with players from other teams.

Where we have really fallen down is with younger role players - guys in the 24-28 age bracket. Different kettle of fish though

 

[Robertio]

Did you actually read the article you quoted? They were semi interested, but nothing eventuated. They didn't atually ofer him anything

Your team is in desperate need of senior players. It wouldn't have been a mistake. You don't need A graders for senior players

Where did i say that they offered him anything and they don't need any 34 year olds.

 

[LoungeLizard]

I know as much as you do.

No you don't, you said Goddard knocked Carlton back.

 

[a mayes ing]

I think Carlton has shied away from recruiting the Goddard, Hodge senior players for list profile reasons.

We already have a bunch of 30 year olds on the list - Murphy, Kreuzer, Simpson, Thomas.

All are still best 22, but probably only have a year or two left, and you never really know when Father Time will come calling. Kreuzer, for example, could go another 3 years, or cop another knee injury and end this year.

I guess we could have pushed those guys out and replaced them with players from other teams.

Where we have really fallen down is with younger role players - guys in the 24-28 age bracket. Different kettle of fish though

If that is true, then that is a big error on Carlton's side. 22 players in a side and only 4 senior players (1 of whome is constantly injured). You could get rid of any number of younger players for a senior player. Looko at Brisbane, we still play young kids but not to the extreme extent that Carlton are. Swap out a 18 year old for Goddard and your list improves and Cripps doesn't have to shoulder everything.

Where did i say that they offered him anything and they don't need any 34 year olds.

... You said that Goddard knocked them back, which means that they offered him something for him to knock back

 

[Robertio]

No you don't, you said Goddard knocked Carlton back.

S

If that is true, then that is a big error on Carlton's side. 22 players in a side and only 4 senior players (1 of whome is constantly injured). You could get rid of any number of younger players for a senior player. Looko at Brisbane, we still play young kids but not to the extreme extent that Carlton are. Swap out a 18 year old for Goddard and your list improves and Cripps doesn't have to shoulder everything.

... You said that Goddard knocked them back, which means that they offered him something for him to knock back

Looks like a couple kids trying to bully myself here, you got to laugh.

 

[a mayes ing]

S

Looks like a couple kids trying to bully myself here, you got to laugh.

Lol what. You made a statement, I disagree with you, put up my reasons why and the best you got is that l am bullying you... I guess l won

 

[LoungeLizard]

S

Looks like a couple kids trying to bully myself here, you got to laugh.

Oh boo hoo, the little one doesn't like being called out.

 

[Robertio]

Lol what. You made a statement, I disagree with you, put up my reasons why and the best you got is that l am bullying you... I guess l won

It all goes back to your original post, you were wrong. The post above says it all about you.

 

[doppleganger]

Nailed it, we are developing a talented core of youngsters

All clubs hope their draft picks come on.

Geelong are regularly playing 8-9 guys with u 50 games - Parfitt, Clark, Kelly, Ratagulea, Constable, Atkins, Meirs, Henry, O’Connor - whilst still winning games. They would correctly claim they are developing a talented core of new youngsters.

but the recruiting for experienced players, late picks and rookie selections under SOS has been terrible.

Yup, especially when you compare against Brisbane (the point of the thread).

The Lions draft picks show flashes of brilliance and a couple are already quality AFL players. But they are being helped tremendously by smart list management moves with the addition of ready made AFL talent.

That is why we aren’t more competitive now. SOS has used to many of the late picks and rookie draft selections on guys he was in love with in their draft years who had been injured or absent for a couple of years. Then shockingly we get them and they are injured all the time.

Yup. SoS being a club legend gives him plenty of grace with Carlton fans. Many still think he is doing a great job!

 

[btdg]

If that is true, then that is a big error on Carlton's side. 22 players in a side and only 4 senior players (1 of whome is constantly injured). You could get rid of any number of younger players for a senior player. Looko at Brisbane, we still play young kids but not to the extreme extent that Carlton are. Swap out a 18 year old for Goddard and your list improves and Cripps doesn't have to shoulder everything.

... You said that Goddard knocked them back, which means that they offered him something for him to knock back

Yes. See my previous post on this issue. We have added 24 players who would be 24-28 now. Only 5 are best 22. Add them to Cripps, Jones, Curnow and the over 30s... and it’s not enough.

