Autopsy Round 14, 2024: Brisbane v St.Kilda

[gringo2011]

Caminiti as a backman has real promise. A big guy who can mark and spoil. Reckon he showed more there than as a forward and will only get better.

For his age he's a very good forward. Membrey, King and Hammer all look poor in our forward line. That's something structural when so many can't get a good run at it. I'd still prefer to develop him up forward ideally.

 

[gringo2011]

Cordy pulled pretty early probably spells the end of his afl career.

He ideal injury cover because her can play both ends.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Club hasn’t had the balls to bring any of this up without Ross fighting the fight

Bassat has the balls. He's just been doing it quietly

 

[stavro#4]

Bassat has the balls. He's just been doing it quietly

I believe he has wanted to cause anarchy and chaos and fight the fight.

But none of the above occurred prior to Ross.

 

[Parkysp]

That was it...so Max...the fans see your laziness...the coach is now talking about it in public.

Time to pull the finger out Max.

Watch Max's first effort of the evening for his intensity level. A light tag in the back of his oponent. Touch footy level.

No more excuses. I'd drop him on that one effort and not come back in until he shows Hammer levels of desperation at Sandy consistently across 4 quarters and that for multiple games.

 

[MrFoster]

So we fold like a deck of cards when the game was there to be won early - playing like the same headless chooks with shocking skills- kick some late goals when the cue is in the rack for the opposition, and now many of you are lauding Ross for playing “attacking” football and showing the media and his detractors up?!

But last week the majority here said we “didn’t have the cattle” to play attacking football?!

Another confusing day for the followers of Ross Lyon FC.

Today showed a coach out of his depth trying desperately to respond to the (rightful) barrage he copped last week.

Well, he tried to open up more. But the game was over by quarter time and our defence leaked like a sieve. He doesn’t have the skillset to coach in an attacking way. He only knows defence.

Last quarter, in desperation (and in junk time) he throws all the chess pieces in the air and the chaos catches the opposition off guard.

Amazingly, the chaos had his team score the same amount of goals in one quarter as he’d scored the entire previous game.

I think I’ll have to have another sip of the Kool-Aid and watch a genius Ross presser, while lauding the master coach’s turn of phrase.

What has our club and fanbase become?! Millionaire presidents choosing out-of-date coaches on yachts, paying them millions without a process, and we just swallow up whatever we are given.

Welcome to Ross Lyon FC.

A coach out of depth right? How do you rate our midfield compared to Brisbane’s? I rate ours bottom 2, where as Brisbane is top 6, given the circumstances (Lion’s home game, we lost 2 defenders), I reckon we did ok.

I don’t know what your expectation is.. but our list is seriously lacking.. 2020 and 2023 we had almost everything going in our way (draw, injury, other teams dropping off), you can’t be serious when you’re expecting this team to make final or even be super competitive with 1 recognised midfielder (Jack Steele) when other sides normally have 4 (Neale, Zorko, Dunkley, Mccluggage)? It’s really like taking a knife to a gun fight..

 

[kick it lace out]

Cordy pulled pretty early probably spells the end of his afl career.

Let’s hope so. Surely there’s a defender somewhere in the VFL that would offer more than Cordy does.

 

[Saints43]

Watch Max's first effort of the evening for his intensity level. A light tag in the back of his oponent. Touch footy level.

No more excuses. I'd drop him on that one effort and not come back in until he shows Hammer levels of desperation at Sandy consistently across 4 quarters and that for multiple games.

I agree that was a poor effort but he went on to have a good game and kick three goals.
Did a lot more right than wrong.

 

[Minga]

I reckon that was easily our best game for the year. Even in our wins we have been a hard watch. That was brave, fast attacking footy played on equal terms. No stifling the opposition to bring them down to our level.

It was a lesser side trying harder than the opposition. That's the shit I admire. We didn't win the match but we would have won admiration and you can see with better pieces we aren't a huge way off a grand finalist from last year on their deck.

If Lyon has them playing like that every week he's not past it. It was contemporary and enjoyable. Add some more quality on ballers and balance out that forward line a bit and there is plenty to work with. He moved the magnets around and made a few changes that worked.

That first quarter even we were a bit sloppy but didn't look a heaps worse side. Howard and a more settled back 6 and we wouldn't have leaked as much.

Really liked he addition of Campbell. If we don't play him regularly maybe chasing a Bryan or Moyle makes sense. It takes a pedestrian midfield look better. Dow and Steele will get better next year and hopefully Crouch and all of a sudden that midfield goes from horrible to competitive. LDU would look great in there.

