List Mgmt. Contract, Trade & Draftee Discussion - 2022 Off Season Edition

[Keys]

Contract status of all players now fully updated

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R), Rotham, L Edwards Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Draft - Allan (Pick 16) Shanahan (Pick 30) Gross...

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[eagles rule]

I don't know either, but if I'm honest, What's the point?
What benefit is there to WC or Freo to spend big bucks in generally deprived areas ( no parent paying) to identify and develop indigenous talent that will then be snapped up by someone else with an unmatchable pre pick 40 bid if they are half decent?

If it was my money I wouldn't bother.

Most of the NGA money in remote regions is from sponsorship from BHP giving back to the community ..

 

[Get_The_Gaff]

Well…

The land for our new training base was “donated” to the club via a $1 peppercorn lease from our ex-chairman, and it’s called Brighton Homes Arena.

I’m pretty sure the Berry brothers eldest brother has a job up here with Brighton Homes, and I wouldn’t be surprised if any of our players have a brother who is a tradie, or vfl player, finds an a job with the company.

Exactly the same as McGovern's plumbing business getting the Hungry Jacks service contract or toddy nisbett being the next head of recruitment

 

[Happy Mastenator]

The draft is becoming too compromised. The next two drafts are going to be really bad, with the number of father son kids, then add the number of academy kids on top, and it could genuinely be a quarter of the kids drafted.

It's possible Gold Coast only draft out of their academy in the next two or three years, such is the quality and depth of their kids. Which is sort of the point, but your going to have a team pushing for finals, having priority access to the best KPF in successive drafts, along with quality mids and smalls.

I know we're (Lions) are going to benefit as well.


My problem with the NGA academies is they're not really being run as they were meant to be. They're not growing the game in remote indigenous communities or among immigrant communities.

The indigenous kids are already playing footy. Now I don't know if West Coast and Freo have set up academy hubs out bush (and I mean out in these remote communities) to provide extra coaching, equipment etc. Or if they are just brining talented kids down to Perth when they are 15 or 16.

In Vic, clubs spent more resources researching talented kids cultural identity and where they were born, rather than actually setting up links with migrant communities in their zones.

If I was in Victoria, my daughter would qualify as an NGA kid, even though she's already well indoctrinated in to the sport.

NGA academy’s have their issues for sure.

Not sure about lions and GC academy’s but I know the swans just play the numbers game. They suck up as many young kids as they can who have an ounce of talent then whittle those numbers down as they grow older so by the draft year they’ve got the one or two who are afl level identified.

Knowing a family or two who have gone through it, they also demand a lot from the kids in terms of time and commitments with lots of promises given. Those promises don’t hold much weight though.

 

[Obeanie1]

My problem with the NGA academies is they're not really being run as they were meant to be. They're not growing the game in remote indigenous communities or among immigrant communities.

The indigenous kids are already playing footy. Now I don't know if West Coast and Freo have set up academy hubs out bush (and I mean out in these remote communities) to provide extra coaching, equipment etc. Or if they are just brining talented kids down to Perth when they are 15 or 16.

Being an academy their role is to develop emerging elite talent. Not grow it at grass roots. Thats what Aus Kick is for.

They also look at developing talented kids who are elite in others sports such as basketball.

So basically funding and supporting elite development from existing comps and programs some that are regional.

 

[briztoon]

I don't know either, but if I'm honest, What's the point?
What benefit is there to WC or Freo to spend big bucks in generally deprived areas ( no parent paying) to identify and develop indigenous talent that will then be snapped up by someone else with an unmatchable pre pick 40 bid if they are half decent?

If it was my money I wouldn't bother.

I meant before the draft restrictions on NGA talent was introduced.

 

[briztoon]

NGA academy’s have their issues for sure.

Not sure about lions and GC academy’s but I know the swans just play the numbers game. They suck up as many young kids as they can who have an ounce of talent then whittle those numbers down as they grow older so by the draft year they’ve got the one or two who are afl level identified.

Knowing a family or two who have gone through it, they also demand a lot from the kids in terms of time and commitments with lots of promises given. Those promises don’t hold much weight though.

From the outside, and going by hearsay from parents and the QAFL clubs, our academy is very poorly run and cash strapped.

Again, from the outside, GC’s academy is about to explode in terms of talent coming through. I think they’re going to make Sydney’s academy look second rate in terms of talent production.

 

[Jumpoff Joey]

Can we just all agree the AFL is ****ed?

NGA, Trading rules and the fact the MCG extended for 50 years without consultation says it all.

I really hope some Victorian team fold and other states come into play so we dont play into the Vic centric bullshit.

 

[jatz14]

Oceansize - Like a warm familiar hug from a loved one. Nice!