There’s some mitigation in that Docherty’s injury was unlucky, and that we were screwed by Devon Smith (and unlucky to miss Shiel too). Plus some of the 24 guys we brought in - Bugg and Wright retiring early, a few others having a bad run with injuries, etc. but we have done a very poor job with targeting the right older role players.

Hence our team is very, very young and sitting last on the ladder with 1 win.

Doesn’t mean Goddard would have been better. Id argue more in the direction of guys like Marley Williams, Gary Rohan, Aaron Hall.

In the long run, the core of young midfielders and Kp players are what we have sold the fans on, and what we will build around. It sucks for 2019 though...

 

[StevoJenkins]

It all goes back to your original post, you were wrong. The post above says it all about you.

Mate, you are a complete joke. You ask "Were you there?" to try and backup your statements, then say "Kids are trying to bully myself" when you get called out.

I find it funny when Carlton supporters call some of us trolls, because at times the behavior of Carlton supporters matches exactly what they are trying to call others out for. I guess your behavior over the past little while says a lot about you.

The fact is that Carlton had the chance to pick up experienced players but didn't.

Yes. See my previous post on this issue. We have added 24 players who would be 24-28 now. Only 5 are best 22. Add them to Cripps, Jones, Curnow and the over 30s... and it’s not enough.

There’s some mitigation in that Docherty’s injury was unlucky, and that we were screwed by Devon Smith (and unlucky to miss Shiel too). Plus some of the 24 guys we brought in - Bugg and Wright retiring early, a few others having a bad run with injuries, etc. but we have done a very poor job with targeting the right older role players.

Hence our team is very, very young and sitting last on the ladder with 1 win.

Doesn’t mean Goddard would have been better. Id argue more in the direction of guys like Marley Williams, Gary Rohan, Aaron Hall.

In the long run, the core of young midfielders and Kp players are what we have sold the fans on, and what we will build around. It sucks for 2019 though...

Bugg was a literal potato, Arron Hall can barely get a game in a team that's disappointed all year, from available information it seemed that Shiel never wanted to join Carlton, the same goes for Devon Smith.

The point that we Carlton criticizers continue to bring up, is that you have too young of a team that has little experience. Now sure, you can have the belief that these young guys will get better over time, but if they grow up after getting used to losing a lot they aren't going to get that required experience to take the next step.

Look at the Brisbane rebuild that so many Carlton supporters seem to compare themselves to, even though it's a really bad comparison, the club realized our biggest hole was our defense so we got Hodge to be the on field coach of the back line. The difference between Brisbane and Carlton in this situation is that Brisbane had many players that were in the desired age bracket without trades, whereas Carlton seems to think that just getting young players and trading out the older ones for VFL quality players seems to work.

Carlton needs that Goddard, Barlow, even Jenkins, figure all around the ground because the kids seem to look like they don't know what to do, which will lead to years of pain.

 

[Robertio]

Mate, you are a complete joke. You ask "Were you there?" to try and backup your statements, then say "Kids are trying to bully myself" when you get called out.

I find it funny when Carlton supporters call some of us trolls, because at times the behavior of Carlton supporters matches exactly what they are trying to call others out for. I guess your behavior over the past little while says a lot about you.

The fact is that Carlton had the chance to pick up experienced players but didn't.



Bugg was a literal potato, Arron Hall can barely get a game in a team that's disappointed all year, from available information it seemed that Shiel never wanted to join Carlton, the same goes for Devon Smith.

The point that we Carlton criticizers continue to bring up, is that you have too young of a team that has little experience. Now sure, you can have the belief that these young guys will get better over time, but if they grow up after getting used to losing a lot they aren't going to get that required experience to take the next step.

Look at the Brisbane rebuild that so many Carlton supporters seem to compare themselves to, even though it's a really bad comparison, the club realized our biggest hole was our defense so we got Hodge to be the on field coach of the back line. The difference between Brisbane and Carlton in this situation is that Brisbane had many players that were in the desired age bracket without trades, whereas Carlton seems to think that just getting young players and trading out the older ones for VFL quality players seems to work.