Gonna be tough to beat Rnd 2 against the pies for best game of the year for me. Big crowd, big win against a big opponent.

Easy to forget we started the year alright, took it to Geelong in Geelong, beat the premiers on their deck, and then choked to Essendon by 4 points after being in control of the game, scraped over the line against the tigers and then lost by a point to the giants.

Very competitive, with a mix of good and bad (mostly middling) performances with the Collingwood game being the best. Next week we got drubbed with the dogs, plus a heap of injuries and the rest of the season is an ECO blur.

We got back to an attacking style last night (after a spray and uncompetitive first qtr mind you) - and it was almost the perfect game in the sense that we maintain low ladder position whilst going for the win, and played the kids.

A lot of us don’t want to hear it, but we need patience with the list and game plan - like it or not, it takes time (and a dash of luck) to develop them and there’s no easy way around it (even with handouts).

 

[SaintersUnite]

Next game:

In: Garcia, Sharman
Out: Ross, Cordy

Keep Jones as sub.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Minga]

Next game:

In: Garcia, Sharman
Out: Ross, Cordy

Keep Jones as sub.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

someone will make way for Nasiah as well

 

[Bill Crouse]

Next game:

In: Garcia, Sharman
Out: Ross, Cordy

Keep Jones as sub.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

NWM, Webster and maybe Stocker should also be available

 

[MrFoster]

Who do you suggest we replace Ross Lyon with?

Arsene Wenger, Jose Mourinho or Jurgen Klopp?

They are all great football coaches but they all struggled to get their teams to kick more than 7 goals like Ross Lyon did tonight.

I am an Arsenal fan. During Arsene Wenger’s last 2-3 years, Arsenal played very conservative football (backwards and sideways). It was super boring and made the team toothless. But he didn’t have the means to get better players either..

When Arteta came in, he also struggled.. played a similar style to Arsene Wenger with some tweaks (he also demanded higher standards but felt the same flawed players could not execute a vastly different style of football). He finished the first 2 seasons between 8-10th… but during these 2 seasons, he slowly weeded out the players who are either not good enough or don’t want to work hard.. Now the team finished 2nd last 2 seasons, both times pushing Manchester City for the chance of winning the title..

Moral of the story
1. Be patient, Rome is not built in a day.. We got lucky by getting to the final last year, but that was luck, by talent alone, we can not repeat it consistently.

2. When you don’t have enough talent on the list, play a brand they can execute is the only way.. No point play an expansive/attacking game when our mids and skills are bottom 2. We end up lose every game by 10 goals like North.. it doesn’t help anyone..

Let’s be patient and supportive of the team, including coach and president.. I believe the improvement will come, maybe not immediate.. but we’re on the right path.. Go saints!!!

 

[Bill Crouse]

Cordy pulled pretty early probably spells the end of his afl career.

You might be right, but he is contracted for next year

 

[EddieMurphy]

AFL stats

This?

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Moral of the story
1. Be patient, Rome is not built in a day.. We got lucky by getting to the final last year, but that was luck, by talent alone, we can not repeat it consistently.

58 years is more than patient.

 

[Verdun]

Game gave me faith in the clubs direction. Yep only a Saints supporter could say that after a loss, but our kids are showing promise and if get some class in the middle we will be ok.

Can anyone tell me what the 50 against us when we were about 7 points down was for??

 

[hayes]

Cordy pulled pretty early probably spells the end of his afl career.

I think he’s still useful as backup as long as his opponent isn’t over 200cm. We had no answer for Daniher last night, he was just too big for our guys until Caminiti went to him who could at least compete aerially. Even then though it was probably more the ball not going down there as much. Same thing happened against the Dogs.

We still need a second big key defender long term, Wilkie and Battle are too short to be part of a premiership backline IMO. Wilkie as the third tall is more ideal.

 

[hayes]

Game gave me faith in the clubs direction. Yep only a Saints supporter could say that after a loss, but our kids are showing promise and if get some class in the middle we will be ok.

Can anyone tell me what the 50 against us when we were about 7 points down was for??

Windhager stood about 5m over the mark. Pretty blatant stuff up, that’s pretty much always given 50.

 

[Desperate saint]

Which stats are you looking at? We won all those. We were comprehensively outmarked.

