Review Good/Bad/Ugly vs Hawthorn, R6 2023

Who played well against Hawthorn

  • Jordon Butts

  • Jordan Dawson

  • Tom Doedee

  • Darcy Fogarty

  • Mitch Hinge

  • Chayce Jones

  • Ben Keays

  • Rory Laird

  • Ned McHenry (sub)

  • Max Michalanney

  • Wayne Milera

  • Lachlan Murphy

  • Nick Murray

  • Reilly O'Brien

  • Luke Pedlar

  • Josh Rachele

  • Izak Rankine

  • Lachlan Sholl

  • Rory Sloane

  • Brodie Smith

  • Jake Soligo

  • Riley Thilthorpe

  • Taylor Walker


Results are only viewable after voting.

Remove this Banner Ad

I’d have Murray top 5 in B and F if not top 3 currently

Watch his last ball take where he immediately takes it cleanly amongst the bedlum and actually takes steps toward the tackler to make sure it ends up a ball up rather than a rushed possession with a few secs to go

Can’t buy that kind of composure and execution from a young player

Rendell says some ridiculous stuff but when he predicted Murray a chance to be an AA in pre season I actually nodded to myself .. good call
Didn’t realise Matty made that call this year (it’s certainly possible) but I can see Murray AA over his career. Would be happy to lock him away for 3-4 years now (I think he is contracted until end of 24 from memory).

yes agree re playing it perfectly as you mentioned but his one handed smother for a ball that would have likely scored 15 seconds earlier was just as impressive IMO
 
Be interesting to see whether Soligo gets coaches votes

635 metres Gained and leading clearance winner with 8 !!!!!

Great news for our developing midfield

Carn Nicksy give him and Sloaney lots of votes , both were great
 
I always thought the thing that would let Murray down that he wouldn't be able to fix was his brain fades.

Have not seen any of these cases fades this year at all.

I always thought he had the athleticism and skills to be a great defender, but now that he's eliminated the poor decision making, he's become a serious footballer.

Butts still looks very slow to me, he looks to be carrying extra weight this year.
Agreed but he has shown extreme composure many times this year. The last 30 seconds yesterday, the one grab take, pivoting around and through 3-4 Power players and then successfully choosing correct disposal option which he executed perfectly (Last 30 seconds of showdown). His closing speed to get a punch in - from memory somebody stated he was up there as top 2 in the league for spoils I think stat was

I am not sure there are many better young KPDs in the league. Great get by Hamish and he team and all credit to the lad. Massively exciting prospect and not just a dour (elite) defensive type Talia. Could actually see Murray being used a leading or pack smashing forward at times also if we shored up our KPD stocks with HH etc
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Playing Hawthorn is absolutely not finals like football, and its definitely not like playing Geelong.
Yesterday’s game was the closest thing we’ve played to a finals game this year. That was a rare pressure game from Hawthorn — their best in 5 years and arguably one of the best pressure games by any team in some time. The stats don’t lie. That was finals like pressure. And some. It’s why I think yesterday’s win has been very underrated.
 
Be interesting to see whether Soligo gets coaches votes

635 metres Gained and leading clearance winner with 8 !!!!!

Great news for our developing midfield

Carn Nicksy give him and Sloaney lots of votes , both were great
Is Sloane playing his best footy for years? Very influential in 2 of our recent wins vs Power and yesterday perhaps BOG. At this stage it seems fait accompli he goes around again next year along with Tex. Ideally both have contracts at 50-60% of current levels so more like 400-450k if they go on. They have already established themselves $ wise and would see the need to bring in young elite but expensive talent. also both would be thinking if they hang in for 2, perhaps even 3 years there is a shot at a fairytale ending to their career, erasing the 2017 nightmare.

Perhaps Smith (assume 500k ish per year) is the first of the older trio to actually retire, esp if we get Redman (759k ish per year).
 
