Autopsy Round 2 = St Kilda 94-79 Collingwood

[Chrispiesssss]

Nick needs to move back to defence and do kickins asap.

 

[partypie]

Slept through this one unfortunately, or should perhaps be fortunately? From what i have gathered it was another pretty limp effort from our boys again for the third week in a row.

Top 4 is pretty much gone now, so the equation changes to winning 12-13 games out of our next 18. Doesn't seem like we even have that in us at the moment though.

Huge game next week, if we go 0-4 then were firmly into Geelong circa 2023 territory.

Kinda pissing me off that we're lending weight to all the crap the trolls supporting the other clubs have been saying about us though ngl.

 

[Ctracks]

On a serious note and and sh1t as it is right now and how the rest of 2024 looks bleak, do we set up for two out of three years for flags?

Not sure how we get back up next year but two in three years isn’t too bad?

At current rate, not even close.

 

[sr36]

They made some errors but I thought Frampton and Moore were good.

I thought the forwards were alright.

Cameron has become a good player.

But our mids are slow and sloppy at the moment getting smashed and Howe is horribly out of form.

 

[Ugene41]

Which ones has he succeeded with? I’ll let you go as far back as 2010.

Kennedy, Broomhead fmd

Like the majority of the premiership side including Murphy, Mihocek, Cox, McCreery, Maynard, Ginnivan, Elliott, Josh Daicos as picks after 30.

Then you also have first round hits like JDG, Pendles, Sidebottom.

And also trades he was responsible for like Crisp

 

[Vicky Park]

When Wright arrived at the club in 2021 (hello Rome) he, the highly experienced footy administrator, thought we needed a rebuild.

Then along comes Fly and we have two magical years of joyful, exciting, inspiring footy.

If you could criticise Fly in those years, it was his reluctance to play the likes of Reef and Macrae. But he had us humming, and a flag on the horizon.

We hear about how hard it is to win one, but do we really understand the enormous effort required, from in our case, the third oldest team to win a premiership?

So now we have a group of senior, and ageing, players who look like they’ve hit the wall. Who are 5%, 10%, off the pace of last year, getting caught, skills are down, handballs are off, tackles are sloppy, they are over thinking it and making mistakes.

We play two good teams, and an ok team tonight, and you can see the extra zip they get when on top of the reigning premier.

Can we catch up? I don’t know. But I did see some green shoots tonight. Even the chant even went up briefly in the last quarter, heard for the first time in six months at the G.

And oddly, bizarrely, with Brisbane also out of form and forced into an ill-timed bye in the crazy start to this season, I think we’re a chance against them next week.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

lol. They’re actually not easily fixed.
There was nothing to fix.

I was pointing out plays that were pure luck. Not fixable. Either goes your way or it doesn’t.
Last year it went our way more often than not, this year it’s not so far.

They were skill errors and decision making errors. The Sidebottom punch to gift Higgins a goal should have been a Sidebottom mark. He made the wrong decision and then pot luck went against him.

 

[windchimes]

They made some errors but I thought Frampton and Moore were good.

I thought the forwards were alright.

But our mids are slow and sloppy at the moment getting smashed and Howe is horribly out of form.

This. They’re far from their absolute very best, but I’m surprised by the the harsh criticism of Moore and also Quaynor. I thought that amongst our defenders, they, and Frampton as you mentioned, kept us in it for large portions of the game.

Our midfielders however aren’t covering the ground nor providing the intensity required to uphold a fast paced footy game plan. Our ball movement in transition is scrappy leading to poor turnovers or resorting to the ol’ hoof it down the line to Cox or Cameron approach we always get smashed at.

Overall the hunger seems dwindled and we are a long way off it at present, that said however, it is a long season and there’s plenty more of it play out.

 

[Defabs]

When the ARC was first in they were supposed to review every goal and if it was suspect then they’d intervene.

Has that rule been changed? Or was tonight’s game AFL endorsed corruption?

They did back in 2012. I remember they would actually go back and review the play leading up to the goal.

There was one example of this I remember and that was the SF against WCE at the G. A goal kick we kicked was disallowed because of something that happened 30 seconds prior. The system in 2024 is a bigger shambles than it’s ever been

 

[Jmac3542]

Hold your head up:

• IQ
• Maynard

Pass:

• McInnis
• Cameron
• Cox
• Frampton
• McCreery

Not terrible:

• Elliott
• Mitchell
• Hill
• Shultz
• Mihocek
• Lipinski
• Howe

Terrible:

• Josh Daicos (No intent, no pressure)
• Pendlebury (lot of dancing around for no impact)
• Nick (fumbly)
• Moore (unlike some of hus team-mates he made an effort, but skills were appalling)
• Markov (poor pressure)
• Sidebottom (no impact)
• DeGoey (Did he play?)
• Crisp

Josh Daicos terrible. Are you an idiot. Hands down our best player. 29 touches over 700 metres gained. Only played that had any impact for us at all.