Was there last night and some observations
1)we missed NAS Bigtime his speed decision making and delivery through the middle.
2)if King continues to play like he is now-he needs to add 5kg -he is not strong enough in the core ATM for1/1 versus the key backs
3)Bonner does not need to play for us- certainly in the back half -no physical presence none- make Hilly look like a tackling machine-not even sure why Ross would have him.his miss prior to half time was crucial
4)Brisbane were elite by foot very good over head and Joe had a day out and we STILL had our chances-Lions will be good for a long time through their accamedies and Father /son
We are doing a lot right-I think it will come

 

[Jade Buddha]

Bonners delivery to King in a crowded forward line was elite. Centimetre perfect.

Sincs is back to his premium level. A lot of chat was around Neale but Sincs was bog for mine. His work and skills were head and shoulders above the rest last night.

 

[Fehring]

Adelaide have more winnable games. When I did the ladder predictor we go under them with them finishing half a game above us.

It might come down to our game v the Crows in Adelaide. I'm flying over, guys, so I think I've got us covered. Have been to 12 interstate games and have only seen us beat Gold Coast in their first 2 years and a horrendous WC team last year. I was at the Robbie Gray game.

I've got this, team.

 

[stfan]

For his age he's a very good forward. Membrey, King and Hammer all look poor in our forward line. That's something structural when so many can't get a good run at it. I'd still prefer to develop him up forward ideally.

Caminiti has been very promising so far. Unfortunately his main flaw is a common flaw with players at St Kilda...his kicking.

 

[Diehard Saint]

So we fold like a deck of cards when the game was there to be won early - playing like the same headless chooks with shocking skills- kick some late goals when the cue is in the rack for the opposition, and now many of you are lauding Ross for playing “attacking” football and showing the media and his detractors up?!

But last week the majority here said we “didn’t have the cattle” to play attacking football?!

Another confusing day for the followers of Ross Lyon FC.

Today showed a coach out of his depth trying desperately to respond to the (rightful) barrage he copped last week.

Well, he tried to open up more. But the game was over by quarter time and our defence leaked like a sieve. He doesn’t have the skillset to coach in an attacking way. He only knows defence.

Last quarter, in desperation (and in junk time) he throws all the chess pieces in the air and the chaos catches the opposition off guard.

Amazingly, the chaos had his team score the same amount of goals in one quarter as he’d scored the entire previous game.

I think I’ll have to have another sip of the Kool-Aid and watch a genius Ross presser, while lauding the master coach’s turn of phrase.

What has our club and fanbase become?! Millionaire presidents choosing out-of-date coaches on yachts, paying them millions without a process, and we just swallow up whatever we are given.

Welcome to Ross Lyon FC.

Filling a defence-sized hole of Douglas, Nas and Webster with Cordy, Caminiti and a first-gamer, Josh Battle unable to play his usual game …
OF COURSE the defence is going to be leaking.

Watching the team, and particularly the coach, is quite clearly giving you a huge headache. May I suggest you just don’t for oh, another few years, while Ross is still around.

Most of the upcoming and talented “cattle” is still young and developing, so no we can’t rely on them on them to be consistent. A lot of the older players are done - we all know this. Our midfield is not great. We know this too. That’s why performances are not going to be consistent.
5 debutants this season FHS - when last, if ever has this been done? And possibly more withMcClennan, Heath, Keeker and Hotton in the wings.

You appear to have a real chip on your shoulder about the “millionaire” president. Well, he took a risk we needed rather than sitting mired in the dirt for another decade. No guts no glory.

And yes, if you can’t be a little entertained and amused by Ross’ press conferences then you are sadly lacking a sense of humour. It’s theatre.

It’s a game. Lighten up.

I believe he has wanted to cause anarchy and chaos and fight the fight.

But none of the above occurred prior to Ross.

I don’t care who is responsible - just that it’s now being brought up at AFL house. Hope we don’t back down.

 

[St Neil]

Wilson, Collard, Hastie, Garcia, Schoenmaker, increasingly looking like the 2023 draft was an absolute bonanza for st Kilda fc.

Looks like a rare good draft for us. We need a couple more.

What we showed last night is we are capable of playing fast and daring football. Changing gears. That was heartening to see. Turnovers and skill errors killed us, but it was better to watch than the dour slog of last week.

People also forget we had them panicking at the end. 7 points down with 8 minutes remaining.

Fagan was screaming messages from the boundary and he admitted how worried he was at his post game presser. Woods’ skill error, and the subsequent 50m penalty, was a momentum killer.

Let’s keep playing that way for the rest of the year. Put Garcia and Phillipou back in the team. Play the kids, attack and score. Results for the remainder of the year are immaterial longer term.