Carlton needs that Goddard, Barlow, even Jenkins, figure all around the ground because the kids seem to look like they don't know what to do, which will lead to years of pain.

You can forget the insults mate they don't work. I think every Carlton supporter knows what you've just said and i expect this will happen from now on. It all goes back to 2008-2014.

 

[StevoJenkins]

You can forget the insults mate they don't work. I think every Carlton supporter knows what you've just said and i expect this will happen from now on. It all goes back to 2008-2014.

Except this time Carlton is in a bigger hole.

S

Looks like a couple kids trying to bully myself here, you got to laugh.

Also don't tell me to do things you cannot do yourself.

 

[Robertio]

Except this time Carlton is in a bigger hole.



Also don't tell me to do things you cannot do yourself.

Wasn't me throwing the insults mate, you were an hour to late.

 

[bungalow_bill]

Mate, you are a complete joke. You ask "Were you there?" to try and backup your statements, then say "Kids are trying to bully myself" when you get called out.

I find it funny when Carlton supporters call some of us trolls, because at times the behavior of Carlton supporters matches exactly what they are trying to call others out for. I guess your behavior over the past little while says a lot about you.

The fact is that Carlton had the chance to pick up experienced players but didn't.



Bugg was a literal potato, Arron Hall can barely get a game in a team that's disappointed all year, from available information it seemed that Shiel never wanted to join Carlton, the same goes for Devon Smith.

The point that we Carlton criticizers continue to bring up, is that you have too young of a team that has little experience. Now sure, you can have the belief that these young guys will get better over time, but if they grow up after getting used to losing a lot they aren't going to get that required experience to take the next step.

Look at the Brisbane rebuild that so many Carlton supporters seem to compare themselves to, even though it's a really bad comparison, the club realized our biggest hole was our defense so we got Hodge to be the on field coach of the back line. The difference between Brisbane and Carlton in this situation is that Brisbane had many players that were in the desired age bracket without trades, whereas Carlton seems to think that just getting young players and trading out the older ones for VFL quality players seems to work.

Carlton needs that Goddard, Barlow, even Jenkins, figure all around the ground because the kids seem to look like they don't know what to do, which will lead to years of pain.

Lions have had some luck here and there like Cameron and Neale wanting in and Rich belatedly turning into an elite defender.

 

[StevoJenkins]

Wasn't me throwing the insults mate, you were an hour to late.

When you insult someone by calling them a kid because they don't agree with you, that is an insult none the less. My point still stands - don't tell me to do things you do not do yourself.

 

[Hollow Knight]

Lions have had some luck here and there like Cameron and Neale wanting in and Rich belatedly turning into an elite defender.

Also had some terrible luck too, such as the injury forced retirement of Justin Clarke who was shaping as an absolute A grade fullback. He would have been peaking right now alongside Harris Andrews. Would have been amazing.

 

[bungalow_bill]

Also had some terrible luck too, such as the injury forced retirement of Justin Clarke who was shaping as an absolute A grade fullback. He would have been peaking right now alongside Harris Andrews. Would have been amazing.

True

 

[StevoJenkins]

Lions have had some luck here and there like Cameron and Neale wanting in and Rich belatedly turning into an elite defender.

Not going to say luck wasn't involved, however luck generally favors the prepared and our club prepared accordingly by employing the right strategy in order to get results. It's not over, and things can definitely go into the shitter at a moments notice, but at the moment we're on the right track due to proper preparation, drafting correctly and choosing the right players to fill a need.

 

[Robertio]

When you insult someone by calling them a kid because they don't agree with you, that is an insult none the less. My point still stands - don't tell me to do things you do not do yourself.

I'm telling you to drop off, it had nothing to do with you UNDERSTAND.

 

[Hollow Knight]

Yeah, Cameron and Neale didn't just fall into our lap. We put a serious amount of work into identifying needs and gettable players and then selling them on a vision.

 

[LoungeLizard]

I'm telling you to drop off, it had nothing to do with you UNDERSTAND.

You're still going.

Showing someone that they are wrong is not insulting them, you are just too stubborn to admit when you are wrong, then chuck the toys out of the cot when people show you up.