The Review

[Elite Crow]

People were complaining that it was sham because it was only going to take two weeks. Now it's going too long? Far out!

Another classic Jenny misrepresentation of what actually was posted. Why do you do it?

 

[hey shorty]

Huge difference between a 2 week sham review, and going so long that you miss the key dates to have an operational football department. Like I said I’m happy it appears to be thorough, but also I think we are allowed to be more then a little concerned that absolutely no action has been executed on the eve of the trade period.

I mean what’s our sales pitch right now?

“Hey come to the Crows, we have no coach, our entire football department is under review and everyone you meet with may well be fired before you sign your contract”

I have to say, I’ve heard better!

I'd say players and managers will be given a little snippet as to what's going on within the review.

As I said, clubs have been in this position before. It's not ideal but you can sell the idea of change quite easily.

 

[mattymac]

People were complaining that it was sham because it was only going to take two weeks. Now it's going too long? Far out!

People were complaining it was a sham because of it's timing - i.e. being a post-season afterthought rather than running during the season to review football operations while they were actually operating.

If you're not recording direct evidence in that way, which would clearly take time to accumulate an adequate sample size of games, and all you are doing is interviewing people for their thoughts, it shouldn't take long.

 

[GrommoT]

Yes I think this has been the plan for quite some time. On the crow cat they reported at about round 17 or earlier that they had intel’s that the club was deliberately low balling guys like Keath and Greenwood and that decisions had been taken to rebuild with a number of players to leave.
It is easy to feel anxious with no coach, review not finalised and trade week looming - but the more I think about it, it does feel we are continuing on a course which the club had deliberately begun before the sh#t had hit the proverbial fans.
And I haven’t heard of one move yet that will harm the club in the long term.
The club has been criticised rightly but I think this medium rebuild strategy has been the right call.
I also think the timing is good. I have a fair bit of hope in the talents of our last drafting/ trading periods. Sholl, Stengle, Butts, McHenry, Jones and even McAdam look good. Davis and Galucci have some promise too. Fog a future star. ROB has a good future ahead.
Edit- Hammill also looking good.

Crow cat? Is that some kind of deep fried food?

Would have been interesting if Keath or Greenie accepted the 2 year deals we supposedly offered.

I have a theory we gave game time to the players who we hoped to be able to trade out to demonstrate their worth and shop them to other clubs.

 

[Jarman3]

Huge difference between a 2 week sham review, and going so long that you miss the key dates to have an operational football department. Like I said I’m happy it appears to be thorough, but also I think we are allowed to be more then a little concerned that absolutely no action has been executed on the eve of the trade period.

I mean what’s our sales pitch right now?

“Hey come to the Crows, we have no coach, our entire football department is under review and everyone you meet with may well be fired before you sign your contract”

I have to say, I’ve heard better!

To be honest, I think we're probably a more enticing prospect now than we were a year ago. And MUCH more enticing than we were a month or two back. The fact that there is a significant clean-out of the playing list underway, new coach incoming (presumably with new assistants), likely to be significant off-field change in the football department - these things are all positive. Prior to this we were just a basket case. We might still be a basket case now, but there is at least the real possibility of a change in our trajectory.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

So will Burton be with the Crows delegation on Monday ? ....did he play any part last night ?

Sydney Swans

We will join all clubs from across the competition in Melbourne on Monday as talks get underway for the 2019 AFL Trade Period.

 

[DJ75]

So will Burton be with the Crows delegation on Monday ? ....did he play any part last night ?

https://twitter.com/sydneyswans

That will be very interesting. If he's not we might be going over with the smallest number of staff. Reid, Ogilvie, statsman and that might be it!

 

[mattymac]

To be honest, I think we're probably a more enticing prospect now than we were a year ago. And MUCH more enticing than we were a month or two back. The fact that there is a significant clean-out of the playing list underway, new coach incoming (presumably with new assistants), likely to be significant off-field change in the football department - these things are all positive. Prior to this we were just a basket case. We might still be a basket case now, but there is at least the real possibility of a change in our trajectory.

To us, yes, but from the outside we probably look like we're in chaos.

