Saints v Pies: The Aftermath

[wolfpup]

Sorry wolfpup, but this demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of our list (ie. you are unaware of who we have yet to debut etc). Twelve of the players we had out there last night have played less than 50 games (Saints had 14 and would have been 13 if Riewoldt played). Not going to argue with you about it on your board any further, but this statement is pretty silly.

If you said the same thing about Carlton, you'd be right.

Didnt think collingwood were playing finals this year or next, happy to be proved wrong of course.

 

[Cannavaro20]

Didnt think collingwood were playing finals this year or next, happy to be proved wrong of course.

Absolutely half of collingswoods list is young like ours and credit to them for putting the sword through us. I do feel however their experience is in its prime while ours is definitely on the decline.... e.g. cloke, pendles Brown vs. dempster, fisher and schneider. So dont think avg games played shows the full story. our forward line had noone like cloke and elliot. Etc...i see what buckley and co are trying to do with their list and i like it... a midfield of pendles, side, adams and greenwood looks v solid but i doubt they will be top 8. Hopefully they prove me right!

 

[VDS66]

When Lyon took over, there were a few players on the way out that featured prominently in the 04 / 05 / 06 era. But he still had a decent core of players from the early 2000's starting to peak. Now we have had to hit rock bottom due to our gap between the kids and seniors.

Not really sure where Collingwood is at. The big question for them as far as I can see is if Bucks can rebuild in time so that guys like Pendles, Swan and co are still at their peak and not past it. That they have figured prominently in the last 2 trade and draft periods suggest that they will. Losing a still young Beams was a major setback.

 

[TheLonieRanger]

you don't think the stick given him from his own fans hasn't damaged his mindset?

imagining lining up and seeing a pies fan on the big screen head in her hands not able to watch?

You can hear the audience audible groans when he misses, at that's just his first attempt.


Think it has messed him up, he's only human.

Saints fans bronxed Kosi and it never helped his confidence.

Credit to cloke, he keeps running to contests, keeps putting in effort.

I honestly felt sorry for him.

Just from general interviews and stuff I think kosi and paddy seem pretty different when it comes to mentality re footy

 

[Fruity Boots]

Absolutely gutted. 4 mins in I was a believer!

 

[holllywood]

The difference last night was that Pendlebury and Swan both dominated the games, lifting the whole team with them. Pendles is an elite player and Swan played an absolute blinder (wouldn't call him elite anymore though). It all started with these two.

Our senior aren't in the same league as these guys and as such, couldn't swing the momentum our way. Armo was huge as was Steven but were not able to lift the Saints as Pendles and Swan did the Pies.

Just on Schnieder, he was picked back up as a Rookie at the end of last year which should give an indication of what we had originally planned for him role wise this year. Yet injuries to experienced players in Roo, Montagna, Ray and Gilbert mean that we have to play him. Playing him isn't taking development away from a young player at all.

 

[Ricmel]

I thought we were pretty poor. Expected a loss but not by 70+ (and closer to 100 if you factor in Pies were 19 down at one stage).

Expect variable effort from a young team but Pies spread us to easily and when Saints did have numbers at the ball they seemed to get in the way of each other rather than support each other. i am not sure why the coaching team has them playing so tight. They fumble the short handballs and when the opposition break, the Saints players struggle to get out of their phone box. Hopefully it is a tactic designed to develop them - not a game plan for success.

Thought Steven, Armitage and Savage were good. Dunstan, Sinclair and Newnes OK. But Schneider a let down, the snap at goal reminiscent of the one he missed in the 09 Grand Final, I would kick it 8 times out of 10, he should be hitting that 10 out of 10. Will be more solid with Joey back in.

On McCarten, not sure he should have played but he did. Expect him to be nervous, expect a few fumbles - no problem with that. I do hope he has another gear there somewhere because he looked awfully slow.

Not sure a season of that sort of performance is going to be great for the Saints. I hope it was just a very off day.

 

[CALL ME SNAKE]

Dont see the point in trying to argue who had the most kids, who had more players out etc etc.
Collingwood finished 11th last yr, we finished stone motherless last .
When we played them last yr they smashed us, when we played them this yr they smashed us.
Unfortunately they are clearly better than us ATM and showed it fri night.

 

[GammaScorpii]

Hope Roo can get clear for Anzac day. Really need to win over in NZ already.

 

[Curious George]

PROS -
- our first 20min of the firsr qrt was great. We we put Collingwood under pressure and moved the ball fast into our 50, which helped our forwards.
- Armitage really stepped up. His game was great.
- Steven was great. He was everywhere, but really needs support.
- even when we kicked our 6 goals in the first qrt, we had a range of goal kickers.

CONS -
- after first qrt we were poor. Pressure droped off. Our run stopped. Our attack stopped. Our heads dropped.
- showed as the game went on is that we don't play on the MCG enough. We got tired.
- thought some umpiring desisons were very poor. They cost us goals when it matered. Was frustrating to eatch.
- saying that umpire Leigh Fisher shouldn't umpire another saints game. Conflict of interest.
- was a poor night for Bruce. To only have 2 kicks and 1 handball after last weeks game was disappointing.
- letting swan and pendlebury get so much of the ball hurt us a lot. We let them get space and they smashed us.

 

[Curious George]

• Armo And Bruce were pretty good
• Sinclair looks clean and has time to do the right thing
• Fisher was Fisher
• Savage dropped as the game went on
• McCartin is still a work in progress but there are positive signs
• Membery looks like a good pickup
• Longer was aggressive and good'
• Fitness in the last quarter still an issue

Bruce pretty good???
2 kicks & 1 handball in a game is poor. He did finish with 2 goals but could have had much more influence.

