Opinion Sack Hinkley 7 - "Turn it around or watch out"

[Byrons Firen]

Have you ever thought about dropping the "J" off your user name?

Witty... guffaw guffaw.

Your repartee's wasted here, too rapier like for us

 

[PrisonBars4life]

They managed an 'ageing' list. There was no focus on harder for longer instead they worked within an organised gameplan that relied on discipline.

Sheesh i'd go so far as to suggest there was an element of raw intelligence applied to a season that had an end goal in mind.

Donuts relies on recruiters nailing it, assistant coaches to save him from himself and committed fanatical supporters to clinch close games

with hype to cover incompetence. Everything about this man reeks of a parasitical dumb yokel fleecing it's host.

An artist who can't paint needing better paints and a conga line of yes-men lackeys to prop up his sh*tness.

In short, under this man, we're fukced.

If you guys were managing Richmond, Melbourne, or Geelong, you would have sacked all 3 premiership coaches. He got extensions in 2017 when we made the finals and 2021 when we were a kick away from the GF. I reckon 13-14 clubs would have kept Hinkley under the same circumstances and at least 2-3 others would have been a spud team that sack their coach every 3 years so they can bring in some nepotism pick and go backwards. I've seen people talk about how many more resources Hinkley has compared to 'pre Hinkley', but in the same breath will slag off the board who have regenerated the club and being able to provide those resources. I want a new coach and I think we should be putting KPIs that are almost impossible for Hinkley to meet next year but the perennial bagging of anything Port is frankly pathetic. Why should a JHF or Pickett come to Port to have a miserable bunch of pricks potting everything the club does, with an uncomfortable amount hoping we finish bottom 4? These same losers will talk about us being mediocre accepting a PF. What would any of the legend's you guys supposedly worship think about 'well we want to be good but the coach is an idiot, so we're ****ed, but if we get another coach, everything is going to be okay again'?

 

[El_Scorcho]

Poster states that maybe injuries might have had an influence on where we finished this year.

FigBooty says this is bullshit.

Poster points out that the difference between 11th and 8th was losses against Adelaide and Carlton by 4 and 3 points respectively, both where Dixon didn’t play. Asks if FigBooty is reasonable enough to accept that Dixon is worth a goal against these sides. Especially since the last time Dixon didn’t play until half way through the year was 2019 and we missed finals then as well.

FigBooty isn’t reasonable because that would require the acceptance of a world beyond their control.

Poster shrugs, suggests that this is the reason why no one sane listens to their opinions about the coaching situation, and goes about his day.

8th lmao

Carlton had Cripps out for the game against us. Is he good? Worth a goal?

Adelaide had Walker out for the game, easily their most prolific goalkicker. Is he worth a goal?

 

[Needs Gravy]

If you guys were managing Richmond, Melbourne, or Geelong, you would have sacked all 3 premiership coaches. He got extensions in 2017 when we made the finals and 2021 when we were a kick away from the GF. I reckon 13-14 clubs would have kept Hinkley under the same circumstances and at least 2-3 others would have been a spud team that sack their coach every 3 years so they can bring in some nepotism pick and go backwards. I've seen people talk about how many more resources Hinkley has compared to 'pre Hinkley', but in the same breath will slag off the board who have regenerated the club and being able to provide those resources. I want a new coach and I think we should be putting KPIs that are almost impossible for Hinkley to meet next year but the perennial bagging of anything Port is frankly pathetic. Why should a JHF or Pickett come to Port to have a miserable bunch of pricks potting everything the club does, with an uncomfortable amount hoping we finish bottom 4? These same losers will talk about us being mediocre accepting a PF. What would any of the legend's you guys supposedly worship think about 'well we want to be good but the coach is an idiot, so we're *ed, but if we get another coach, everything is going to be okay again'?

Should never have been extended in 2017. That decision when the club blinked was the moment the club confirmed they were happy to exist, happy be competitive without ever being threatening. Every decision since then has compounded the problem. Recruits both players and coaches are not coming to port because of white noise it’s because we are a club going nowhere, stuck where the AFL and sadly our board want us competitive without being a threat.