Agreed but he has shown extreme composure many times this year. The last 30 seconds yesterday, the one grab take, pivoting around and through 3-4 Power players and then successfully choosing correct disposal option which he executed perfectly (Last 30 seconds of showdown). His closing speed to get a punch in - from memory somebody stated he was up there as top 2 in the league for spoils I think stat was

I am not sure there are many better young KPDs in the league. Great get by Hamish and he team and all credit to the lad. Massively exciting prospect and not just a dour (elite) defensive type Talia. Could actually see Murray being used a leading or pack smashing forward at times also if we shored up our KPD stocks with HH etc
I think Murray is further evidence that you should never use a first round pick on a key defender.

Even if you look at our club alone we've shown that we can develop elite defenders from anywhere in the draft, or rookie selections. Not just once, but multiple times.

If you look at the wider AFL community, this happens all the time and is often a good place for failed forwards as well.
 
We got smothered a lot today. At least we were trying to hit up short passes at those times I guess.

A few big missed tackles. We'd been strong in this area the last few weeks. Hawks brushed past us too often.

Too many marking contests when the Hawks had the ball we allowed it to spill over the back. Meant they ran onto it and were off to the races.

In isolation a game like this is no biggie. Who cares, we won, they dragged us down to their level etc.

If we beat or even play well and lose against Collingwood today won't matter. However if Collingwood's pressure also gets to us...? Suddenly we're exposed and every team has the blueprint.

Most of our games this year have been mental on the pressure scale they use. Port were off the charts against in the 3rd quarter in particular - as were Freo. Hawks we’re going at record type numbers - and we still managed a win.

Our spread was a little down and their midfield used their size advantage against and that remains an issue. With out question Hawks set themselves to win this one - they were up and about. 9 times out of ten we lose that game. And it still highlights deficiencies we knew we have
Midfield depth is the key concern


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 
i bet we are all glad that we rested Tex and just rocked up to Tassie and got the 4 points easy as
I still would have done it.

I actually have a fair bit of confidence that if we had rested Tex, TT would have spent more time forward and slotted in nicely.

The forward system isn't really reliant on one particular player in that way. When fog was out others stepped in quite comfortably for example.

That's the beauty of this forward line.
 
Could it have been he was a little undersized...those Hawk rucks looked like big boys...when he had that goal kicked against him in the forward ruck contest, I thought he looked a lot smaller...I generally think he's got good ruck craft and I'm sure it's something he'll get better at as he puts more muscle on...
Ned Reeves is 210 CMS, 1inch shy of 7foot...both Thilly and ROB were giving away plenty of height to him.
 
I think Murray is further evidence that you should never use a first round pick on a key defender.

Even if you look at our club alone we've shown that we can develop elite defenders from anywhere in the draft, or rookie selections. Not just once, but multiple times.

If you look at the wider AFL community, this happens all the time and is often a good place for failed forwards as well.
So we'd never have picked Phil Davis, Daniel Talia or Jake Lever?

Just because of one failure to work out.

Recruiters should always stay true to their talent order regardless of position.
 
Last edited:
We got smothered a lot today. At least we were trying to hit up short passes at those times I guess.

A few big missed tackles. We'd been strong in this area the last few weeks. Hawks brushed past us too often.

Too many marking contests when the Hawks had the ball we allowed it to spill over the back. Meant they ran onto it and were off to the races.

In isolation a game like this is no biggie. Who cares, we won, they dragged us down to their level etc.

If we beat or even play well and lose against Collingwood today won't matter. However if Collingwood's pressure also gets to us...? Suddenly we're exposed and every team has the blueprint.
They need a plan for this.

Is it a different style when this happens?

I think it's perhaps a mix up in personnel first, then change the style.

They seemed to have done their homework on Laird and Dawson fairly effectively, so I would have rotated them out more. Perhaps have soligo more in the centre bounces and swapping Dawson with Hinge to give him a run through the middle. Maybe trying Rankine in there also.