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

They made some errors but I thought Frampton and Moore were good.

I thought the forwards were alright.

Cameron has become a good player.

But our mids are slow and sloppy at the moment getting smashed and Howe is horribly out of form.

Defense was great. Yes they Made some stupid errors.
But they looked far more like 2023 than previous weeks.

Frampton and Moore dominated the air for a large part. Chalk and cheese with how we defended the high ball last week.
Defence gets a hard pass this week. Not the reason for the loss.

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

They were skill errors and decision making errors. The Sidebottom punch to gift Higgins a goal should have been a Sidebottom mark. He made the wrong decision and then pot luck went against him.

Oh fmd. Are you really criticising him because he couldn’t read what was coming from the square and went to punch?
If it was the other way….sure. But I can guarantee no one gets admonished for
Punching in that scenario.
Wow.

Pretty easy call from the armchair eh?

 

[Kappa]

They made some errors but I thought Frampton and Moore were good.

I thought the forwards were alright.

Cameron has become a good player.

But our mids are slow and sloppy at the moment getting smashed and Howe is horribly out of form.

How many goals did Moore cough up with basic horrendous mistakes?

Him and De Goey need to back to basics and stop playing cute

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

How many goals did Moore cough up with basic horrendous mistakes?

Him and De Goey need to back to basics and stop playing cute

To be fair….decisions weren’t the undoing of Moore.
It was execution. The handball from the square decision was fine. But he hit it 2M left to let the player run onto it.
Thats what did him in.

Worthwhile looking at the execution as well as the decision.

Wasn’t cute last year when he hit it properly and the same play worked yeah?

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Mate

They are cooked

That’s the messed up part about this 2024 incarnation of Collingwood

Watch us beat Brisbane and everyone will think we’re back before Hawthorn goes WHACK WHACK WHACK and beats us by 47

 

[Looney]

How many goals did Moore cough up with basic horrendous mistakes?

Him and De Goey need to back to basics and stop playing cute

I've never seen a player go from champion to spud in such a short timeframe. What is going on with Moore? It's not premiership hangover because he dropped off the cliff in the second half of last year.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Oh fmd. Are you really criticising him because he couldn’t read what was coming from the square and went to punch?
If it was the other way….sure. But I can guarantee no one gets admonished for
Punching in that scenario.
Wow.

Pretty easy call from the armchair eh?

We are all making calls from the armchair. He was front and centre of goals , the punch was never going to clear the area and was always a 50/50 to end up in one teams hands or the other. He would have been better off marking and failing that mark, attracting a tackle and forcing a ballup.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Hold your head up:

• IQ
• Maynard

Pass:

• McInnis
• Cameron
• Cox
• Frampton
• McCreery

Not terrible:

• Elliott
• Mitchell
• Hill
• Shultz
• Mihocek
• Lipinski
• Howe

Terrible:

• Josh Daicos (No intent, no pressure)
• Pendlebury (lot of dancing around for no impact)
• Nick (fumbly)
• Moore (unlike some of hus team-mates he made an effort, but skills were appalling)
• Markov (poor pressure)
• Sidebottom (no impact)
• DeGoey (Did he play?)
• Crisp

Some odd calls here to be sure

Frampton was comfortably our best defender. Not even close.

Quaynor was not good. At all.

That was Josh Daicos’ best game since the Geelong game at the end of last season.

Nick terrible? Yeah he was well down on his normal output, but terrible seems way off base.

Also, you’ve gone waaaaay too soft on Sidebottom. No impact? Bro…he had a huge impact, for St.Kilda. That was probably the worst game Sidebottom has played for Collingwood. Which is staggering given last week was his worst game for Collingwood before tonight.

The rest I can mostly kinda agree.

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

We are all making calls from the armchair. He was front and centre of goals , the punch was never going to clear the area and was always a 50/50 to end up in one teams hands or the other. He would have been better off marking and failing that mark, attracting a tackle and forcing a ballup.

Unless someone was coming from the square and flew over the top to outmark him.
I do wonder what your comments would be then…?!?

Ps. If that ball takes a different bounce, would you be still so negative?

Seems like you’re basing his decision on the outcome and the benefit of replays.

 

[Vicky Park]

I've never seen a player go from champion to spud in such a short timeframe. What is going on with Moore? It's not premiership hangover because he dropped off the cliff in the second half of last year.

Darcy Moore? The one who carried injury into the GF, and when Murphy went down he rallied the defenders to play the game of their lives and keep Brisbane to 86 points. When Brisbane kicked over 100 points in their two wins against us in 2024.

That Darcy Moore? A spud? How insulting.