 

[El_Scorcho]

If you guys were managing Richmond, Melbourne, or Geelong, you would have sacked all 3 premiership coaches. He got extensions in 2017 when we made the finals and 2021 when we were a kick away from the GF. I reckon 13-14 clubs would have kept Hinkley under the same circumstances and at least 2-3 others would have been a spud team that sack their coach every 3 years so they can bring in some nepotism pick and go backwards. I've seen people talk about how many more resources Hinkley has compared to 'pre Hinkley', but in the same breath will slag off the board who have regenerated the club and being able to provide those resources. I want a new coach and I think we should be putting KPIs that are almost impossible for Hinkley to meet next year but the perennial bagging of anything Port is frankly pathetic. Why should a JHF or Pickett come to Port to have a miserable bunch of pricks potting everything the club does, with an uncomfortable amount hoping we finish bottom 4? These same losers will talk about us being mediocre accepting a PF. What would any of the legend's you guys supposedly worship think about 'well we want to be good but the coach is an idiot, so we're *ed, but if we get another coach, everything is going to be okay again'?

No club has ever endured mediocrity as long. The idea that 13-14 other clubs would have kept him is laughable when no other club in the history of the league has kept a coach for this long without a GF.

The extensions were ridiculous and unnecessary. He got a long extension in 2017 after 3 failed seasons. A good club wouldn't have given him a long extension after 2017 and at the absolute latest he'd have been sacked in 2018. A great club would have sacked him after 2016 despite any contract.

 

[PrisonBars4life]

Should never have been extended in 2017. That decision when the club blinked was the moment the club confirmed they were happy to exist, happy be competitive without ever being threatening. Every decision since then has compounded the problem. Recruits both players and coaches are not coming to port because of white noise it’s because we are a club going nowhere, stuck where the AFL and sadly our board want us competitive without being a threat.

Maybe, but at that stage we made finals in 3 out of 5 seasons, including the current one. I suspect the effect of the 2013/14 turnaround was still there. I'll again state that lots of teams would have renewed. Finish 5th, get done after the siren in extra time. Not sure too many coaches get handed their marching orders under those circumstances. The length was probably a year too generous. By the time 2021 had come around he had completely rejuvenated the list having taken a massive punt on the draft. The board's actions don't scream the level of incompetence that plenty of supporters on here suggest. Hinkley has had a knack of doing just enough at the right time to hang on.

 

[PrisonBars4life]

No club has ever endured mediocrity as long. The idea that 13-14 other clubs would have kept him is laughable when no other club in the history of the league has kept a club for this long without a GF.

The extensions were ridiculous and unnecessary. He got a long extension in 2017 after 3 failed seasons. A good club wouldn't have given him a long extension after 2017 and at the absolute latest he'd have been sacked in 2018. A great club would have sacked him after 2016 despite any contract.

We lost to two triple premiership teams by a goal in a Prelim. Ross Lyon was in the system forever without a flag and would likely get another coaching role if he wanted it. Scott inherited an unbeatable side and until last weekend had choked in at least half of the final's series Geelong were involved in. Rattan has got 2 gigs without much success. Hird is being taken seriously for the Essendon job. Voss got a second gig. There are plenty of Hinkley tier coaches that have survived a long time in the system. Hinkley wasn't the longest serving coach without a GF in 2017 and 2021. Coaches that make finals 60% of the time generally don't get sacked after 5 years. They definitely don't get sacked after losing to the premier by a goal in a PF.

 

[El_Scorcho]

We lost to two triple premiership teams by a goal in a Prelim. Ross Lyon was in the system forever without a flag and would likely get another coaching role if he wanted it. Scott inherited an unbeatable side and until last weekend had choked in at least half of the final's series Geelong were involved in. Rattan has got 2 gigs without much success. Hird is being taken seriously for the Essendon job. Voss got a second gig. There are plenty of Hinkley tier coaches that have survived a long time in the system. Hinkley wasn't the longest serving coach without a GF in 2017 and 2021. Coaches that make finals 60% of the time generally don't get sacked after 5 years. They definitely don't get sacked after losing to the premier by a goal in a PF.

In 2016 we'd just burned 2 seasons in a row. We then made the 8 with a soft draw and then got bundled out week 1 against the 8th place side, followed by 2 more seasons where we missed the 8.