* Wrong forum. Lol

Given the thread, it wasn't obvious. I think you could have bluffed your way through.

On moto g(6) plus using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[CountryLad]

Saw a tweet earlier today describing AFL house as “The Vatican on the Yarra”

Reckon it describes it well.

 

[briztoon]

Being an academy their role is to develop emerging elite talent. Not grow it at grass roots. Thats what Aus Kick is for.

They also look at developing talented kids who are elite in others sports such as basketball.

So basically funding and supporting elite development from existing comps and programs some that are regional.

I’m pretty sure that’s NOT what they were set up for. Certainly not the Vic academies.

They were supposed to help grow the game, and provide an elite pathway for two groups.

1) immigrant communities where football is not their sport of choice.

2) indigenous communities that don’t have access to equipment and coaching.

 

[Cornelius Roy]

For those wanting some WA names for next year's draft, I have 2 groupings of 5. I see Curtain, Edwards and Tholstrup as R1 picks and Sanchez and Tholstrup R2. This is likely to change as 12 months is a long time and Ginbey was probably not considered as draftable this time last year.

Curtain is my key early target as he is 195 and can play CHF/CHB. Left foot, smooth and already looking forward to partnering Oscar

Top 5 WA Prospects
Daniel Curtain Claremont
Mitch Edwards Peel
Riley Hardman Swan Districts
Koen Sanchez East Freo
Koltun Tholstrup Subiaco

Another 5 worth keeping an eye on
Tyzreise Clark Subiaco
Clay Hall Peel
Reece Torrent Peel
Xavier Walsh East Perth
Mitch Williams East Perth

We’d be blind not to prioritise his talent.

 

[Keys]

I’m pretty sure that’s NOT what they were set up for. Certainly not the Vic academies.

They were supposed to help grow the game, and provide an elite pathway for two groups.

1) immigrant communities where football is not their sport of choice.

2) indigenous communities that don’t have access to equipment and coaching.

Imagine the AFL coming up with some half thought out strategy only to find clubs manipulate the system to suit their own ends after finding loopholes wide enough to drive a truck through

 

[briztoon]

Imagine the AFL coming up with some half thought out strategy only to find clubs manipulate the system to suit their own ends after finding loopholes wide enough to drive a truck through

Yup. Without all the fuss about Jamarra, Cam Mackenzie would have been nga to St Kilda.

Mackenzie had every advantage to succeed in the sport. Why does he qualify as an NGA prospect, and how did St Kilda identify him?

 

[ziad]

Yup. Without all the fuss about Jamarra, Cam Mackenzie would have been nga to St Kilda.

Mackenzie had every advantage to succeed in the sport. Why does he qualify as an NGA prospect, and how did St Kilda identify him?

The AFL focus on numbers and audience size. The latter being the prime driver. More families involved = a bigger audience in the future. More cross overs from others sports strengthen the market share. This is the push through Auskick (the actually use the work market), and I am aware of NGA invitees form very well established footy families- but one OS born parent. Just numbers.

Development is probably over rated anyway. Those I have played with and been associated with that make AFL successfully have all been naturals and absolute standouts at U12-14. No developmental influence at all - perhaps some polish and preparation later but this is widely spread, the foudation is all in place.

 

[3agles87]

Fair chance Livingstone goes top 40.

Shows how much you know, I got intel that Santa Nesbit is getting him a tent for Christmas. Will slide to West Coast. Prove me wrong.

 

[Obeanie1]

From the outside, and going by hearsay from parents and the QAFL clubs, our academy is very poorly run and cash strapped.

Again, from the outside, GC’s academy is about to explode in terms of talent coming through. I think they’re going to make Sydney’s academy look second rate in terms of talent production.

I used to get triggered by the leg up from the academies to the expansion clubs. Especially the Swans as they are no longer an expansion club but well established.

But end of the day every QLD or NSW kid taken by the expansion teams is one less they are taking from WA or elsewhere.

Hopefully they can fill their lists with home grown talent and we get better chances at drafting WA kids and others.

 

[Obeanie1]

I’m pretty sure that’s NOT what they were set up for. Certainly not the Vic academies.

They were supposed to help grow the game, and provide an elite pathway for two groups.

1) immigrant communities where football is not their sport of choice.

2) indigenous communities that don’t have access to equipment and coaching.

Club academies are too small and underfunded to take on state wide grass roots development.

The AFL funds grass roots development. Auskick. Not club academies.

How can any club be expected to grow the code in an entire state? They cant and they dont. They assist here and there by making players available and run clinics but it is not the clubs main role.

 

[briztoon]

I used to get triggered by the leg up from the academies to the expansion clubs. Especially the Swans as they are no longer an expansion club but well established.

But end of the day every QLD or NSW kid taken by the expansion teams is one less they are taking from WA or elsewhere.