 

[Betts are off]

To be honest, I think we're probably a more enticing prospect now than we were a year ago. And MUCH more enticing than we were a month or two back. The fact that there is a significant clean-out of the playing list underway, new coach incoming (presumably with new assistants), likely to be significant off-field change in the football department - these things are all positive. Prior to this we were just a basket case. We might still be a basket case now, but there is at least the real possibility of a change in our trajectory.

Possible, but let me ask you something based on that theory. How many Long term employment contracts have you signed based on a possibility of a change of trajectory?

 

[hey shorty]

To us, yes, but from the outside we probably look like we're in chaos.

That's why if I was a player coming in I'd want some more information

 

[Mileratkinsshow]

Crow cat? Is that some kind of deep fried food?

Would have been interesting if Keath or Greenie accepted the 2 year deals we supposedly offered.

I have a theory we gave game time to the players who we hoped to be able to trade out to demonstrate their worth and shop them to other clubs.

No surprised your ears pricked up at “crow cat” given your avatar!


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Jarman3]

Possible, but let me ask you something based on that theory. How many Long term employment contracts have you signed based on a possibility of a change of trajectory?

Is there such a thing as long term employment these days?

But seriously - if I was unhappy in my current job and had the opportunity to go somewhere that might not have that great a reputation but was clearly trying to improve? I would at least look into it.

The only person we're trying to lure at the moment is a coach. There aren't so many AFL senior coach positions going around that prospective candidates can really pick and choose a lot unless they're a Clarkson type with a record of proven success. And with the cleanout underway at the club, if I was a potential candidate, I'd see that as the possibility of starting with a clean slate and being able to put my own stamp on the club.

Other than that, I don't see us bringing in any significant players by way of trade. Maybe a few fringe players to meet specific needs (eg Frampton to provide ruck backup with Jacobs and possibly Jenkins leaving), but other than that I'd be expecting us to take as many picks to the draft as we can get our hands on. And those guys don't get a choice

 

[Scrogdogg]

To be honest, I think we're probably a more enticing prospect now than we were a year ago. And MUCH more enticing than we were a month or two back. The fact that there is a significant clean-out of the playing list underway, new coach incoming (presumably with new assistants), likely to be significant off-field change in the football department - these things are all positive. Prior to this we were just a basket case. We might still be a basket case now, but there is at least the real possibility of a change in our trajectory.

I'm sorry but I just can't go past the extension for Mackay. If it is a significant clean out of the playing list and a new coach incoming, why has he been renewed at this time. Is it as simple as just making him safe ? When I look at the people we have traded away and then consider the reverse situation with Mackay, mid review, I suffer from shortness of breath. But maybe the new coach has ticked his box. And if that is so I despair further.

 

[cleanhands]

I'm sorry but I just can't go past the extension for Mackay. If it is a significant clean out of the playing list and a new coach incoming, why has he been renewed at this time. Is it as simple as just making him safe ? When I look at the people we have traded away and then consider the reverse situation with Mackay, mid review, I suffer from shortness of breath. But maybe the new coach has ticked his box. And if that is so I despair further.

Try a fibulator it works for me

 

[Thetrader15]

That will be very interesting. If he's not we might be going over with the smallest number of staff. Reid, Ogilvie, statsman and that might be it!

Just send Haggis - he's the only bloke I trust

 

[Wood_Duck]

I can see the writing on the wall here. They are going to blame Phil again.

 

[Vader]

Huge difference between a 2 week sham review, and going so long that you miss the key dates to have an operational football department. Like I said I’m happy it appears to be thorough, but also I think we are allowed to be more then a little concerned that absolutely no action has been executed on the eve of the trade period.

I mean what’s our sales pitch right now?

“Hey come to the Crows, we have no coach, our entire football department is under review and everyone you meet with may well be fired before you sign your contract”

I have to say, I’ve heard better!

The Review takes as long as it takes. I would much rather see it done properly giving us a solid direction forwards, rather than rushing it and achieving nothing as a result.

Ideally, the Review should have started during the mid-season break, and lasted for 2 months (double the time the Review is actually taking). Unfortunately, Chapman had to be dragged kicking and screaming to the realisation that it was required, with the result that it didn't start until after our season had concluded.

