I agree he is a good player.
Other than speed, what is his point of difference?
I haven't seen him much this year, so genuine question.
List Mgmt. 2019 Draft and Trade Hypotheticals Thread
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Other than speed, what is his point of difference?
I haven't seen him much this year, so genuine question.
- Oct 27, 2007
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I hardly think pre season form is an indicator.
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He’s been very, very good. He’s quite hard at it.
- Apr 26, 2016
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Just has more composure and makes smart choices than I've seen from any of the other top-ups this year. Doesn't immediately try and get rid of the ball as soon as he's got it but tries to find a better option if there is one. And around goals he's pretty crafty in terms of side-stepping opponents, selling candy etc.
I mean he's not starring by any stretch of the imagination, but he's standing out enough from the rest to suggest he could be something. There have been quite a few occasions where he's done better than some of our listed players this year.
TheMase
Brownlow Medallist
Rayner played a couple of NEAFL games last year.
TheMase
Brownlow Medallist
Ellam definitely has something to work with. Moves bloody well for a bloke of his size.
Played only the one NEAFL game this year and had 10 disposals and kicked 2.3
Excellent.
Sounds promising.
A few of the 19s are less capable then the 18s that have stepped in this year.
Have been impressed by Martin in the backline, good composure and a lovely kick, and Gedes to a lesser extent.
Van Huisstede looks like if he gets some meat on him, he will develop into a pretty hany defender.
McGrath did some really good things last time out too, like his fierce tackling and pressure too.
Gaden has shown some good monents too.
Other then Killpatrick and McKeller, there are no other 19s up to scratch.
And plenty of the other listed players may be lucky they were playing boys when they were drafted, because now, against men, they also seem below par.
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Gee whiz tell us how you really feel!
(But in all seriousness, who are you referring to here, because I actually think everyone in the reserves for us has done about as well as could be expected of them in their first or second years.)
TheMase
Brownlow Medallist
Do you know anything about Eynaud? I thought he was very impressive last week and was happy to see him named in the bests on reflection of that.
Bottom aged. Only first outing but I was impressed.
Just a generalisation to the reference the Killpatrick looked better then some of the listed players.Gee whiz tell us how you really feel!
(But in all seriousness, who are you referring to here, because I actually think everyone in the reserves for us has done about as well as could be expected of them in their first or second years.)
I don't want to name players, but watch the willingness to tackle, the toughness to go back with the flight of the ball. The lack of physical presence and the skill level drop when under pressure.
I even watched a couple of the listed players demand to come off to rest after only a couple of efforts.
Maybe they are as good as expected, but watch the Swan's academy boys, they seem to have been developed in a harder environment.
I thought the same thing.
But flies under the radar like Olsen because of all the love handed out for Campbell and Gulden.
Boy can play.
Largely agree with this and, unfortunately, agree that Rayner has been somewhat underwhelming so far this season.
Definitely agree about Ky McGrath, I didn’t think he had an outstanding NAB League series but he’s a very good player and as close to the ‘inside bull’ as we’ve got in the Academy. Hamish Ellem is highly regarded in the Swans, very quick on the lead, excellent with the loose ball and an enormous kick. Does need to work on his overhead marking and one on one body work though. He’s 194 cm and 100kgs and I expect him to get drafted this year. Apparently there are several clubs showing an interest in him. Van Huisstede is the quiet achiever but is very solid at full back, however, the attention tends to go to Luke Parks who is a fine competitor and a very good intercept mark. Kyle Martin is a small who can play back, mid and forward. Great skills, big accurate kick but under utilised by the coaches in the NAB League games and a shame he didn’t really get an opportunity to show what he could do in the midfield.
Finally, agree with your nomination of McKellar and Kilpatrick as your Under 19 selections, certainly have showed enough to warrant some close attention for the rest of the Reserves season. However, I will add that it’s a shame that Connor Flanagan has been injured for the entire season and only returned last week. I thought he showed a lot of promise in the Reserves last year and his injury may have wrecked his chances this year.