Hopefully they can fill their lists with home grown talent and we get better chances at drafting WA kids and others.

Fair chance most clubs will look in their own backyard for a while, unless there’s a significant gap between best available compared to best local available.

Fair bit of top end talent in WA and SA next year, so will be interesting how the draft pans out.

 

[The Stid]

2023 NGA prospects.

Coen Livingstone, the nephew of Hawthorn great Chance Bateman

HEIGHT​

197 cm

WEIGHT​

86 kg

AGE​

16

OSCAR HINE-BASTON

HEIGHT​

176 cm

WEIGHT​

73 kg

AGE​

17

Tyzreise Clark & Malakai Champion are part of the WC NGA right?

 

[dkalphy]

My thoughts now now the dust has settled.

Hewett was my pick back in June, when we were going to have a top 3 pick. That still hasn't changed, people talk about Allan having the highest ceiling because he's 6'4, but i believe Hewett has just as a higher ceiling as him and Phillipou. Good size at 6'1, explosive, already played WAFL league footy, and dominated Vic metro with 31 and 2 goals. That game alone told me everything i needed to see for Hewitt.

Now we add Ginbey, a 6'2-6'3 bull, perhaps a safer pick, but him and Hewett compliment each other well. They played state footy together and played with guys Like Bazzo last year. Both in line to play round 1 with Chesser.

Overally, very happy. Chesser, Hough, Culley, Ginbey, Barnett, Burgous and Hewett gives us something too look forward.

Happy to have another 2 seasons where we finish at the bottom end, before nuking back up.

 

[Schtinker]

Tyzreise Clark & Malakai Champion are part of the WC NGA right?

Yes

 

[ronpingwins]

WCE_phil

• Kobe Ryan was rated highly by you earlier in the season, was he still in the mix on draft night, or had his personality soured teams a bit too much?
• Was the choice of Hewett with our second expected by the blues? Was there any doubt about us ending up with Ginbey?
• You talked about a tall and small being available on the second night and you hoped we hadn’t promised K Smith a spot, we’re you referring to Barnett/Burgiel?

 

[Wce17]

So looking onto next year & the list changes that IMO are likely are the following.

Hurn - Retire
Shuey - Retire
Foley - Delist
SPS - Delist
Witherden - Delist
Clark - Delist

Apart from the 2 obvious retirements I feel like the other players have had plenty of chances & most of them lack pace or just aren’t good enough.

If we then need more list changes the following players would be under the pump.

LeEdwards
Rotham
O’Neil
Petrucelle
West
Winder
Trew

I really feel like most of these players need a good year. A few of them have suffered from injury, just not being given opportunities or played out of position.

We currently have good looking draft hand next year with 6 picks in a reportedly strong draft that I would be using next year which could grow with trades or FA compo. We will also have the opportunity to possibly have a crack at a young talent in the mid season draft again.

1 x R1
2 x R2
2 x R3
1 x R4

When I look at this hand plus the previous couple of draft hauls I really feel like if we nail next years draft we will be on the right track just before the tassie team comes in and comprises the draft. For all the complaining I hear I certainly feel like we have embraced the rebuild & now have plenty of young talent on the list already.

 

[Keys]

So looking onto next year & the list changes that IMO are likely are the following.

Hurn - Retire
Shuey - Retire
Foley - Delist
SPS - Delist
Witherden - Delist
Clark - Delist

Apart from the 2 obvious retirements I feel like the other players have had plenty of chances & most of them lack pace or just aren’t good enough.

If we then need more list changes the following players would be under the pump.

LeEdwards
Rotham
O’Neil
Petrucelle
West
Winder
Trew

I really feel like most of these players need a good year. A few of them have suffered from injury, just not being given opportunities or played out of position.

We currently have good looking draft hand next year with 6 picks in a reportedly strong draft that I would be using next year which could grow with trades or FA compo. We will also have the opportunity to possibly have a crack at a young talent in the mid season draft again.

1 x R1
2 x R2
2 x R3
1 x R4

When I look at this hand plus the previous couple of draft hauls I really feel like if we nail next years draft we will be on the right track just before the tassie team comes in and comprises the draft. For all the complaining I hear I certainly feel like we have embraced the rebuild & now have plenty of young talent on the list already.

Rotham and LEdwards are both contracted for 2024 so unlikely either will be delisted

If he doesn’t extract the digit, Rotham may struggle for game time and perhaps ask for a trade

Haven’t been overly impressed with the way he’s been training early days

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

O’Brien, wispy, mousy brown mop nestling above wide rimmed glasses, perched on his nose. Some wags on social media have suggested he bears a resemblance to Elton John. It’s no stretch.

Did anyone see this in the Draft recap from the club.