 

[Mollythedolly]

I rather we don’t play cox as a forward, he’s serviceable as a ruck but as a forward he’s ineffectual. Can’t think of one aerial contest he impacted I50, but his opponent sags off him and kills every high ball. Not sure what other options are available, we’re not blessed with talls, but it’s time to start thinking outside the box.

He draws a crowd. We don’t get that Hill goal without 3 going up to contest the mark against him for example. Beyond that, Marshall did a fantastic job shepherding him out of quite a few marking contests. But none of our talls had a lot of impact inside F50.

 

[PonsfordMagpie]

The season is almost done and dusted and it's barely started. Either we get our acts together sooner rather than later and we chase our tail for the rest of the season, or we're essentially Geelong 2023 where we have fleeting moments of brilliance, but are ultimately tired and underdone and we amount to nothing. It's really disappointing to be defending the premiership in this manner, but it's only reiterated why I've cherished the 2023 flag so much.

On the match itself, St Kilda destroyed us on turnover. The fumbles and poor use of the footy handed them the game essentially. This was the same issue that surfaced against GWS and Sydney. The opposition applies pressure and we can't handle the heat or transition out of D50 quickly enough. Some horrific turnovers from Moore, Maynard and Sidebottom that cost us dearly.

Our ability to transition from the back half and generate scores was our biggest strength in 2022 and 2023, so to see this aspect of our game go missing is really concerning. Looks like opposition clubs have studied us in depth and have identified ways to cut off our movement. I think the predictability in our style isn't helping us now.

The inclusions in Frampton and McInnes were pretty good. Frampton looked competent down back and stopped St Kilda's talls from taking easy marks inside 50 and McInnes was a honest and reliable forward option. Really disappointed that Fin Macrae started as the sub again. I don't think it's sending the right message to our fringe players and youngsters if we're not going to utilise him to his full extent.

There were small glimpses of what we can do well (halfway through the last quarter being a case in point), but it was too few and far between unfortunately. The squad looks underdone and tired. I've been worried that age is now catching up with us and our Premiership window might be coming to an end. Thankfully, we capitalised on last year before it was slammed shut and our veterans fell off a cliff metaphorically speaking.

The umpiring was atrocious and arguably killed our momentum in the last quarter, but it wasn't the reason for our defeat. It was our mistakes in the defensive 50 that cost us.

Doesn't get any easier with Brisbane next week. We're very likely to be 0-4 heading into Gather Round.

 

[domus]

Slept through this one unfortunately, or should perhaps be fortunately? From what i have gathered it was another pretty limp effort from our boys again for the third week in a row.

Top 4 is pretty much gone now, so the equation changes to winning 12-13 games out of our next 18. Doesn't seem like we even have that in us at the moment though.

Huge game next week, if we go 0-4 then were firmly into Geelong circa 2023 territory.

Kinda pissing me off that we're lending weight to all the crap the trolls supporting the other clubs have been saying about us though ngl.

Who cares. I laugh and say "yes, we are a crap mediocre team and we won the bloody flag! What does that say about your mob (whoever that might be)?

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

Some odd calls here to be sure

Frampton was comfortably our best defender. Not even close.

Quaynor was not good. At all.

That was Josh Daicos’ best game since the Geelong game at the end of last season.

Nick terrible? Yeah he was well down on his normal output, but terrible seems way off base.

Also, you’ve gone waaaaay too soft on Sidebottom. No impact? Bro…he had a huge impact, for St.Kilda. That was probably the worst game Sidebottom has played for Collingwood. Which is staggering given last week was his worst game for Collingwood before tonight.

The rest I can mostly kinda agree.

Josh was horrendous on defense.
Absolutely no intent, desire and 2nd efforts on defense after qtr time. Great play defensively in the first. But was absolutely woeful after that.

McCreery wasn’t far behind in the “giving up” stakes….very unlike him.
Don’t judge players solely on their offence and possessions. Josh got taken to town on the wing due to his lack of commitment to defence.

IQ was serviceable. Returned a little to his early 2023 fumbles….But wasn’t a fail at all. Replace Markov for IQ and you’re closer to the truth.

 

[ottoman]

Hold your head up:

• IQ
• Maynard

Pass:

• McInnis
• Cameron
• Cox
• Frampton
• McCreery

Not terrible:

• Elliott
• Mitchell
• Hill
• Shultz
• Mihocek
• Lipinski
• Howe

Terrible:

• Josh Daicos (No intent, no pressure)
• Pendlebury (lot of dancing around for no impact)
• Nick (fumbly)
• Moore (unlike some of hus team-mates he made an effort, but skills were appalling)
• Markov (poor pressure)
• Sidebottom (no impact)
• DeGoey (Did he play?)
• Crisp

IQ???
He was terrible.