List Mgmt. 2024 Trade Thread - No.1

[SteeleSaints]

And the younger they are the more that asset costs.

As I said. You have to balance the cost against the job the player is coming in to do.

Shiel comes in on a 1 or 2 year deal. No obligation to play. Costs minimal

Remember, our asset hand at current:

P4, 25, 45, 78.

We are anticipating to add P5 to the above.

Membrey Paton Jones Ross and potentially Howard are the exits who may hold some sort of currency.

So when people scream they want better and younger. What are we willing to part with? Because most won’t be keen parting with our potential first 3 picks which hypothetically would be:

4, 5, 26

Agree with not giving up draft capital, what is Sheils going to cost draft wise? Are we taking on his backended contract etc?

Other teams have shown there are always midfield bargains to be had we just need to be smarter.

 

[StCicatriz]

Since it hasn’t been mentioned yet thought I will share

the time for this was last year... we need to move on.

 

[StCicatriz]

you start shedding best 22 for picks, you run the risk of losing even more than you planned on, as they go looking for a club who can play finals.

very very risky game.

when you get guys like battle you keep them. letting him go is utter madness.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

Dylan didn’t want to come to us in his prime when we wanted him so he can go and get ****ed.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

In terms of talent you hit the nail on the head, but apart from Dawson this is what that group looked like from a 2009 perspective:

Drafted in 1998 (11th season), 1999 (10th), 2005 (4th), 2003 (7th) and 2002 (8th).

Howard and Battle provide continuity that would take time to replace. One is easier to cover in that respect than two.

Baker was limited. He was not ordinary.
If you were playing on Baker, as a forward, or earlier as a midfielder , you were nullified.

 

[stavro#4]

Agree with not giving up draft capital, what is Sheils going to cost draft wise? Are we taking on his backended contract etc?

Other teams have shown there are always midfield bargains to be had we just need to be smarter.

No idea.

A fourth rounder?

A third for Shiel and a fourth?

 

[The Punter]

Baker was limited. He was not ordinary.
If you were playing on Baker, as a forward, or earlier as a midfielder , you were nullified.

I was making the point that they'd all been at the club for a while. Plugging in new defenders will take time.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

No idea.

A fourth rounder?

A third for Shiel and a fourth?

I'd rather waste two years of list space on an unlikely 18yo with huge upside but probably won't make it , than waste two years of list space on Sheil.

 

[StCicatriz]

I'd rather waste two years of list space on an unlikely 18yo with huge upside but probably won't make it , than waste two years of list space on Sheil.

i'd rather just pay battle what he is worth to retain him

 

[Diehard Saint]

Oliver's C grade footy walks into our starting midfield. With potential upside.

Worst case, Oliver takes up some front loaded salary cap, doesn't perform but we get another 1st round draft pick for him.

If we left this trade period with

3 X first round draft picks (Inc our own)
Oliver
Shiel

And all we had to give up was
Battle
Salary cap
And a 2nd/3rd round pick

I'd be beyond ecstatic.

If Oliver didn't perform for us and we traded him out there would be absolutely no way we would be getting a first round pick for him.

Edit: Sorry, do you mean we would take him and his salary and they would GIVE us a first round pick? Seems highly unlikely to me.

 

[Joffaboy]

So was that line elite prior to Ross or because of Ross?

Because I believe it’s the latter not the former - so we should have some faith he can create that with whatever it looks like in 2025 - if they do go down the path of moving Howard on.

Doesn't matter it is the best defence in the league because if the 6 moving parts, you take a third of that away and it is a recipe for disaster.
No doubt Lyon's game plan has contributed immensely to its effectiveness, however he is getting the best out of Howard and unless we get someone on a par ( Howard is in the top ten in the League for kicking efficency) we are behind the eight ball considering Battle is also probably gone.

Will put an extra load on the mids who will be quite young to be more defensive to help the defence which will affect the attack.
My view of course. Hope I am proven incorrect .

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[stavro#4]

I'd rather waste two years of list space on an unlikely 18yo with huge upside but probably won't make it , than waste two years of list space on Sheil.

If Cole and Hoffman are our projected last 2 picks. The third rounder is obsolete as we could land them with 4ths

 

[Diehard Saint]

Out goes Ross Jones Battle and Membrey and possibly an injured Crouch for Sheil and Oliver and 2 extra first round draft picks and removal of surplus salary cap for a year or two has its appeal.

Surely Lobb with come with extra compensation like 2rdp.

We could potentially have 5 picks in the first 30 in a deep but even draft...solves the issue heading into Tasmania compromised drafts.

Agree with Shiel and Lobb who are vomit producing bit like Cordy until he kicked a couple of goals last year and we were celebrating hard..

I think Membrey Crouch and Ross add little in 2025 whereas Lobb Shiel and Oliver do add more...so what's the issue?