The impact on our "sales pitch" is disappointing, but it's far more important that we get things right, correctly identify the problems (and the source of those problems), and put the required changes into action.

 

[Betts are off]

The Review takes as long as it takes. I would much rather see it done properly giving us a solid direction forwards, rather than rushing it and achieving nothing as a result.

Ideally, the Review should have started during the mid-season break, and lasted for 2 months (double the time the Review is actually taking). Unfortunately, Chapman had to be dragged kicking and screaming to the realisation that it was required, with the result that it didn't start until after our season had concluded.

The impact on our "sales pitch" is disappointing, but it's far more important that we get things right, correctly identify the problems (and the source of those problems), and put the required changes into action.

You’re making a lot of sense today Vadar!

Hard to argue with any of that

 

[Legz]

I'm sorry but I just can't go past the extension for Mackay. If it is a significant clean out of the playing list and a new coach incoming, why has he been renewed at this time. Is it as simple as just making him safe ? When I look at the people we have traded away and then consider the reverse situation with Mackay, mid review, I suffer from shortness of breath. But maybe the new coach has ticked his box. And if that is so I despair further.

My thinking is that he got the extension due to a trigger in his last contract if he makes top 10 in BnF, which would make sense on why that goes against the grain for all the other 30+ guys, and wouldn't need the new coach to sign off on.

 

[ManInTheArena]

Of course it is. But what gives you the right to demand empirical evidence to support other poster’s views on the coaching group when you can have a crack at management when the only empirical evidence suggests the opposite, ie real financial performance. Your high headedness reminds me of our board. You can have a crack at everyone else, but you’re right when you have a crack at the only perceivable performing department of the club. You may be brilliant in many ways, but you’re also a massive hypocrite.

It's not hypocritical if you understood what my assertion is (and isn't).

I haven't pinpointed individual managers and made things up about them with no proof whatsoever, I've just suggested that if the football department is getting reviewed, so should management, otherwise we're not really reviewing the whole club. I don't see management's role as financial and the football department's as football. I've never seen an organisation where operations are a law unto themselves with no input or influence from management.

Look, all I did is pose a question and people are losing their shit about it; does anyone have any evidence of the personalisation of the problems at the AFC? then I held them to a standard of evidence that would be required for anything even remotely logical in a scientific or formal sense. If Burton, Camporale, Hart et al. all get sacked next week then, shit, I'll be the first to say everyone's theories had merit. That's what critical thought and challenging your own assumptions is about. If they don't (get sacked) though, there are three possibilities that I can think of; 1) The review panel were not good, 2) the AFC did not act on the recommendations, or 3) the haters on here are completely delusional. Will you consider all three are plausible?

BTW I don't think I'm brilliant in many ways. People who think that about themselves end up the opposite of brilliant very quickly.

 

[Rotayjay]

Let's face it, we're not contending for a flag any time soon and next year will be a rebuilding year. If no players want to come here in the trade period because the review is still underway, so be it. Meaningfully changing this club is going to take more than a few months.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Let's face it, we're not contending for a flag any time soon and next year will be a rebuilding year. If no players want to come here in the trade period because the review is still underway, so be it. Meaningfully changing this club is going to take more than a few months.

Given the relative strengths of the next two drafts, one would think that this is a time when you want to be active in trade periods- targeting players with upside.

I don't think being unable to properly participate because we are currently a club devoid of any direction is unimportant.

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

We haven't played in over six weeks

Nobody sacked yet.

The review has had plenty of time.

Nobody sacked yet which means they think nothing is wrong and everything is about appeasing disgruntled members

 

[Cap]

We haven't played in over six weeks

Nobody sacked yet.

The review has had plenty of time.

Nobody sacked yet which means they think nothing is wrong and everything is about appeasing disgruntled members

Your leaps in logic are breath taking.

 

[Morning_Fog]

Whatever the findings, will the actually release anything this time?

I wonder if the club will tell the members what the outcome of the review was and how they will fix anything broken, or will they just hope no one noticed time has moved on and no say anything.

I’m expecting a very wordy corporate written response by Fagan to be e-mailed out as part of their findings and leftat that.