That's an absolutely indefensible 5 years. No coach at any club anywhere would have survived that 5 years apart from Hinkley at Port.

No coach at any club would have survived 2022 apart from Hinkley at Port. It's unprecedented. The mediocrity our club accepts is unprecedented.

 

[El_Scorcho]

Coaches that make finals 60% of the time generally don't get sacked after 5 years.

This is the most generous assessment of the situation at the end of 2017 possible, given the state of the list and the performances. It was 3 failed seasons on the trot.

He certainly shouldn't have gotten a long extension at that stage with the softest performance clauses imaginable.

 

[PrisonBars4life]

In 2016 we'd just burned 2 seasons in a row. We then made the 8 with a soft draw and then got bundled out week 1 against the 8th place side, followed by 2 more seasons where we missed the 8.

That's an absolutely indefensible 5 years. No coach at any club anywhere would have survived that 5 years apart from Hinkley at Port.

No coach at any club would have survived 2022 apart from Hinkley at Port. It's unprecedented. The mediocrity our club accepts is unprecedented.

Plenty of coaches would have survived 2017. Not sure too many coaches from battler clubs sack coaches with more than a year to run on their contracts so 2019 is out and by the end of 2020, we looked back in business. People keep on saying no one would make the same decision, but there is every reason to think that in 2017, 2019, 2020, 2022 the same decisions would be made by a lot of clubs. He's found a way to yoyo at the right time. That certainly wasn't a pattern in 2017 and again, 2019/20 we're not sacking him.

 

[El_Scorcho]

Plenty of coaches would have survived 2017. Not sure too many coaches from battler clubs sack coaches with more than a year to run on their contracts so 2019 is out and by the end of 2020, we looked back in business. People keep on saying no one would make the same decision, but there is every reason to think that in 2017, 2019, 2020, 2022 the same decisions would be made by a lot of clubs. He's found a way to yoyo at the right time. That certainly wasn't a pattern in 2017 and again, 2019/20 we're not sacking him.

Surviving is one thing, but how many clubs would have handed out a long extension after 2017? You're just arguing that the club has repeatedly hamstrung itself with irresponsible contract extensions.

Even after 2020, we've had our first good year in 6 in one of the most unusual, compromised years of all time where we had an excellent injury run and huge home ground advantages. Another multiple year extension.

No other coach survives 2022. 10 years, no Grand Finals, and we react to one of the worst losses in our history in the PF by starting 0-5 and missing the 8.

A better run club doesn't hand out the early long extension in 2014 and sacks him after 2016. Or it lets him walk in 2017. Or it sacks him in 2018 or 2019 because it hasn't put itself in a position where a bad coach has multiple years left on his deal in an untenable position.

 

[PrisonBars4life]

Surviving is one thing, but how many clubs would have handed out a long extension after 2017? You're just arguing that the club has repeatedly hamstrung itself with irresponsible contract extensions.

Even after 2020, we've had our first good year in 6 in one of the most unusual, compromised years of all time where we had an excellent injury run and huge home ground advantages. Another multiple year extension.

No other coach survives 2022. 10 years, no Grand Finals, and we react to one of the worst losses in our history in the PF by starting 0-5 and missing the 8.

A better run club doesn't hand out the early long extension in 2014 and sacks him after 2016. Or it lets him walk in 2017. Or it sacks him in 2018 or 2019 because it hasn't put itself in a position where a bad coach has multiple years left on his deal in an untenable position.

2014 i'd say you do. 2017, we arguably gave him an extra year, which I have admitted. Again, these early sackings wouldn't happen at a club with our financial position. I guess the counter to that is a club in our financial position would have been wary about a long contract. From memory we gave him 4 years in 2017 which means sacking him in 2019 is 2 years early. Even a 3-year deal (which I think would have been fair) means he survives to 2020(you're not going pay 2 coaches for a full year) at which point he gets extended again. You would obviously realize if you sack Hinkley in 2017, 18, 19, that you don't necessarily get to keep the list we have yes? Lots of players we needed to keep resisted larger offers. Wines, SPP, Dixon were very gettable and you don't know about others. He approved the moving on of 2 of our best players in 2018 (which turned out to be a very good decision) so we may not have even drafted Rozee, Butters, Duursma. People keep on saying we have underachieved with our list, he's a big part of keeping that list together. If you are disloyal to people that were 'close' to successful you can't expect loyalty from the players.