What's a little vomit between friends....not my ideal scenario.... but watching 5 young players develop in addition to NWM Pou Wilson reminds me of watching a young Dal Clarke BJ Moose Luke Ball and even Monty play and you get that tingling feeling something good is happening at our club.

On SM-S916B using BigFooty.com mobile app

Sorry, where are you getting 2 extra first round picks?
Ours, potentially Battle compo and ???

 

[Joffaboy]

i'd rather just pay battle what he is worth to retain him

What is he worth in your view?

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Diehard Saint]

Said it before and will say it again, if we lose Battle and Howard out of the only elite line in the team we have, we are just f***Ed.
Christ, I can see the logic of pick 5 for Battle, even the logic of a Sheil to help the kids considering Jones and Crouch and Ross are probably gone, a bit like Paddy Ryder, but to neuter our backline be getting rid of Howard when he has finally come good is ludicrous
Cordy is s.hit and a stop gap, Caminiti may be ok going forward but is raw af, same with Keeler and Arie.
Please Saints don't be too smart by half with the backline. Other ways to improve the mids. Don't need to wreck the backline in the process.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

This.

 

[stavro#4]

Doesn't matter it is the best defence in the league because if the 6 moving parts, you take a third of that away and it is a recipe for disaster.
No doubt Lyon's game plan has contributed immensely to its effectiveness, however he is getting the best out of Howard and unless we get someone on a par ( Howard is in the top ten in the League for kicking efficency) we are behind the eight ball considering Battle is also probably gone.

Will put an extra load on the mids who will be quite young to be more defensive to help the defence which will affect the attack.
My view of course. Hope I am proven incorrect .

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

No it very much does matter.

Because the truth is that they became the best defensive under this coaching group.

They weren’t the inherited best defensive group.

The previous 3 years to Ross, 9th - 9th - 7th.

Under Ross. 1st and currently 5th.

Which means it isn’t necessarily true that we are going to go backwards nor does it mean that these pieces are irreplaceable.

Just need to be balanced when we view whatever they do.

 

[StCicatriz]

What is he worth in your view?

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

what ever it takes to retain him. the market has dictated his value.

 

[Diehard Saint]

what ever it takes to retain him. the market has dictated his value.

The FA market has dictated his value. You always have to pay more to win a player over. Doesn't mean the incumbent club should have to pay that.

 

[StCicatriz]

The FA market has dictated his value. You always have to pay more to win a player over. Doesn't mean the incumbent club should have to pay that.

you might have to

 

[Saint Watto]

Some of your finest work

Doc just keeps exceeding expectations.

Impressive !!!!!!!

 

[Saint Watto]

No meaningful draft capital should be surrendered in the pursuit of Shiel.

Absolutely TP.

If the club is faithful to it's narrative........we will go the to draft this year and next with all picks in tact.

 

[Saint Watto]

Look out Doc !!!!!!!

That's gold btw SE.

Very very funny.

 

[Saint Watto]

Who knows. It is just forum discussion. Hardly anything discussed ever happens.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

Funny bout that JB.....!!!!!

 

[St Neil]

Melbourne are looking to salary dump but still think Oliver can get them additional capital.
Others (17 other clubs) not too sure about that.
As BigMonty said if we got Sheil and decent capital, Oliver and decent capital, and Lobb for the lols, we could end up with 3 or 4 frdps, a couple of seconds and some coverage for our delisted/retirements/UFA's.

I am sure in the fullness of time people will go into revionist mode and say we were topping up.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

It’s been reported Oliver’s contract for the next 6 years is $10m plus pro-rata growth in the salary cap.

That’s an average of over $1.6m per year plus indexation of the salary cap. There is no way any club will take over that contract, especially with Oliver’s erratic behaviour and loss of form, unless there were massive draft pick inducements.

Melbourne will have to offer a 1st RDP for any club to take over that contract. Maybe even two first rounders with a second coming back. Oliver is worth nothing to Melbourne in terms of draft capital.

Kane Cornes said that Oliver’s contract has to be the worst ever offered by a club. Totally irresponsible. It could cripple a club’s salary cap. And on this occasion I have to agree with him Cornes. It’s a shocker.

 

[TheJackal]

No it very much does matter.

Because the truth is that they became the best defensive under this coaching group.

They weren’t the inherited best defensive group.

The previous 3 years to Ross, 9th - 9th - 7th.

Under Ross. 1st and currently 5th.

Which means it isn’t necessarily true that we are going to go backwards nor does it mean that these pieces are irreplaceable.

Just need to be balanced when we view whatever they do.

Enright, under Enright... what these guys do, with our midfield getting beaten pretty much weekly, cannot be underestimated.

We know how our amazing system falls down when Cordy comes in. Coaching helps, but we are downplaying the importance of both Battle and Howard if we think they can just be replaced with anyone.