 

[mysainters]

- letting swan and pendlebury get so much of the ball hurt us a lot. We let them get space and they smashed us.

Why did they?

 

[Curious George]

Why did they?

In my opinon, match ups.
Once pendlebury was getting over weller, should have moved him to somebody else. Even if that was swan.
Swan had shenton going with him for parts. Swan is classes above shenton.
But at the end it shows how good of footballers they are.

 

[mysainters]

In my opinon, match ups.
Once pendlebury was getting over weller, should have moved him to somebody else. Even if that was swan.
Swan had shenton going with him for parts. Swan is classes above shenton.
But at the end it shows how good of footballers they are.

Completely agree, but why didn't Alan make any moves....I don't blame the players

 

[Curious George]

Love how some are drilling Schneider.
His been pretty good in the 2 games his played. 22 disposals with 2 goals against gws and 28 against Collingwood.
Him playing as well is helping the development of the guys his mentoring in Lonie and Sinclair.
He is in our current best 22 if you like it or not. He deseves his place.

Its most likely his last year, saying that his been a great player for our club. Think he deserves some respect.

 

[Curious George]

Completely agree, but why didn't Alan make any moves....I don't blame the players

Sometimes i do think that they leave them on a player to learn from the best. Weller getting beaten will hopefully drive him to be at a higher level.
Wouldnt have liked to see more support for him and shenton though.

 

[mysainters]

Sometimes i do think that they leave them on a player to learn from the best. Weller getting beaten will hopefully drive him to be at a higher level.
Wouldnt have liked to see more support for him and shenton though.

a quarter of education is enough IMHO

winning the best education.

 

[gringo2011]

I had a bit of a hissy fit on SS when a guy called Tony 74 who seems to be an insider and seems to claim to be very inner sanctum said we were concentrating on the Carlton game. I suggested it sounded like tanking and had a bit of a melt down. Anyway he is hopefully right now as I need to hope we had our foot off the pedal. He suggested we might be setting realistic goals of which ones we are likely to pick off and go extra hard at those.

 

[Moral Decay]

Why did they?

I don't have the answer to that question, but I have been asking myself a variation of it a lot.
It doesn't matter how I ask it the answer is that our midfield isn't good enough or deep enough. When it works we look great we play attractive attacking even breathtaking, when our skills, fitness, endeavour, tactics, ability to run both ways etc. let us down we get carved up and seem to have no plan b.

We drool a lot on the potential of our young 'uns and defend the output of our elder "leaders", but is the truth too simple to contemplate? Our mids just aren't good enough. And I get it that we're a developing group and we need to hang tough but when we lose we get smashed in the middle.

How many of our older group would get a game at a top 8 team? The only one I'm sure of is Jack Stevens.
How many of our kids would get a game at the Bullies or GWS? I don't even want to think about it.

Maybe an answer that we don't want to contemplate is that we need to play our best centre bounce tap ruckman every game regardless of who he is and regardless of how he plays on the rest of the ground, if it's Holmes then play him.

 

[crasha301]

I don't have the answer to that question, but I have been asking myself a variation of it a lot.
It doesn't matter how I ask it the answer is that our midfield isn't good enough or deep enough. When it works we look great we play attractive attacking even breathtaking, when our skills, fitness, endeavour, tactics, ability to run both ways etc. let us down we get carved up and seem to have no plan b.

We drool a lot on the potential of our young 'uns and defend the output of our elder "leaders", but is the truth too simple to contemplate? Our mids just aren't good enough. And I get it that we're a developing group and we need to hang tough but when we lose we get smashed in the middle.

How many of our older group would get a game at a top 8 team? The only one I'm sure of is Jack Stevens.
How many of our kids would get a game at the Bullies or GWS? I don't even want to think about it.

Maybe an answer that we don't want to contemplate is that we need to play our best centre bounce tap ruckman every game regardless of who he is and regardless of how he plays on the rest of the ground, if it's Holmes then play him.

Steven armo dunstan would all get gigs in a top 8 teams mid.

Billings & dunstan would both play in the doggies and gws!

 

[Moral Decay]

Steven armo dunstan would all get gigs in a top 8 teams mid.

Billings & dunstan would both play in the doggies and gws!

I'd like to think so but we keep getting pumped and it starts in the middle, they just aren't that good. Time to get first hands on the ball and give them the best chance, play Holmes and if they still aren't that good.........

 

[blktreacle]

Any word on how Lonie is? That knee looked like a 12 mother to me

 

[Big Mart]

Curios George
Great post

Unfortunately Joffaboy says he's useless... So out he goes for a less able kid

 

[mysainters]

Any word on how Lonie is? That knee looked like a 12 mother to me

Says he's fine, cleared of damage and free to play round 4.

 

[mysainters]

I don't have the answer to that question, but I have been asking myself a variation of it a lot.
It doesn't matter how I ask it the answer is that our midfield isn't good enough or deep enough. When it works we look great we play attractive attacking even breathtaking, when our skills, fitness, endeavour, tactics, ability to run both ways etc. let us down we get carved up and seem to have no plan b.

We drool a lot on the potential of our young 'uns and defend the output of our elder "leaders", but is the truth too simple to contemplate? Our mids just aren't good enough. And I get it that we're a developing group and we need to hang tough but when we lose we get smashed in the middle.

How many of our older group would get a game at a top 8 team? The only one I'm sure of is Jack Stevens.
How many of our kids would get a game at the Bullies or GWS? I don't even want to think about it.

Maybe an answer that we don't want to contemplate is that we need to play our best centre bounce tap ruckman every game regardless of who he is and regardless of how he plays on the rest of the ground, if it's Holmes then play him.

Robbie Williams and Kylie Minogue said it best...