List Mgmt. “It’s a form of tanking” the Richmond rebuild

[RUNVS]

Why because of our new kids?
Richmond's best 22 next year:

B: Broad, Balta, Short
HB: Vlastuin, Gibcus, Brown
C: Ralph Smith, Taranto, Campbell
HF: Mansell, LeFau, Clarke
F: Rioli Jnr, Lynch, Green
R: Nank, Ross, Prestia

Int: Hopper, McAuliffe, Bauer, Banks, Trezise
Backup: Sonsie, Miller, Smith, MacIntosh, Cumberland and a few others.

2 x 32 year olds in Prestia and Lynch, Broad 31, Vlastuin 30 and Short 29. Not old.

Not an 18 year old in sight.

Is there room for top 20 talent, indeed, one or two might replace one or two, but that's because they are top end talent, so hardly a problem.

The odds of Lynch and Prestia playing the majority of the season is practically zero.

 

[Off Tap]

Going to put it out there that I don't think that they can win a game next year.

Obviously they'll likely Bradbury a team somewhere but their list is now diabolical.

Lost 3/5 of their B&F winners while the other 3 are over 30.

2025, 2026 and 2027 will be a dark time for their supporters. Good news is that they'll be loaded up before Tassie comes in.

 

[ShadowCat]

Richmond did as well as could be hoped, considering a shitty situation. Think there needs to be caution over all this draft hype though. This draft is unique in the sense that no-one can predict the Number 1 pick, even weeks out. It's an even draft, but that just means there's depth throughout without any absolute Harley Reid superstar talent available.

Also, 20, 23 and 24 are effectively second rounders after all the compo BS. So it's nice media BS, but their real strong picks (which is still a hell of a haul), is 1, 6, 10 and 11. I reckon they trade 6 and 11 for 2 and a Future 2nd (no Future 2nd if it's 18 instead of 11). So they go in with 1, 2, 10 and 18. Say that's Lalor, J. Smith, Armstrong and Faull (as an example), in the first round. That's incredibly solid, but maybe only Smith and Lalor are ready immediately. It's a long game, and hopefully it reaps dividends for them, but it's a lot to base your future on - the success of one draft. You only need to see some recent drafts to see the non-difference between rookie picks and some top-end players.

Development is key, so this will likely be a slow burn as the competition gets more and more even. Bolton, Baker, Rioli, Dusty, Grimes, Pickett, J. Graham - especially with Lynch, Hopper and Prestia all insanely injury-prone and likely not in the side for a lot of next year. It's gonna be rough in the short-term. Wouldn't surprise me if this is what gets rolled out some games (based on hypothesized drafted players):

B: Vlastuin, B. Miller, Gibcus
HB: Short, T. Young, Broad
C: Ralphsmith, J. Smith, K. McIntosh
FO: T. Nankervis, Taranto, Ross
HF: Lalor, Balta, S. Campbell
F: M. Rioli, Lefau, Mansell
INT: T. Brown, McAuliffe, T. Dow, Sonsie, S. Green

Again, all rebuilding sides that go the 'scorched earth' route, face this reality sooner or later. Will definitely depend on how they develop this new crop/if they can keep all of them without other top sides poaching them - promising immediate success.

Will watch with fascination. As this is going to mirror Tassie in a few years, except without the likely forced acquisition of a Best 22 player from 18 other clubs.

 

[Grrr]

That best 22

You might not have noticed we finished bottom of the ladder.

A bit of respect you have 7 dual or triple premiership players in there who are all playing good football or missed through injury.

Lynch, Gibcus and Clarke played 3 between them due to injury. Ross, Taranto, Hopper, Prestia missed half the season. Lefau was good before knee.

Most of the 'nobodies' were first season players like Campbell, Brown who played very well. I'm sure you had some first year players who did likewise. A few others like Ralphsmith and Mansell were good. These should all improve.

But the main point is, our new draft crop will not be thrown to the wolves, because there are behind some good young talent that is just starting off. When they are ready they will add class but will not be treated any differently to other young players.

 

[Grrr]

The odds of Lynch and Prestia playing the majority of the season is practically zero.

Why. Lynch is only 32 and is fully fit and about to do his first preseason in 3 years. Prestia finished off the season well, so he is due, but yes you cross your fingers and toes.

 

[voorhees]

Going to put it out there that I don't think that they can win a game next year.

Obviously they'll likely Bradbury a team somewhere but their list is now diabolical.

Lost 3/5 of their B&F winners while the other 3 are over 30.

2025, 2026 and 2027 will be a dark time for their supporters. Good news is that they'll be loaded up before Tassie comes in.

I would worry a little more about your own team..
you will be down the bottom end of the ladder beside us

 

[Freomaniac]

Tanking is doing it on purpose. Richmond didn't ask the 4 players to leave. We are however making the best of the situation. No doubt the media will muddle it up "they cut too hard," etc.

Richmond didnt tank, they had injuries.

Richmond won the trade period. Richmond made Adrian Dodoro a normal bloke.


Adrian Dodoro always won the trade period each year. Dodoro could only dream half the good trades Richmond done in 2024.

 

[bzparkes]

Really, if Harley Reid was in 2024 or 2025 draft, there’d be plenty of Damo types saying the tigers are tanking

There is: Dyson Sharpe.