Hinkley is a mid-tier coach. He's not great, but terrible coaches don't have the Home and Away record he does. They don't make finals half the time with a better than 50%-win rate in finals. Getting players to buy into the 'work hardery for longery' ethos already makes him better than half the coaches in the league. He clearly inspires loyalty and buy in from the players, unfortunately he is very clearly not the tactician of the great coaches. Arguably you could get that from your assistants, the club obviously thought this was a possibility as it has brought in some high caliber assistants over the journey. It's getting to the point that he looks incapable of winning a flag which means he should go. But we're not guaranteed of getting a better coach and that's why I think the devil you know was a fair or at least defensible position WHEN the decisions were made. With the benefit of hindsight, you would say he was very lucky to have upswings at the right time, but I don't think you can fault the board for making the decisions they did at the time. The vitriol levelled at him is massively overblown. The deathriding and constant bashing of our players, board, coach, and everything in between is toxic as ****. At that point, if people hate everything about the club, why are they even here? It's sad and pathetic.

 

[EskimoPAFC]

In the 0-5 run we basically didn't have a defence. Aliir was injured in the 1st game of round 1 and didn't come good until halfway through the season. Clurey was unavailable until round 4 having missed large parts of last year through injury and was injured again late in the season. Mckenzie was injured in round 1, looked like he was done, and was played only because we had noone else until the club conceded that his knee was *ed. Skinner was terrible and got injured almost right away. We lost our ruckman for the entire season. Missed the 1st pick KPF for half the season and and even then he was clearly hampered. Our best small forward didn't play a minute all year. Our aging next best small forward was managed all year after an early injury. Duursma/ Bergman took more than half the season to get over injuries/ illness. Our first-round pick (which these days tend to get games in their 1st year) was available for selection about twice all year. Lachie Jones was periodically injured. Bonner was periodically injured. Rightly or wrongly, the 2nd choice Ruckman broke his collar bone. Our Ruck Forward played poo for the first 2-3 weeks as his recently pregnant wife's life was hanging in the balance. Our best player had a heart issue which kept him out of 2 games (in that 0-5 start) and had an unknown effect on him for the rest of the year. Our 2nd best player in boak, missed a couple games with covid and played several down games due to an injured hand. Miscellaneous players like Dan Houston and Marshall missed games due to covid.

Any suggestion injury played no part in our woes, especially with a long list of 1-2 goal losses, is frankly moronic.

Making excuses for yet another capitulation and trying to find any excuse with a set of injuries no different to any other team is beyond moronic.

 

[EskimoPAFC]

BuT We DiDnT hAvE a RuCkMaN!*

*apart from the fully fit ruckman we did have with a 5-2 record, the other ruckman we had and didn't play, the ruckman we traded for nothing at the end of last year and the ruckman that we like pretending is a forward

 

[EskimoPAFC]

The last 2 years Geelong has absolutely dropped away when 1-2 of Dangerfield, Selwood, Cameron, Hawkins were unavailable. They won with virtually a fully intact team.

Dropped away the last 2 years?

In 2021 Geelong finished top 4 and made a preliminary final.
In 2020 Geelong finished top 4 and made a grand final.

We had nowhere near that injury list and finished 11th. These things are not the same.

 

[Del165198]

If you don't want to sack Hinkley, stay out of the sack Hinkley thread. This thread is for sacking Hinkley.

 

[thundercloud]

If you don't want to sack Hinkley, stay out of the sack Hinkley thread. This thread is for sacking Hinkley.

The vitriol levelled at him is massively overblown. The deathriding and constant bashing of our players, board, coach, and everything in between is toxic as *. At that point, if people hate everything about the club, why are they even here? It's sad and pathetic.
fully support and endorse: sad, pathetic, unbalanced, neurotic, trumpist, labelling, online thugery

 

[philreich]

Chris Scott went to the players post their 2021 drubbing at the hands of Melb in the prelim and asked if they wanted him as their coach going forward. Ken Hinkley’s response was to go into hiding and reappear with a "we're looking forward" mantra 5 months later. One leads his side to a premiership. The other leads his team to the dizzying heights of 11th.