Edit: Duh I forgot about Sam Thorne. Swans U18s captain - a small who plays in the guts and one of the few players who apparently played reasonably okay in the Allies destruction by Vic Country a couple of weeks ago. Fast, aggressive, great tackler. Does need to be careful with some of his kicking on occasion. He may well get rookied.
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I like the thinking but I'm not sure I'm on board with it - not dead set against it, but I'd focus my attention for a ruck elsewhere. He'll be 32 by round 1 next year, he's played almost 250 games. If we were in the middle of flag contention right now and Sinclair was our only impediment to going over the top, I'd be all for it. Like how we brought in Everitt in 2007 to go again for a flag (too bad it was 12 months too late, but the point remains).
I'd rather go after a younger, ready-made ruck who can grow with our core. Do what we do best with rucks, pinch a guy who's ready to blossom from another club. Archie Smith from Brisbane. Ivan Soldo from Richmond. Go after Reilly O'Brien from Adelaide - the rumours are the Crows want Brodie Grundy badly so capitalise on that and offer O'Brien a Mumford deal to be our number one guy for the next 4 years.
I'm not sure the toppies are quite there at the moment. If I look at last year guys like Bailey Stewart had NEAFL averages as follows:
Josh Stern
Sam Wicks
Killer is doing ok
Kyle OK (and a backman)
I know stats are not everything, but I think this year's NDS crop are a tiny bit behind last years. Still plenty of time though!
Josh Stern
Sam Wicks
Killer is doing ok
Kyle OK (and a backman)
I know stats are not everything, but I think this year's NDS crop are a tiny bit behind last years. Still plenty of time though!
TheMase
Brownlow Medallist
I think you’re probably right however I would add that last years crew probably had a better support network around them with Robinson, Marsh, Towers et al all regularly playing NEAFL as well which would have helped.
True, but that is a bit of a double edged sword. I recall last year those senior players used to get loads of midfield possessions, bypass the toppies completely and slam goals from 50. This year the toppies have had more of a central role, playing with a large number of young listed players. This brings it's own opportunities.
Having said all that what the recruiters look for is a bit of a mystery. If I was to speculate I would say they look at something like the following (in no particular order):
1. Players track record at NEAFL and other levels
2. Feedback from the Academy staff about character, determination, cultural fit etc
3. Their own interviews with the player
4. Player medicals and how physically resilient the player's body looks like it will be
5. Physical testing results: agility, speed, strength
6. The needs of the senior team over the next 0-10 years in terns of positions, succession etc
7. The amount of growth potential the player has in terms of physicality and speed
8. Whether the player can play the game, has the skills, can execute coaches instructions, can execute the patterns
9. Whether the player has a particular attribute that can help the senior side win premierships in the future: can be KPD, intercept marking (Harry Reynolds), outside speed (McInerny), Inside strength (Rowbottom), Two speeds
If I was to suggest to an Academy kid what to think about I would say look carefully at items 1, 8 and 9. In particular identify what key attribute they can bring to the senior side in 2-3 yrs time. Once they have identified it, then work hard on exploiting that attribute in neafl games to demonstrate they can make a difference.
TheMase
Brownlow Medallist
I would think they would be separated by:
- elite attributes (height, speed, stamina, agility) things that would be elite at AFL level. Most often you’re born with this these things, certainly your ceiling is somewhat fixed. You could get a lot of the footy or be physically developed but if you’re slow / one paced it is less likely you’ll make the grade. Scope for overall improvement (ceiling) would play a part here too and below.
- attitude / professionalism. Does the kid get the most out of themselves, do extra sessions, seek feedback and act from coaches
And then obviously list needs, though if there is an absolute stand out (best available) you’d take them anyway I would think.
I
Interesting.
I thought Stern was extremely unlucky not to get a rookie spot last year. I don’t know if it simply came down to him or Wicks but if it did I’m glad I didn’t have to decide. It must have been very close.
Yes Stern is a very smooth mover. Kicked 5 goals last week for Uni in the NEAFL. He always seems to have time and space.
Nice! Although given how Wicks has been progressing this year the Swans must be happy with their choice!
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