 

[Freomaniac]

Fremantle were not what you would call a successful team under Lyon, but did make 1 Grand Final and I think had a separate Minor Premiership. Their first strong draft hand came in 2017, picks 2 & 5. Then 2019 with picks 7, 8, 9. Then 2021 with picks 8, 10, 21. And now 2024 where they have a strong hand in a strong draft and will likely leverage this to bring in at least one star player.

Dockers went 0-10 in 2016 and won only 4 games and finished 16th.

People cand debate on freo trading pick 3 to GWS. dockers got cam McCarthy, pick 8 (Griffen logue) , pick 32 (Brennan cox) and pick 72 (Luke Ryan).

that was a good trade in the end.

 

[Coach_Required]

Not sure how it can't be considered tanking when 3 players wanted out. You are a bit silly if you try and force those players to stay if they have already checked out.

It would be different if we pushed them out, we didn't do that in fact we gave all 4 players pretty good offers to stay (2 were already on great contracts). We just tried to make the best of a crap situation.

 

[bzparkes]

But we have 1/2 of a premiership team + other mature/maturing bodies to protect the kids. Unless we have a heap more injuries the team will be a mature one with a good number of young guys in. Very few stars though. SO it should be a better team than 2024 (with injuries). But likely flaky due to the number of kid and lack of top end quality.

We also have a number of premiership players(although just traded 2 out).

If you're retaining your stars, then that makes a difference.

The role players do get shown up.

Richmond did very well out of those trades, considering their hands were tied by those players leaving they'd rather have kept.

It certainly may all blow up in their face but drafting is better now than it was 10 or so years ago.

The concern would be mostly the midfield. Taranto and Hopper are honest triers but not much more, plus Hopper has been perma-injured anyway. There's not much to protect the new kids with

Having said that, most new draftees over the past few years, especially top picks, are far more developed than previous years and this current crop looks no different.

The 'burn it all down' model doesn't appear to have worked for clubs previously trying it however as for the reasons stated above, it's probably fair for Tiger's supporters to be far more optimistic about their club's chances than those who've done it before them.

 

[bradydaw91]

Until the clubs actually get more control over player movements then this is going to be an ongoing issue not just for Richmond but every other club at some stage.

Are we the only sport in the world where players dictate where they go pretty much? Like with franchise cricket players get signed for single seasons with possibility or being retained and certainly in American sports it can work for both players and clubs.

I love the NBA model where when a player has earned the right they can sign anywhere as a free agent but I also love that clubs can be ruthless and ship them off to anyone that gives them the best deal.

In the end why bother drafting players from interstate when it’s all said and done in the end they can say they want to go home but home means not at this club or that club I want this club. It should be totally up to the club to get the best deal for themselves.

Kane Cornes is so blind that he can’t understand why teams are signing people up for 7 years plus. The simple reasons are they can move money around caps easier and the club has more power when a player wants to leave.

6 plus year contracts will be the norm soon because clubs that do it hold the power and force the other team to pay up.

I think more so than ever we are going to get waves of players each year start leaving clubs that have a had a time at the top and may be on the decline that lose players trying to chase the ultimate glory.

makes sense, look at how much Freo paid overs to get Bolton.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

That best 22

It's poor if you want to win a flag or make finals. It is not winless or 14 x 10 goal smashings poor. It is stronger easily than most of the teams Richmond fielded in 2024, when they had 2 wins and just 4 x 10 goals + losses.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

The odds of Lynch and Prestia playing the majority of the season is practically zero.

Prestia played the majority of the season last year(13 of 23 games) and 19 and 20 games the 2 seasons prior.

Lynch is entering the pre-season fully fit for the first time in living memory.

They are not certain to play the majority of the season and perhaps it is not even probable, but they have a lot more chance than "practically zero."

 

[Freddy Swift]

That list of players does not exactly inspire confidence. Nankervis is a below average player, Vlastuin the same, and Taranto when at GWS at least was famous for being pretty crap when his team was playing poorly.

There is a reason Paul Roos brought in Bernie Vince and Daniel Cross when he became coach of Melbourne as he realised immediately that the team was too young. I would almost argue that without that decision Melbourne would not win the flag years later.

Vlastuin is a below average player? Are you serious or trolling?


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Dr Tigris]

We also have a number of premiership players(although just traded 2 out).

If you're retaining your stars, then that makes a difference.

The role players do get shown up.

Richmond did very well out of those trades, considering their hands were tied by those players leaving they'd rather have kept.

It certainly may all blow up in their face but drafting is better now than it was 10 or so years ago.

The concern would be mostly the midfield. Taranto and Hopper are honest triers but not much more, plus Hopper has been perma-injured anyway. There's not much to protect the new kids with

Having said that, most new draftees over the past few years, especially top picks, are far more developed than previous years and this current crop looks no different.

The 'burn it all down' model doesn't appear to have worked for clubs previously trying it however as for the reasons stated above, it's probably fair for Tiger's supporters to be far more optimistic about their club's chances than those who've done it before them.

Absolutely a group of mostly role players. Balta is a great KPD, Lynch if fit is a great KPF, Taranto and Hopper good mids. But very shallow pool, without much x factor. So we should have a season of few wins and a lots of patchy form. But hopefully also a lot of learning and little smashing around of our young players.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Vlastuin is a below average player? Are you serious or trolling?


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

I think he is serious Freddy. Frightening.