Only 5 rival clubs haven’t played in a grand final since our last appearance in 2007. Even competition power houses like St. Kilda and Adelaide have made it to the last Saturday in September since then!!!

 

[EskimoPAFC]

The vitriol levelled at him is massively overblown. The deathriding and constant bashing of our players, board, coach, and everything in between is toxic as *. At that point, if people hate everything about the club, why are they even here? It's sad and pathetic.
fully support and endorse: sad, pathetic, unbalanced, neurotic, trumpist, labelling, online thugery

Who is doing any of this? Love the club. Love the vast majority of our players. Love our AFLW coaching group. Love Josh Carr coming back.

Simply not going to stand for the spin about the current performance of our AFL coaching team and the deflection of their failures on to the players and fans.

 

[fpm84]

The last 2 years Geelong has absolutely dropped away when 1-2 of Dangerfield, Selwood, Cameron, Hawkins were unavailable. They won with virtually a fully intact team.

This season we missed Dangerfield for seven games (injured), Selwood for four (managed/rested) and Stewart for six (suspended/concussion).

Jack Henry missed eight games with a foot injury, Rohan missed half the season and Menegola (who should have been AA wingman in 2020) only played seven games due to injuries.

Every team has injuries and Port’s were no more significant than ours or other teams (plenty of stars around the comp such as Dusty, Fyfe, Grundy barely played this year but their teams still made finals).

Port drastically underachieved this season and blame should be pointed at your coach and the acceptance of failure that he seems to have instilled in his leaders (did Tom Jonas really say the team lost the fire in the belly this season?! That’s unforgivable).

 

[Lightning_Rod]

This season we missed Dangerfield for seven games (injured), Selwood for four (managed/rested) and Stewart for six (suspended/concussion).

Jack Henry missed eight games with a foot injury, Rohan missed half the season and Menegola (who should have been AA wingman in 2020) only played seven games due to injuries.

Every team has injuries and Port’s were no more significant than ours or other teams (plenty of stars around the comp such as Dusty, Fyfe, Grundy barely played this year but their teams still made finals).

Port drastically underachieved this season and blame should be pointed at your coach and the acceptance of failure that he seems to have instilled in his leaders (did Tom Jonas really say the team lost the fire in the belly this season?! That’s unforgivable).

Preaching to the converted here with that mate lol

 

[Miss December]

The vitriol levelled at him is massively overblown. The deathriding and constant bashing of our players, board, coach, and everything in between is toxic as *. At that point, if people hate everything about the club, why are they even here? It's sad and pathetic.
fully support and endorse: sad, pathetic, unbalanced, neurotic, trumpist, labelling, online thugery

So Donald Trump wants him sacked as well?....

 

[Schulzenfest]

The vitriol levelled at him is massively overblown. The deathriding and constant bashing of our players, board, coach, and everything in between is toxic as *. At that point, if people hate everything about the club, why are they even here? It's sad and pathetic.
fully support and endorse: sad, pathetic, unbalanced, neurotic, trumpist, labelling, online thugery

As you'll see from the membership thread, next year a lot of us won't be.

 

[EskimoPAFC]

So Donald Trump wants him sacked as well?....

 

[Jason K]

This season we missed Dangerfield for seven games (injured), Selwood for four (managed/rested) and Stewart for six (suspended/concussion).

Jack Henry missed eight games with a foot injury, Rohan missed half the season and Menegola (who should have been AA wingman in 2020) only played seven games due to injuries.

Every team has injuries and Port’s were no more significant than ours or other teams (plenty of stars around the comp such as Dusty, Fyfe, Grundy barely played this year but their teams still made finals).

Port drastically underachieved this season and blame should be pointed at your coach and the acceptance of failure that he seems to have instilled in his leaders (did Tom Jonas really say the team lost the fire in the belly this season?! That’s unforgivable).

It's almost like your coach planned contingencies around those injuries instead of using them as excuses.

Fancy this PrisonBars4life fella using Scott freakin Lycett as a reason for losing