Our use of Sloane sparringly in the middle has been very effective this year and I would not increase his time as I think this will lose its impact. I think the limited time in the crash and bash of the middle is allowing him to conserve his body for the 1 QTR where he can really go hard.

We need to have different combinations ready for when this happens in the future.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

I think Murray is further evidence that you should never use a first round pick on a key defender.

Even if you look at our club alone we've shown that we can develop elite defenders from anywhere in the draft, or rookie selections. Not just once, but multiple times.

If you look at the wider AFL community, this happens all the time and is often a good place for failed forwards as well.
Fair call but many truly elite KPD’s - May, Talia, Lever (3rd fister), Davis - first round and even De Koning was late first round wasn’t he? Crows haven’t buggered up a first round pick on a key defender previously with Davis, Talia and Lever but will no doubt be rightfully cautious in the future. Bicks said Mc Asey had played forward so perhaps that what we were hoping for and at the time the most “compared to current player” was Naughton which seems weird in hindsight based on massively contrasting athleticism. Clearly many clubs (Cats and various others wanting him was widely reported) got Mc Aseys prospects wrong and ultimately we suffered the consequence but thank god we got Murray around the same time and Pedlar was a bonus part of the Mc Asey pick slippage so it’s a crappy Mc Asey specific situation but with some added big bonus bits (Pedlar and Murray for free)

that said, can’t argue with a very valuable pick (#6) on someone who lacked true athleticism and esp if he did have questionable application or drive for the game. I am sure we won’t make the same mistake again for spending up so much for a KPD
 
Last edited:
So we'd never have picked Phil Davis, Daniel Talia or Jake Lever?

Just because of one failure to work out.

Recruiters should always stay true to there talent order regardless of position.
Sure it can happen and be successful, I never said it couldn't, I'd never do it though and I don't think you need to, to find a decent defender.

Its alot easier to develop a defender through other channels than any other position, with perhaps the exception of ruck.

I'd spend that pick differently and I hope we never do it again.
 
So we'd never have picked Phil Davis, Daniel Talia or Jake Lever?

Just because of one failure to work out.

Recruiters should always stay true to their talent order regardless of position.
Exactly right. It’s the first time we have buggered up a first round on a KPD after multiple AA quality players selected historically. Nobody would be complaining if pick 6 turned into another Talia or Davis type pairing with Murray. Actually, I take that back. Someone would be complaining irrespective:)
 
Jordan Dawson - an utterly shithouse game from the captain. From the moment he slotted our opening goal onwards, basically everything he touched turned to s**t. Fumbles, terrible handballs, just wow. Regroup, stop thinking you’re the next Bont and play like a leader next week.

O’Brien - terrible game from ROB, absolutely no influence whatsoever. If he even took one mark all day I don’t remember it (*checks stats - he didn’t). 0 marks on a 21 degree day with no clouds in the sky and not a breath of wind, against the bottom side. Yeah, that’s not remotely good enough, especially when your ruck work is clumsy at best.
These were interesting takes...I do recall when playing in my younger days (not at high level) that I'd have some days where everything came easy, marks stuck, hands didn't fumble or two-grab, but other days my hands were like concrete - despite the same effort put in. I'm sure this must happen to the best of them as well...although in ROB's case it's more 3 games of the horrible type, then one good one. The opposite for Dawson (one hopes!).
 
Really good video here I suggest everyone watch where David King goes through the last 2 minutes of the game and the actions by Nicks and Dawson in that period.

They had four chances to win it in the last minute. We were lucky. Soligo I think it was should have played possession footy when he had the ball with just over a minute left. Kicked long turned it over and we nearly lost as a result.
 
Commentators cheering for the hawks to waste the last 6 minutes of the game. They can get ****ed
My 8 yo son wasnt watching the game with me, he was in the room with me playing his switch, barely even looked up, but at quarter time he said that it sounded like the commentators were going for Hawthorn.
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Review Good/Bad/Ugly vs Hawthorn, R6 2023

Back
Top